G_AHRENDT@VAXA.CC.UWA.OZ.AU (Gunter Ahrendt) (07/28/90)
From: G_AHRENDT@VAXA.CC.UWA.OZ.AU (Gunter Ahrendt) Here is what i've been able to assemble to try and complete the USAF F- series listing. MD FH-1 Phantom MD F-2H Banshee MD F-3H Demon MD F-4S Phantom Northrop F-5G Tiger 2 Grumman F-6F Hellcat Chance Vought F7U Cutlass Vought F-8F Bearcat Grumman F-9F Panther ? Northrop F-11 Super Tiger Lockheed F-12 Boeing F-13A Superfortress Grumman F-14D Tomcat MD F-15 Eagle General Dynamics F-16 Falcon Northrop YF-17 Cobra MD F-18 Hornet Lockheed F-19A Aurora Northrop F-20 Tigershark ? Lockheed YF-22 Northrop YF-23 ? . . . F-27 F-80 Shooting Star Republic F-84D-1 Thunderjet McDonnell XF-85 Goblin North American F-86D Sabre F-89D Convair XF-92A North American F-100D Super Sabre F-101 Voodoo Convair F-102 Delta Dagger F-103 Lockheed F-104G Starfighter Republic F-105 Thunderchief F-106 F-107 F-108 Garrett F-109 MD F-110 Phantom General Dynamics F-111C Lockheed F-117A Nighthawk
lang@hpfcso.fc.hp.com (John J. Lang) (07/31/90)
From: John J. Lang <lang@hpfcso.fc.hp.com> > Here is what i've been able to assemble to try and complete the USAF F- series > listing. > Grumman F-6F Hellcat > Vought F-8F Bearcat > Grumman F-9F Panther > Grumman F-14D Tomcat > MD F-18 Hornet I don't know if this concerns you, but the Hellcat, Bearcat, etc. are Navy Planes. If you want to list all US planes (Air Force or otherwise) you should also include the F-4U Wildcat. You should also realize that the number system for the Navy and Air Force (and Army Air Corps) were originally different. The Air Force numbered it's planes consecutively, the Navy numbered them consecutively by the contractor. Thus the F-6F was the 6th plane built by Grumman for the Navy. I think the F-4 was the first plane that had a common designation from both the Air Force and Navy. If you really wish to have a list of the USAF planes in series you should start with the P planes (P38, P39, ...). The F86 Saber was first designated the P86, and then the Air Force changed from P designation to F (as the Navy had always done). John Lang lang@hpfccrl.fc.hp.com Sources: Most if this is from memory. The format for the WWII Navy number scheme was told to my by my father, who was a Navy pilot. The 'name' change for the Saber I heard on the Wings series, and could have been P84 to F84.
thornley@uunet.UU.NET (David H. Thornley) (08/01/90)
From: plains!umn-cs!LOCAL!thornley@uunet.UU.NET (David H. Thornley) In article <1990Jul31.023112.20171@cbnews.att.com> lang@hpfcso.fc.hp.com (John J. Lang) writes: > > >From: John J. Lang <lang@hpfcso.fc.hp.com> >> Here is what i've been able to assemble to try and complete the USAF F- series >> listing. > >> Grumman F-6F Hellcat >> Vought F-8F Bearcat >> Grumman F-9F Panther >> Grumman F-14D Tomcat >> MD F-18 Hornet > >I don't know if this concerns you, but the Hellcat, Bearcat, etc. are >Navy Planes. If you want to list all US planes (Air Force or otherwise) >you should also include the F-4U Wildcat. The F-14 and F-18 designations above are correct. The other designations are misstated from the original, and do not in fact belong in the F- series. The old Navy format was, basically, (type)(number)(manufacturer) - (number), where the first number is the general model number and the second is the modification number. The fighter designation was F, allowing confusion with later times. Therefore, the F6F (*no* hyphen there), F8F, and F9F were, respectively, the sixth, eighth, and ninth basic fighter designs that Grumman (second F) supplied to the Navy. If the number between the letters was 1 it was omitted; therefore, the FF was the first fighter design Grumman did for the navy. The Wildcat was in fact the F4F, and the F4U was the Corsair. One quirk with this system was that the same plane might have more than one designation. For example, the Avenger torpedo bomber by Grumman was the TBF, except when it was made by some other company (I can't remember the name - General Motors????) when it was the TBM. The Wildcat was the F4F when made by Grumman, and when production went elsewhere (same place as the Avenger, I think) it became (I think, doing this from memory) the FM. In contrast, a Mustang was a P-51 regardless of whether North American made it or not. I don't think we lost anything in the change to the modern system. [mod.note: Correct. The TBM and FM were both produced by GM. - Bill ] David H. Thornley
geoffm@EBay.Sun.COM (Geoff Miller) (08/05/90)
From: geoffm@EBay.Sun.COM (Geoff Miller) In article <1990Jul31.023112.20171@cbnews.att.com> lang@hpfcso.fc.hp.com (John J. Lang) writes: >I don't know if this concerns you, but the Hellcat, Bearcat, etc. are >Navy Planes. If you want to list all US planes (Air Force or otherwise) >you should also include the F-4U Wildcat. The F4U (no hyphen) was the Chance Vought Corsair; the Grumman Wildcat's designation was F4F. ("U" for Chance Vought, "F" for Grumman under the old Navy system.) Geoff -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+- Geoff Miller + + + + + + + + Sun Microsystems geoffm@purplehaze.sun.com + + + + + + + + Milpitas, California -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-
fiddler@concertina.Eng.Sun.COM (Steve Hix) (08/07/90)
From: fiddler@concertina.Eng.Sun.COM (Steve Hix) > From: John J. Lang <lang@hpfcso.fc.hp.com> > > Here is what i've been able to assemble to try and complete the USAF F- series > > listing. > > > Grumman F-6F Hellcat > > Vought F-8F Bearcat > > Grumman F-9F Panther > > Grumman F-14D Tomcat > > MD F-18 Hornet > > I don't know if this concerns you, but the Hellcat, Bearcat, etc. are > Navy Planes. If you want to list all US planes (Air Force or otherwise) > you should also include the F-4U Wildcat. Which one? The Grumman F4F Wildcat or Chance-Vought F4U Corsair? (To make things even more confusing, the Navy had different numbers for identical aircraft made by different subcontractors. Like F4F Wildcat from Grumman and FM2 for the same aircraft made by General Motors. Hmmm. It's even worse, since they didn't follow the <letter><number><letter> convention all the time.) We'll ignore the Wilcats flown by the Royal Navy (Martlets?), since they just muddy up the water. ------------ The only drawback with morning is that it comes at such an inconvenient time of day. ------------
pstinson@pbs.org (08/10/90)
From: pstinson@pbs.org In article <1990Aug7.040901.6955@cbnews.att.com>, fiddler@concertina.Eng.Sun.COM (Steve Hix) writes: > From: fiddler@concertina.Eng.Sun.COM (Steve Hix) > > Which one? The Grumman F4F Wildcat or Chance-Vought F4U Corsair? > (To make things even more confusing, the Navy had different numbers for > identical aircraft made by different subcontractors. Like F4F Wildcat > from Grumman and FM2 for the same aircraft made by General Motors. Hmmm. > It's even worse, since they didn't follow the <letter><number><letter> > convention all the time.) > In the navy aircraft designation system before 1962, Letters were used for type of aircraft and for manufacturer code. The number between the letters referred to how many of that type of aircraft had been built for the Navy by that manufacturer. In the example above the first F stood for Fighter. The second F was the BuAer code letter for Grumman, U was for Vought-Sikorsky (later Chance-Vought). The Wildcat was the fourth fighter built by Grumman and the Corsair just happened to be the fourth built by that company. The General Motors version of the Wildcat was the first (1 was omitted) fighter project for the Navy from that Company. The final number, as in FM-2 referred to model variations. There was an FM-1 for example which was improved to become FM-2. To further illustrate, the OS2U Kingfisher meant the second Observation/Scout aircraft built by Vought-Sikorsky. Various models included the OS2U-1 ; -2 and -3. Unless you know the system well, it can indeed be confusing, particularly since the manufacturer assigned code letters sometimes changed over time.