phil@zorch.SF-Bay.ORG (Phil Gustafson) (08/23/90)
From: phil@zorch.SF-Bay.ORG (Phil Gustafson) In article <1990Aug18.182728.24742@cbnews.att.com> shafer@skipper.dfrf.nasa.gov (Mary Shafer) writes: >Everyone talks about the F-104 in the past tense, but we're still >flying two of them in research projects. Don't say the F-104 _had_, >say it _has_ or you'll make me nervous. :-) They're also still being >flown by a number of foreign air forces. > A decade or so ago, a civilian in (naturally) Southern California had managed to get hold of a flyable F-104. (This is difficult -- the services go to considerable effort to see that combat aircraft being scrapped will never fly again. The old fighter in your playground with kids crawling over it most likely has a big chunk cut out of its main strut.) Last I heard, he was was using it at airshows and attempts at low-level speed records. Anyone seen him lately? -- | phil@zorch.SF-Bay.ORG | Phil Gustafson | (ames|pyramid|vsi1)!zorch!phil | UNIX/Graphics Consultant | | 1550 Martin Ave., San Jose CA 95126 | | 408/286-1749
ntaib@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Nur Iskandar Taib) (08/28/90)
From: ntaib@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Nur Iskandar Taib)
In article <1990Aug23.014401.1193@cbnews.att.com> phil@zorch.SF-Bay.ORG (Phil Gustafson) writes:
#A decade or so ago, a civilian in (naturally) Southern California had
#managed to get hold of a flyable F-104. (This is difficult -- the
#services go to considerable effort to see that combat aircraft being
#scrapped will never fly again. The old fighter in your playground with
#kids crawling over it most likely has a big chunk cut out of its main
#strut.)
#Last I heard, he was was using it at airshows and attempts at low-level
#speed records. Anyone seen him lately?
If this was the one with the red and yellow color scheme,
its gone. He flamed out and had to resort to the ejection
seat everyone's been talking about. Fortunately for him,
it worked.
By the way, I'm still wanting to know whether the F104 was
any kind of a dogfighter. The wing area was kind of small,
but it was touted as a "lightweight fighter". Could it turn
with other fighters?henry@zoo.toronto.edu (Henry Spencer) (08/28/90)
From: henry@zoo.toronto.edu (Henry Spencer) >From: phil@zorch.SF-Bay.ORG (Phil Gustafson) >A decade or so ago, a civilian in (naturally) Southern California had >managed to get hold of a flyable F-104... >Last I heard, he was was using it at airshows and attempts at low-level >speed records. Anyone seen him lately? This is *probably* Darryl Greenamyer. It's somewhat of an exaggeration to say that he got hold of a flyable F-104; he *built* a flyable F-104, using his background as a Lockheed engineer and a lot of help, out of a whole lot of pieces from military surplus. Performance was pretty impressive, rather better than a stock F-104, as he made improvements along the way. He holds one of the low-level speed records, set on his last test flight. What he *really* wanted was the absolute altitude record. Unfortunately, at the end of said last test flight, he had a landing-gear problem and ended up having to eject, leaving the F-104 to crash (in the desert near Edwards). Henry Spencer at U of Toronto Zoology henry@zoo.toronto.edu utzoo!henry
fiddler%concertina@Sun.COM (Steve Hix) (08/29/90)
From: fiddler%concertina@Sun.COM (Steve Hix) In article <1990Aug23.014401.1193@cbnews.att.com>, phil@zorch.SF-Bay.ORG (Phil Gustafson) writes: > > > From: phil@zorch.SF-Bay.ORG (Phil Gustafson) > In article <1990Aug18.182728.24742@cbnews.att.com> shafer@skipper.dfrf.nasa.gov (Mary Shafer) writes: > >Everyone talks about the F-104 in the past tense, but we're still > >flying two of them in research projects. Don't say the F-104 _had_, > >say it _has_ or you'll make me nervous. :-) They're also still being > >flown by a number of foreign air forces. > > > A decade or so ago, a civilian in (naturally) Southern California had > managed to get hold of a flyable F-104. That would have been Darryl Greenamyer. He was, at one time, a test pilot for Lockheed, or so I've heard. He (a team of people, actually) didn't "find a flyable F-104" though, they built one flying one out of several non-flying ones. I believe that he had some support from ex-Lockheed people. Quite a few of them had strong feelings about the Starfighter. As in it could go a good deal faster than the official record for the type. And it could... it has enough thrust to do something over 1800mph or so. It's limited by engine inlet temperature though. > (This is difficult -- the > services go to considerable effort to see that combat aircraft being > scrapped will never fly again. The old fighter in your playground with > kids crawling over it most likely has a big chunk cut out of its main > strut.) Appently they couldn't agree on which piece to trash, or Greenamyer and Co. couldn't have built a flying version. :} > Last I heard, he was was using it at airshows and attempts at low-level > speed records. Anyone seen him lately? He set some new records. The F-104 was eventually retired from the business. Don't know where it is now. Darryl was flying Unlimited racers last I heard. He also set the absolute speed record for prop-driven aircraft some years back. In this case, a modified Grumman F8F Bearcat. Took the old 469+ mph record set by the Germans in 1939 to something around 483 or so. He likes to go fast. ------------ The only drawback with morning is that it comes at such an inconvenient time of day. ------------
parmentier@iowasp.physics.uiowa.edu (08/29/90)
From: parmentier@iowasp.physics.uiowa.edu In article <1990Aug23.014401.1193@cbnews.att.com>, phil@zorch.SF-Bay.ORG (Phil Gustafson) writes: > A decade or so ago, a civilian in (naturally) Southern California had > managed to get hold of a flyable F-104. (This is difficult -- the > > Last I heard, he was was using it at airshows and attempts at low-level > speed records. Anyone seen him lately? I don't have a source to quote, but I seem to remember hearing about 5 or 6 years ago that that gent had crashed his F-104 w/o being able to eject. I also seem to remember that he had owned the jet but not the engine, and had to borrow an engine from the USAF to fly it. Anyone know when/if the Italians stopped manufacturing F-104s? I know they were making them in a plant over ther long after the US stopped prduction. ___ Gregg Parmentier ____ parmentier@iowasp.physics.uiowa.edu ___ "There was a voice somewhere, an angry child's voice stringing obscenities together in an endless, meaningless chain; when she realized who it was, she stopped doing it." William Gibson (MLO)
shafer@skipper.dfrf.nasa.gov (Mary Shafer) (10/15/90)
From: Mary Shafer <shafer@skipper.dfrf.nasa.gov> Paul Tomblin (cognos!geovision!pt@dciem) writes: >ntaib@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Nur Iskandar Taib) writes: >>In article <1990Aug23.014401.1193@cbnews.att.com> phil@zorch.SF-Bay.ORG (Phil Gustafson) writes: >>#A decade or so ago, a civilian in (naturally) Southern California had >>#managed to get hold of a flyable F-104. (This is difficult -- the >>#services go to considerable effort to see that combat aircraft being >>#scrapped will never fly again. The old fighter in your playground with >>#kids crawling over it most likely has a big chunk cut out of its main >>#strut.) This is Darryl Greenameyer. The airframe that he got was the loads test article. Lockheed was selling it for scrap. It didn't have the longerons cut because it was never an airplane, just an airframe. He did some super-serious scrounging and had to make a lot of parts that he couldn't find elsewhere, but he did turn it into a real airplane. The engine was the hardest part. >>If this was the one with the red and yellow color scheme, >>its gone. He flamed out and had to resort to the ejection >>seat everyone's been talking about. Fortunately for him, >>it worked. No, on 27 Feb 78 he was doing touch-and-goes at Mojave and got a gear light (that some of the gear was not down and locked.) He came over to Edwards AFB and tried a soft touchdown. The left main collapsed, so he went out over the PIRA (bombing range) and, at 10,000 ft, ejected. This was a classical ejection, right in the envelope. He wasn't injured but the plane was, of course, destroyed. He was either low on fuel or had dumped most of it, though, because there wasn't much of a fire. >It's quite possible that it was a CF-104 from the Royal Canadian Air Force >(Canadian Armed Forces). Our government is not so leary about selling its >old fighters as they are in the U.S. Some aircraft companies in the U.S use >Canadian fighters. For instance, I seem to remember seeing pictures of a >CF-86 Canadair Sabre flying chase on the drop test of the Shuttle. Not likely. Only NASA planes flew chase on the ALT tests, which were conducted here at Dryden, and we certainly didn't use any F-86s. I recall that the chase planes were JSC and Dryden T-38s, although one of our (Dryden's) F-104s might have been used. You may be thinking of the CF-86 that belongs to a museum in Texas and is flown by NASA Astronaut Hoot Gibson (JSC) and NASA Test Pilot Ed Schneider (Dryden). This same museum also has a (two-seat) TF-104, a MiG-15, and a MiG-21. They also have an A-4, which won a prize at Oshkosh in 89. Their TF-104 came from Norway. -- Mary Shafer shafer@skipper.dfrf.nasa.gov ames!skipper.dfrf.nasa.gov!shafer NASA Ames Dryden Flight Research Facility, Edwards, CA Of course I don't speak for NASA "A MiG at your six is better than no MiG at all"--Unknown US fighter pilot