dnwiebe@cis.ohio-state.edu (Dan N Wiebe) (02/08/91)
From: dnwiebe@cis.ohio-state.edu (Dan N Wiebe) I recently purchased Accolade's Strike Aces attack-aircraft simulator for the PC. One of the weapons available for use is the British (I think) ALARM, which is expanded as Advanced Loitering Anti-Radiation Missile. (But then, they expand HARM as Homing (rather than High-speed) Anti-Radiation Missile, so take it with a grain of salt.) This missile is described to work as follows: the pilot of the strike aircraft fires the missile in no particular direction. The first stage of the two-stage solid-fuel rocket motor ignites and propels the missile straight up to some ungodly height (100,000ft?) and drops off. The rest of the missile then pops a parachute and hangs nose-down, drifting slowly down over the target area and listening for hostile radar emissions. When it hears one, it cuts the chute loose, lights up its second stage, and homes in for the kill. Does this weapon exist? If so, does anyone know its alphanumeric designation? I can think of several problems with the feasibility of a concept like this, and if the weapon does exist I'd be interested to know how the problems are overcome. How, for example, would the missile tell a friendly radar from a hostile one? How would it tell a mobile (aircraft) radar from a fixed one? (By the time it gets down from 100Kft, even with rocket assist, it seems to me like an aircraft radar might be out of the area; even if it wasn't, it might be turned off, leaving the missile with nothing to home on (location memorization wouldn't work).) If five missiles were launched for five radars, how would you keep several from homing in on the same unit? Also, aircraft flying at low altitude are generally under some fairly strict time constraints to accomplish their mission, and the ALARM must take some appreciable time to get up to 100Kft and back down again, even if it finds a target immediately. Seems it would be more economical to eliminate the missile's first stage and drop it instead from a high-altitude aircraft (out of SAM and AAA range) some minutes before a low- level strike by other aircraft. Shalom, Dan Wiebe dnw@rsch.oclc.org
henry@zoo.toronto.edu (Henry Spencer) (02/09/91)
From: henry@zoo.toronto.edu (Henry Spencer) >From: dnwiebe@cis.ohio-state.edu (Dan N Wiebe) > Does this weapon exist? If so, does anyone know its alphanumeric >designation?... Alarm exists and is reportedly in use in the Gulf. It has no numeric designation that I'm aware of; the British military is not as obsessed with numbers as the US is, and tends to give things names instead. > How, for example, would the missile tell a friendly radar from a >hostile one? How would it tell a mobile (aircraft) radar from a fixed >one? ... The general answer to things like this is that such missiles are programmed with the general characteristics of the radars they are supposed to destroy, and will ignore others. >... Also, aircraft flying at low altitude are generally under some >fairly strict time constraints to accomplish their mission, and the ALARM >must take some appreciable time to get up to 100Kft and back down again, >even if it finds a target immediately. My memory on this is fuzzy, but I believe Alarm can be used in several different modes, and the climb-and-loiter flight profile is only one of them. It is a fairly general-purpose antiradar missile. >Seems it would be more economical >to eliminate the missile's first stage and drop it instead from a >high-altitude aircraft (out of SAM and AAA range) some minutes before ... Unless you start talking about very specialized aircraft, there is no such thing as being out of SAM range. And a high-altitude antiradar aircraft dropping such things in advance would be a wonderful tip-off that a low- altitude raid was on the way. The RAF basically doesn't believe in flying at high altitudes in combat, period. It is also very important that the combat aircraft be capable of defending *themselves*, because if such defense is assigned to specialized support aircraft, there are never enough of them to go around. -- "Maybe we should tell the truth?" | Henry Spencer at U of Toronto Zoology "Surely we aren't that desperate yet." | henry@zoo.toronto.edu utzoo!henry
lhb6v@faraday.clas.Virginia.EDU (Laura Hayes Burchard) (02/12/91)
From: lhb6v@faraday.clas.Virginia.EDU (Laura Hayes Burchard) In article <1991Feb9.025326.29449@cbnews.att.com> henry@zoo.toronto.edu (Henry Spencer) writes: >Alarm exists and is reportedly in use in the Gulf. It has no numeric >designation that I'm aware of; the British military is not as obsessed >with numbers as the US is, and tends to give things names instead. Our friend Group Captain Irving mentioned at his Sunday briefing that it had just gotten its first use. It was used in parachute mode; unfortunately, no radars were on at the time, so it never went off. Sometimes the Iraqis just won't cooperate with combat testing... -- Laura Burchard lhb6v@virginia.edu lhb6v@virginia.bitnet #inc <std.disclaimer> The fact is that one side thinks that the profits to be won outweigh the risks to be incurred, and the other side is ready to face danger than accept an immediate loss. --Thucydides, History of the Peloponnesian War
u9dmlb@ohm.york.ac.uk (Duncan McL BARCLAY) (02/12/91)
From: Duncan McL BARCLAY <u9dmlb@ohm.york.ac.uk> ALARM is made by Marconi Defense Systems in UK, I work for them but dont know much about it. Also a note about Hellfire, it is not easily launched off a fixed wing but it can be done. u9dmlb@ohm.york.ac.uk or dmb4@york.ac.uk include disclaimer.std
justin@tasman.cc.utas.edu.au (Justin Ridge) (02/14/91)
From: justin@tasman.cc.utas.edu.au (Justin Ridge) The ALARM DOES exist, and has been used in the Gulf by RAF Tornadoes operating over Kuwait & southern Iraq (at least - most probably over Baghdad as well). It works in pretty much the way described. As someone else has noted, it's made by Marconi in the UK. The UK usually doesn't give missiles numeric codes, but rather names (such as 'Red Top', 'Sea Suka' etc.) I have an idea that the missile is fired from a decent range when the SAM emissions are picked up. It then records the frequency or what-have-you, and can home on them. When the radar is turned off, it boosts to x ft, and waits for these emissions to begin again. I can't vouch for the way ALARM works - this description is only to the best of my knowledge. However, I KNOW FOR A **FACT** that it has been used in the Gulf by the RAF. Justin, justin@tasman.cc.utas.edu.au
adam@ste.dyn.bae.co.uk (Adam Curtin) (02/14/91)
From: Adam Curtin <adam@ste.dyn.bae.co.uk> In article <1991Feb12.013221.7461@cbnews.att.com> u9dmlb@ohm.york.ac.uk (Duncan McL BARCLAY) writes: >ALARM is made by Marconi Defense Systems in UK, I work for them but dont >know much about it. ALARM (Air Launched Anti-Radiation Missile) is made by British Aerospace (Dynamics) Ltd. in the UK and incorporates some components by Marconi. I work for them but don't know how much about it is still classified. Look in JANES. In article <1991Feb12.013117.7246@cbnews.att.com>lhb6v@faraday.clas.Virginia.EDU (Laura Hayes Burchard) writes: >Our friend Group Captain Irving mentioned at his Sunday briefing that >it had just gotten its first use. It was used in parachute mode; >unfortunately, no radars were on at the time, so it never went off. >Sometimes the Iraqis just won't cooperate with combat testing... You don't count this as a successful combat test? ALARM was fired, and Iraqi SAMs were disabled. Anti-radiation missiles are good for disuading SAM operators from switching on radars as well as zapping any that are on already. It would be nice not to have to use one ALARM per bombing run, though, but then, how do I get paid? Adam -- /home/research/adam/.signature: No such file or directory