[sci.military] ordinance delivery SUMMARY

kevin@ccs.QueensU.CA (Kevin Broekhoven) (05/05/91)

From: kevin@ccs.QueensU.CA (Kevin Broekhoven)


In March I posed the following question to this list.

> My limited understanding of warfare is that since the invention of
> fire-arms, a major theme of military theory has been command, control,
> and "concentration" of fire-power on unfriendly targets.   I'm wondering
> how military doctrine chooses the method of delivery of this awesome
> modern fire-power to the enemy, and to what degree economic
> considerations affect these decisions. i.e. why choose "air" bombardment
> over sea or land bombardment?  Concentration of firepower?
> Command & Control? Protection of weapons-delivery "assets"?
> (why do these guys sound more like accountants than warriors?)

There were a number of good responses to the list, a number of excellent
replies came to me directly.  I include hilights from a number of articles
below.  -knb. 

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military@cbnews.att.com (Bill Thacker) writes...

[...lotsa good stuff deleted ...]

One more factor comes into play there.  Most artillery casualities
come in the first few seconds of the barrage, before people make it to
cover.  You want something that maximizes that effect; the MLRS is perfect.
Conventional artillery doesn't do that well.

The use of B-52's also carries a psychological advantage not had by
arty.

I suspect there was some hesitance to use the battleships' guns because
of the Iowa turret explosion.


denbeste@ursa-major.spdcc.com (Steven Den Beste) adds...

There are at least three reasons to prefer "smart" ordnance over "dumb"
ordnance of any kind:

1. The efficiency is far greater. One smart bomb can take out a bridge
with a high likelihood, whereas it may take hundreds or thousands (no joke!)
of dumb bombs to do the same thing. If the smart weapon costs 50 times more,
you may be money ahead anyway.

2. It is more reliable and more schedulable. Modern warfare is immensely
complicated and logistics overwhelms almost every other aspect of it.
If there are strategic targets in your enemy's rear which must be removed
before you can attack, if you use smart weapons you can be pretty sure of
getting them within a small time window, whereas dumb weapons may take 1 day or
may take a month. You therefore have to make your logistics plan based on
a pessimistic schedule, which can really louse you up.

3. It is more precise and therefore has a very high likelihood of avoiding
what they've been calling "collateral damage" - that is, killing women,
children and old men. On the first night of bombing in Baghdad, three
Tomahawk sea-launched cruise missiles hit dead center on the Iraqi Ministry
of Air defenses, turning it into a pile of smoking rubble - while doing no
damage at all to the hospital on one side of it or the high-rise apartment
buildings on the other side.


gregs@meaddata.com (Greg Smith)  writes....

> Looking at the cost of munitions, air-dropped "dumb" bombs must be
> cheaper than artillery, which in turn must be cheaper than "smart" bombs
> or any type of missile.

That depends on how many dumb (or more properly "iron") bombs it takes to 
destroy the target ... remember too that you need recon flights and personel
to look at pictures to do BDA (battle damage assessment).  The "smart" bombs
are simply iron bombs with an electronic laser seeker and fins for guidance 
attached.  I have no idea on the cost but I suspect the the electronics are
not orders of magnitude more expensive.

> I would expect then, that the cheapest way to hit a target would be via
> large calibre artillery mounted on a sea vessel like a WWII battle 
> ship; if the target was out of range of sea-based artillery, I would

Unfortunately the limits of the 16" guns on the 4 US BB's is around 22 miles.
You wouldn't be able to hit targets too far inland.  Remember that the depth
of the coastal waters and presense of mines is a factor.  The BB's would also
need AAW ships and ASW ships to protect it from subs and land bases anti-ship
missiles (like the Chinese Silkworm).  This makes the BB operate further out
to sea.

[ stuff deleted ]

The production line for 16" barrels is no longer in operation.  They do
have a limited life.  There were lots of mines along the coast as well
as the threat of silkworms.

> Also, I got the impression that very limited use was made of field
> artillery, that it was used to harrass the troops defending the 
> "Saddam line", rather than being used to deliver major amounts of
> destructive fire-power.

The Multiple Launch Rockets were the only field pieces that outranged 
the larger Iraqi guns.  The other arty had to set up, fire, and move
out before the Iraqi gunners could fire counterbattery rounds.  Ergo
lots of moving and little firing.


estalker%phantom@blackbird.afit.af.mil ( Edward C. Stalker,,, ) writes...
Subject:  Logistics of Violance

[ stuff deleted ]

I'm a student at the Air
Force Institute of Technology, and this is where we study the
management of violance. It's a fully accredditted MBA program, so
that may be why it seems like a lot of our generals sound like
accountants or businessmen - in effect, they are.
Really, although it sounds a bit like a bad joke, there are many
paralells - although there is a limit to which you can take the
paralells. Many of the problems in Viet Nam came from not knowing
where to draw the line.
If you're familiar with Goldratt's Theory of Constraints, you can
substitute the Ultimate Goal of a Military Organization as a need
to destroy the enemy's will/ability to resist at the lowest
possible cost...in lives as well as money.
It then becomes necessary to find "optimal" or "satisficing"
solutions to your military problems in the light of a set of
limiting constraints.
In Iraq/KTO (Kuwait Theatre of Operations), Naval gunfire or
artillery is frequently the weapon of choice.
 Your analysis of cost/ton of ordnance is not too far from wrong,
and if the only consideration lay in putting x number of tons on
target, you would be correct. What you are forgetting, is that
the objective of war is to disable the enemy will/ability to
resist, not tons of bombs dropped (where did you drop them and
what did they accomplish?)
The technology of the "smart" weapon has finally advanced to the
point that last minute course corrrections can be made to ensure
that virtually all warheads strike at right angles to the
surface. The oblique, or glancing shot is virtually eliminated,
thus making each shot *much* more effective. 
Its basically a cost-benefit tradeoff, then, you have to look at
the characteristics of the target and how critical your accuracy
must be. 
For example, the Republican Guard Positions, out in the desert,
with no  civilian population around, was pounded in the cheapest
possible way - ARCLIGHT- 275 lb iron bombs dumped off a 30 year
old airplane. On the other hand, where there were no civilians,
but plenty of Iraqui AAA, artillery was the answer, when
possible. The battlewagons were used when they could get past the
minefields, reefs and shoals of the coast. I started out my
military career as a sailor, and I remember the gulf as a
nightmare of shoals.
Finally, when you need great accuracy, when you don't want to
have to go back and try again, when you want a high probability
of kill, you use air delivered PGM (Precision Guided Munitions).
If you can make the kill with one pass, the $20,000 of the GBU-15
(2000 lb bomb with guidance package, TV or IIR)M makes more sense
than making several shots with artillery.
For an interesting viewpoint on AF views on Airpower, may I
recommend Dewitt S. Copp's books, Aa Few Great Captains and its
sequel Forged in Fire. If you can get ahold of it, Air Power and
Warfare: Preoceedings of the Eighth Military History Symposium,
published by the Department of the AF, is extremely informative
on this subject.