wb9omc@ecn.purdue.edu (Duane P Mantick) (06/05/91)
From: wb9omc@ecn.purdue.edu (Duane P Mantick) I went home last night and looked at three different references that I have on what was the first all jet kill in history. Here is what I have: "MiG Alley - Air to Air Combat Over Korea" by Larry Davis "In history's first all-jet air battle, one of the MiGs tried to dive away from Lt. Russell Brown's much heavier F-80. Brown closed on the MiG and poured a steady stream of .50 calibre bullets into him. The MiG flipped over and fell out of the sky. It was the first of an eventual 827 MiGs to go down in Korea." "Fighting Jets" of the Time/Life Epic of Flight Series "Lieutenant Russell Brown nosed down in pursuit; in a descent the F-80, being heavier than the MiG, had a slight speed advantage. Brown narrowed the distance, squeezed the trigger on his control stick and sent a five second burst of .50 caliber fire into the enemy plane." "The world's first encounter between jet fighters had lasted perhaps 30 seconds, and it had ended in an American victory." "Shooting Star, T-Bird & Starfire - A Famous Lockheed Family" by Rhodes Arnold, Lt. Col., USAF, Retired "...the first victory being that of Lt. Russell Brown on 8 November 1950. This encounter marked the first aerial victory of a US jet over a Russian built jet fighter, another first for a Lockheed aircraft." Well, it's possible all three references could be wrong - but not likely. Duane
brett@tle.enet.dec.com (Bevin Brett) (06/06/91)
From: brett@tle.enet.dec.com (Bevin Brett) wb9omc@ecn.purdue.edu (Duane P Mantick) writes... >I went home last night and looked at three different references that I >have on what was the first all jet kill in history. Here is what I have: >"MiG Alley - Air to Air Combat Over Korea" by Larry Davis >"Fighting Jets" of the Time/Life Epic of Flight Series >"Shooting Star, T-Bird & Starfire - A Famous Lockheed Family" by Rhodes >Arnold, Lt. Col., USAF, Retired >Well, it's possible all three references could be wrong - but not likely. There are several possibilities, but first let us discount the idea that repetition increases likelyhood of correctness. If each of these authors copied either from each other, or from a common original source, then incorrect information can easily turn up over and over. Take the "7 colors in a rainbow" idea that Isaac Newton and others started and was still being repeated in science texts in the 1960, 70's!, or the number of human chromosones, or the large number of books on UFO's and hauntings. Possibility One: The MiG was hit, split-S'ed towards the ground, but pulled out at low altitude and got home, but the US pilot got credited a kill. This happened a lot during WW-II, all sides, just look at the exagerated claims during the Battle of Britain. Possibility Two: MiG hit, split-S'ed, crashed - but the North Koreans didn't get a report on how the plane was lost; so didn't record it as an air-to-air loss, by just MIA. The MiG beats F-80C may be documented by both sides. Possibility Three: Someone [from either side, official or unofficial] is fabricating some/all of the story in order to be able to claim the first air-air victory. It intrigued me how the claims were within one day of each other and were one for the F-80C and one for the MiG. Norman Franks, in "Aircraft versus Aircraft" repeats the F-80C hits MiG version, but again that doesn't add any weight. The fog of war is a reality in air-to-air victory scores. /Bevin