wcsswag@ccs.carleton.ca (Alex Klaus) (06/12/91)
From: wcsswag@ccs.carleton.ca (Alex Klaus) I was just wondering about the military use of seaplanes. I the JMSDf, and Soviets use them.(Shin Mewia, Be-12Mail, repsectively). But what about other navis/airforces, why aren't using them. Secondly, why was the Martin Seamaster, program cancelled. Are seaplanes are viable and/or effetive in term ASW etc, for used. OR are there other reason behind their lack of popularity. [So who wants to tell about the ill-fated sea-landing fighter plane this time around? :-) --CDR] Thanks in advance Alex klaus wcsswag@ccs.carleton.ca
jfb@ihlpm.att.com (Joseph F Baugher) (06/14/91)
From: jfb@ihlpm.att.com (Joseph F Baugher) > [So who wants to tell about the ill-fated sea-landing fighter > plane this time around? :-) --CDR] Ok, I'll bite. I posted this article on the Convair F2Y Sea Dart in sci.military a few months back, but here it is again. Enjoy! In 1948, the Navy launched a competition for the design of a supersonic seaplane interceptor. In 1951, Convair was awarded a contract for two prototypes with a delta wing planform, a single delta-shaped tail, and a watertight hull. The aircraft would land on a pair of waterskis which retracted into recesses within the fuselage. The skis were extended for landings and takeoffs, but were retracted for flight or for mooring. Pending the availability of more powerful engines, the first prototype was fitted with two side-by-side afterburning Westinghouse J-34 engines of 3400 pounds of thrust each. The engines were fed by two intakes mounted on either side of the fuselage, above the wings and behind the cockpit. The Navy had such confidence with the design that they ordered 4 YF2Y-1 pre- production and twelve production F2Y-1 aircraft before the first prototype had flown. These were to be powered by a pair of J-46 jets of 6000 pounds of thrust each. The XF2Y-1 prototype took to the air for the first time on April 9, 1953. The first tests revealed (as expected) that the aircraft was severely under- powered for its weight. In addition, the waterskis vibrated continuously during takeoff and landing. In order to cure the vibration problem, a single waterski arrangement was also tried. This did not seem to improve things by any appreciable amount. The YF2Y-1, with its more powerful J-46 engines, joined the test program in early 1954. Convair's test pilot Charles Richbourg took the YF2Y-1 through the sound barrier while in a shallow dive on August 3, 1954. This was the first time that a seaplane ever went supersonic. However, Richbourg was killed that November while demonstrating the YF2Y-1 in an air show over San Diego Bay. Apparently, the aircraft got pushed past its safety margin and the plane disintegrated in midair. Bits and pieces of flaming debris fell into the bay. I still remember the rather vivid photos of this accident that appeared in Life magazine. In the meantime, the Navy had been gradually losing interest in the Sea Dart project. The Navy was already planning for the introduction of supersonic carrier-based fighters, and the problems with the vibrating waterskis seemed to be insoluble. The Navy cancelled its order for the production lot of 12 F2Y-1 fighters in early 1954, even before the first of the YF2Y-1 service test aircraft had been delivered. The fatal crash of the YF2Y-1 aircraft later that year, with the surrounding bad publicity, did not help matters, and, in the event, only three of the four YF2Ys ordered were actually delivered. Also cancelled was the F2Y-2, which had been envisaged as the definitive production version of the Sea Dart. It had a single waterski, an area-ruled fuselage, plus a single afterburning Pratt and Whitney J-75 turbojet of 15,000 pounds of thrust. Evaulation of the surviving Sea Dart aircraft continued until 1957, when the program was finally terminated. One YF2Y-1 aircraft is on display at the Naval Air Test Center Museum at Patuxent River, Maryland. There is a rather odd postscript to the Sea Dart story. In 1962, five years after the official termination of the Sea Dart project, the Navy was ordered to redesignate all of its fighter aircraft in order to conform to the new tri-service unified aircraft designation scheme. For some obscure reason, the Sea Dart was assigned the designation F-7. Perhaps some clerk in the Defense Department had some fond memories of this warplane, and decided to honor it posthumously with an official F-number. Specs for the YF2Y-1: Gross weight: 16,500 lbs. Maximum takeoff weight: 21,500 lbs. Maximum speed: 695 mph at 8000feet, 825 mph at 36,000 ft. Climb rate: 35,000 feet in 1.7 minutes. Range 513 miles (these are estimated performance figures, which I don't think were ever achieved in test) The Sea Dart was never equipped with any armament. Source: The American Fighter, E. Angellucci and P. Bowers Joe Baugher AT&T Bell Laboratories 200 Park Plaza Naperville, Illinois 60566-7050 (708) 713 4548 ihlpm!jfb jfb200@cbnewsd.att.com
john@newave.mn.org (John A. Weeks III) (06/15/91)
From: john@newave.mn.org (John A. Weeks III) > From: wcsswag@ccs.carleton.ca (Alex Klaus) > I was just wondering about the military use of seaplanes. > [ So who wants to tell about the ill-fated sea-landing fighter > plane this time around? :-) --CDR ] Speaking of the Sea Dart, I was at Willow Grove NAS about 4 weeks ago, and the Sea Dart was missing from the display area. Does anyone know where the Sea Dart is and what (if anything) is being done with it? For those who have never been to Willow Grove, it is just north of Philly a few miles off of I-70 (exit 27). Willow Grove was once used as a testing grounds for captured planes. They still have two very rare sea planes (one NAZI, the other Japanese), and an Me-262 (NAZI jet fighter/light bomber). There are a few US planes on display also (F8U, SaberJet, F-80). Its too bad that these planes are sitting outside. Nearby is the Navy Advanced Development Center. I saw a Grumman A-6 mounted to a tower with a gimble mount. The plane was about 40' off of the ground. It appeared to me that they used it for radar testing, but I am only guessing. Anyone know for sure? -- John A. Weeks III (612) 942-6969 john@newave.mn.org NeWave Communications, Ltd. ...uunet!tcnet!newave!john
nanis@llex.ll.mit.edu ( Jeff Nanis) (06/20/91)
From: nanis@llex.ll.mit.edu ( Jeff Nanis) In article <1991Jun18.074207.14461@amd.com> john@newave.mn.org (John A. Weeks III) writes: >Nearby is the Navy Advanced Development Center. Actually, I believe it's the Naval _Air_ Development Center. -- Jeff Nanis Radars 'r' us. nanis@ll.mit.edu An official opinion? Not on my life.