lute@abnjh.UUCP (J. Collymore) (10/01/84)
This question was brought up by someone just recently, but I too would like to know if anyone else has any reliable information on whether a front-wheel drive car (mine is a 1984 Mazda 626) needs more than two snow tires, please send me mail, I will post replies to the net. Thanks. Jim Collymore
heneghan@ihuxa.UUCP (Joe Heneghan) (10/04/84)
I say none. I have an 81' Skylark with good quality steel belted radials and I drive in midwest storms where the snow can be 2 ft. at least. I've never been stuck, in fact I've parked in drifts.
seifert@ihuxl.UUCP (D.A. Seifert) (10/05/84)
> I say none. I have an 81' Skylark with good quality steel belted > radials and I drive in midwest storms where the snow can be 2 ft. > at least. I've never been stuck, in fact I've parked in drifts. That's a good one! I didn't realize that '81 Skylarks had over 2' of ground clearance! wow! -- "We've got a full tank of gas, it's dark, and we're _____ wearing sunglasses" /_____\ "Hit it!" /_______\ |___| Snoopy ____|___|_____ ihnp4!ihuxl!seifert
heneghan@ihuxa.UUCP (Joe Heneghan) (10/08/84)
To Mr. D.A. (I should have been an attorney) Seifert: You seem to be an expert on the subject, so please explain how I actually got through deep snow even though it was deeper than the bottom of my car. Thanks for the sarcasm, you should bottle it and sell it to those who may be interested.
toma@tekchips.UUCP (Tom Almy) (10/08/84)
None, but always carry chains. Standard (but not bald) tires will get you anywhere snow tires will on a "conventional" car, with chains you are driving a tank (my VW Beetle, with chains, pushed full sized American cars with snow tires that got stuck in an icy parking lot; this was in the late 1960's at Cornell U.). I have driven nothing but F.W.D. or rear engined cars since I started driving in 1965. I never owned snow tires and never called for a tow either!
mangoe@umcp-cs.UUCP (Charley Wingate) (10/09/84)
Joe Heneghan of Naperville, Ill. suggests using no snow tires. Well, it may work in Illinois, but here in Maryland, thousands of people from the polar north try to get along without snow tires and fail miserably. It isn't the depth of the snow that gives us trouble, it's the condition, and here it's almost always wet and slippery. Last year, in fact, the snow was very dry, and we had much last trouble. It's really impressive how much difference the snow makes. All those upstate New Yorkers and Pennsylvanians come down and drive us crazy because they don't realize you have to drive differently here. Two inches of snow practically halts the whole area. Charley Wingate
dan@digi-g.UUCP (Dan Messinger) (10/09/84)
In article <> heneghan@ihuxa.UUCP (Joe Heneghan) writes: >I say none. I'll second that opinion. If you have a good set of steel belted radials, switching to snow tires will have very little effect. If, on the other hand, you are not using radials, I see no value on putting snow tires on the rear of a front wheel drive car.
seifert@ihuxl.UUCP (D.A. Seifert) (10/09/84)
(a) what's this about I should have been an attorney?
(b) I think *you* should explain how you drove through 2'
of snow in a car with probably 6-7" of ground clearance.
Especially with 'normal' tires. Up to the 6-7" I would believe.
That's no big deal. But you're talking about PLOWING an additional
18" worth. The amount of force required to move forward goes up
DRASTICALLY as soon as you run out of ground clearance. (We won't
even *mention* trying to climb hills! oops, we did. oh well. :-) )
Where in the midwest was this? If it was in Ill-noise, it was
probably more like 2" of snow and 22" of salt. (Salting the
roads is an olympic event here) Salt isn't compressable, so
you could drive right over the top.
Keep the shiny side up!
(at least until they start salting again,
in which case neither side will be shiny)
--
"We've got a full tank of gas, it's dark, and we're
_____ wearing sunglasses"
/_____\ "Hit it!"
/_______\
|___| Snoopy
____|___|_____ ihnp4!ihuxl!seifertroot@dvamc.UUCP (10/11/84)
References: abnjh.869
It seems to me that snow tires on the back would obviously help you *slow down*
in the snow without skidding. This is my experience with my SAAB 99.
Chris Woodbury
{duke,mcnc}!dvamc!ccwwes@edison.UUCP (10/11/84)
In Virginia not having snow tires and being *stuck* in the snow will get you a ticket, if a the police happen by. ed spigle
haapanen@watdcsu.UUCP (Tom Haapanen [DCS]) (10/11/84)
Whether or not a FWD car can make it through the winter sans snow
tires depends on two factors:
(1) The climate.
This is not car-dependent (no, climate control doesn't help)
(2) The type of summer tires.
Many good radials (standard-type Michelins, Klebers, Semperits,
Continentals) will do quite well under most conditions. However,
if you have high-performance tires (P6, P7, NCT, Comp T/A etc.)
you're going to be doing fancy dance moves in the snow,
unintentionally. In the latter case, get a set (four) snows on
stock-size rims. Your dry handling will go down, but in snow
you'll be much better off.
Recommended snow tires (the best):
(1) Tiki (Swedish)
(2) Hakkapeliitta (Finnish)
Tom Haapanen University of Waterloo (519) 744-2468
allegra \
clyde \ \
decvax ---- watmath --- watdcsu --- haapanen
ihnp4 / /
linus / The opinions herein are not those of my employers,
of the University of Waterloo, and probably not of
anybody else either.marsano@fortune.UUCP (Derek Marsano) (10/11/84)
The question of "how many snow tires" is of particular interest to us Northern Californians. Throughout the winter, storms routinely hit the Donner Pass, over which I-80 runs, which connects the Northern Cal population centers to Lake Tahoe. The pass is at elevation 7280', and the storms blow in almost directly from the Pacific. During these storms, the Highway Patrol institutes "chain control", and prevents any vehicle without (1) snow tires, (2) chains, or (3) four- wheel drive from passing (i.e., go back to San Francisco or rent chains). I was raised in the East and spent five winters skiing in norther New England. I'm used to cruddy driving conditions. Most Californians are not. After three California winters, I'm convinced that the primary goal of "chain control" is to slow down those fools who would otherwise drive 65 mph over the pass under blustery conditions. (Max recommended speed with chains: 35mph. Most people use chains.) Nevertheless, chains or snows are mandatory. Any benefits from using snows on the rear wheels in a front-wheel drive vehicle? Derek Marsano
wjhe@hlexa.UUCP (Bill Hery) (10/12/84)
Four, especially if you get studded tires. With lots more traction in front and a light rear end, the rear end will slide out very easliy in slippery conditions. When that happens, the great traction up fron will pull you along in the direction the whells are going-- which will probably be right off the road or right into oncoming traffic. I know all too well from experience (only once--I went right out and got the second two snows ASAP). I was doning under 10 mph, did $4k damage, but walked away without a scratch thanks to my seat belt.
spw2562@ritcv.UUCP () (10/14/84)
I would recomend using 4 snow tires. I had a nasty experience in a front- wheel-drive '77 Horizon where I started fishtailing. I wound up in the ditch, but only momentarily. Snow tires in the back will help keep this from happenning ( better traction ). It's a myth that front-wheel-drive cars don't fishtail. Steve Wall ...!ritcv!ritvp!spw25692
rkp@drutx.UUCP (10/15/84)
When I first saw this discussion, I thought "How many snow tires would you put on a REAR-wheel drive car?" My experiences with rear-wheel drive cars says that most people only put snow tires on the rear wheels. Therefore, why not just put snow tires on the front wheels of a front-wheel drive car? The answer seems too easy. (Maybe I'm too easy!) |8-) -- Russell Pierce AT&T Consumer Products (303) 538-2023 1200 W. 120th Ave. ...!drutx!rkp Denver, CO 80234
mp@u1100a.UUCP (Mike A Pilla) (10/16/84)
I have had front wheel drive cars for several years (~15) with two SAABS, a
HONDA CIVIC, and a TOYOTA TERCEL wagon.
At first, I used snow tires on all four wheels but this became expensive.
A good friend and tire dealer explained that it was more important to have
all four tires of the same construction (e.g. radial, bias-ply, ...) than
to have all four snows. I have tried this for many snowy seasons without
any problems.
Curiously, he also explained that most front wheel drive cars that appear
squirrly in the snow benefit more from a change in tire pressure than in
putting snows all around. Apparently, the various manufacturers have
specified low tire pressures to provide a "comfortable" ride. The rather
flexible sidewalls subsequently cause poor road feel which leads to
overcompensating and even possibly fish-tailing (attributable more to
driver technique than FWD ...). An increase in tire pressure does not
decrease traction noticeably but substantially increases directional
stability in the white stuff. For my wife's CIVIC, the normal pressure
(I think) was around 24 lbs and we increased it to the range of from
30 to 35 lbs with about 32 lbs feeling quite nice.
--
Michael Pilla
Bell Communications Research
201-981-7290
{ihnp4,allegra,pyuxww}!u1100a!mp