[comp.windows.ms] ObjectVision - a warning

davidf@ntrlink.hq.interlink.com (David Foster) (03/12/91)

Just a word of warning to would-be objectvision users. I am a Borland
fan, so when I saw a stack of objectvision boxes in my local pc store
I dived in with my $99.99 and bought it. Great, I love it, a forms based
constructor kit for windows !!! But what are these references in the
manual to the "objectvision runtime" to distribute an application ? A
quick call to Borland solved that one. Yes, you can distribute applications
but the runtime version (!) of objectvision wil cost you $495 !!!!!!
Isn`t this a variation on the "bait and switch" scam ? Well, it does say
on the back of the box the "runtime version is available" - it pays to
read ALL the small print first I guess, but then I would have thought the
runtime would have cost less, but in effect its the distribution license
you are paying for. Borlands reaction ? "We can give you a return reference
code sir" Thanks Borland !

So, netlanders, what other tools has anyone had experience of that provide
functionality like objectvision, basically a toolkit for creating data entry
forms. Input would be greatly appreciated, as always. 

p.s. Would the $99 ACTOR solution provide similar functionality ?

akm@cs.uoregon.edu (Anant Kartik Mithal) (03/13/91)

In comparing Actor to ObjectVision:

In article <12810@ntrlink.hq.interlink.com> davidf@ntrlink.hq.interlink.com (David Foster) writes:
>Just a word of warning to would-be objectvision users. I am a Borland
>fan, so when I saw a stack of objectvision boxes in my local pc store
>I dived in with my $99.99 and bought it. Great, I love it, a forms based
>constructor kit for windows !!! But what are these references in the
>manual to the "objectvision runtime" to distribute an application ? A
>quick call to Borland solved that one. Yes, you can distribute applications
>but the runtime version (!) of objectvision wil cost you $495 !!!!!!

Actor will let you create runtime applications (a process called
'sealing off') that does not require a run time version. The 'final'
Actor program is a two file set that contains everything that your
application needs to run. No runtime fee, which I also believe is true
of Smalltalk V/Windows.

>So, netlanders, what other tools has anyone had experience of that provide
>functionality like objectvision, basically a toolkit for creating data entry
>forms. Input would be greatly appreciated, as always. 

>p.s. Would the $99 ACTOR solution provide similar functionality ?

I don't actually think that Actor does the same thing that
ObjectVision does. Actor is a C-like implementation of Smalltalk
(complete with browsers, debuggers, inspectors etc.) It is 'truly'
object oriented (if you believe that Smalltalk is...). It is *not*
C++, which someone thought it was. So, Actor is a smalltalk-like
programming environment with the ability to build stand alone
applications. I like it, but then I am sold on Smalltalk.... At $99, I
think it is well worth it, and is the only reason (main?) that I
didn't upgrade to Digitalk's Smalltalk V/Windows, which they were
offering for $299 (or $249, I can't remember which...).

kartik

Disclaimer: I have nothing to do with Whitewater group (authors of
Actor), apart from being a resonably satisfied customer. As for my
university, well, at this point, my thesis committee might be a bit
surprised to find that I have an opinion...

--
Anant Kartik Mithal                                     akm@cs.uoregon.edu
Research Assistant, 					(503)346-4408 (msgs)
Department of Computer Science,                         (503)346-3989 (direct)
University of Oregon, Eugene, OR 97403-1202

itkin@mrspoc.Transact.COM (Steven M. List) (03/14/91)

davidf@ntrlink.hq.interlink.com (David Foster) writes:

>Just a word of warning to would-be objectvision users. I am a Borland
>fan, so when I saw a stack of objectvision boxes in my local pc store
>I dived in with my $99.99 and bought it. Great, I love it, a forms based
>constructor kit for windows !!! But what are these references in the
>manual to the "objectvision runtime" to distribute an application ? A
>quick call to Borland solved that one. Yes, you can distribute applications
>but the runtime version (!) of objectvision wil cost you $495 !!!!!!
>Isn`t this a variation on the "bait and switch" scam ? Well, it does say

No fair, David!  If you've worked with other software packages, you'll
realize that $495 for UNLIMITED ROYALTY-FREE runtimes is NOTHING!  That's
a ONE-TIME charge.  Period.  Then you can sell/give/distribute as many
copies of your applications as you want.  I think that's pretty good,
having worked in the UNIX environment for a long time, where runtimes are
HIGH and PER COPY generally (there ARE some notable exceptions, like JAM
from JYACC).
-- 
 +----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
 :                Steven List @ Transact Software, Inc. :^>~                  :
 :           Chairman, Unify User Group of Northern California                :
 :                         itkin@Transact.COM                                 :

burgoyne@eng.umd.edu (John R. Burgoyne) (03/14/91)

In article <12810@ntrlink.hq.interlink.com> davidf@ntrlink.hq.interlink.com (David Foster) writes:
>
>
>Just a word of warning to would-be objectvision users. I am a Borland
>fan, so when I saw a stack of objectvision boxes in my local pc store
>I dived in with my $99.99 and bought it. Great, I love it, a forms based
>constructor kit for windows !!!

Soft Warehouse said 10 more days 'til they'd have it.

My question is: How good are the printouts that one gets from ObjVis?
Are they comparable to form processing programs?

I notice that Xerox Form Base and Delrina's Per Form Pro are both
offering sweet deals; perhaps in response to ObjVis?

Would anyone recommend or comment on the quality of what is printed
out using ObjVis please?

Thanks.

Robert