2fmmempty@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu (04/03/91)
In article <cchapman.670598294@romeo>, cchapman@msd.gatech.edu (Chuck H. Chapman) writes: > Perhaps I don't understand what you want to do but Alt-Tab still works with > Usher. You can hold down the Alt key and each time you hit tab, Windows > cycles to the next program. For full screen DOS programs, Windows puts a > red title bar at the top of the screen with the name of the application that > will become active when you release the Alt key. It seems to work the same > way it did when I was using Progman. The alt-tab function works fine for me as long as I have progman loaded (it doesn't have to be the shell, just loaded.) What I want to do is use Usher for my shell, not load progman, and still have the alt-tab function. I suspect that when you use the alt-tab function you either have progman loaded, or another program is duplicating the effect ( I have a suspician file manager will do this.) Stephen Figgins 2fmmempty@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu
jmerrill@jarthur.claremont.edu (Jason Merrill) (04/03/91)
>>>>> On 2 Apr 91 19:35:28 GMT, 2fmmempty@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu said: > The alt-tab function works fine for me as long as I have progman loaded (it > doesn't have to be the shell, just loaded.) What I want to do is use Usher for > my shell, not load progman, and still have the alt-tab function. > I suspect that when you use the alt-tab function you either have progman > loaded, or another program is duplicating the effect ( I have a suspician > file manager will do this.) I don't see how it could possibly be Program Manager that is handling Alt-Tab, since it works inside DOS boxes as well, which is really outside progman's domain. Besides, I've used usher for my shell, without progman loaded, and have had no problems using alt-tab or any of the other Windows hotkeys. I use the METZ Task Manager now...not very sophisticated menuing, but it gets the job done and I like to avoid my mouse as much as possible. -- Jason Merrill jmerrill@jarthur.claremont.edu
cms2839@isc.rit.edu (a.stranger) (04/03/91)
In article <1991Apr2.133528.29408@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu> 2fmmempty@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu writes: >In article <cchapman.670598294@romeo>, cchapman@msd.gatech.edu (Chuck H. Chapman) writes: > >The alt-tab function works fine for me as long as I have progman loaded (it >doesn't have to be the shell, just loaded.) What I want to do is use Usher for >my shell, not load progman, and still have the alt-tab function. > >I suspect that when you use the alt-tab function you either have progman >loaded, or another program is duplicating the effect ( I have a suspician >file manager will do this.) > alt-Tab works fine for me without either program manager or file manager loaded ( i just tried it ) . is something in your setup swallowing the keystroke ? -- @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ @ "Imagination keeps the shadows away - Xymox @ @~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~@ @ a.stranger - CMS2839@ritvax.isc.rit.edu @
d89-bfr@sm.luth.se (Bjorn Fahller) (04/03/91)
2fmmempty@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu writes: }The alt-tab function works fine for me as long as I have progman loaded (it }doesn't have to be the shell, just loaded.) What I want to do is use Usher for }my shell, not load progman, and still have the alt-tab function. }I suspect that when you use the alt-tab function you either have progman }loaded, or another program is duplicating the effect ( I have a suspician }file manager will do this.) Um. I'm running usher as the shell now. The program manager is not loaded, nor is the filemanage or any other program that might do things with the keyboard. Alt-Tab works just fine. But it does sounds like an usher problem anyway, that's true. }Stephen Figgins }2fmmempty@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu _ /Bjorn.
2fmmempty@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu (04/03/91)
In article <cchapman.670684055@romeo>, cchapman@msd.gatech.edu (Chuck H. Chapman) writes: > > I do not have file manager or program manager loaded. I use Usher as my > shell. The only other programs I have loaded are Screen Peace, WinClock and I have made a new discovery... I can alt-tab between windows.. but I do not get the little bar at the top of a dos screen, I simply alt-tab to the next program, whether that is in windows or not. (the beauty of alt-tab from dos is of course that you do not have to go to the actual windows screen to switch programs, however this is not working for me without progman or file manager - i did find out it will do this as well.) And I have made one more discovery, having at any time loaded and unloaded file manager or progman, I then get the bar at the top of a dos screen when alt-tabbing. Now that is weird. And I have discovered one pitfall, I must have a windows application open somewhere on the desktop, or I cannot alt-tab back to it! I have had to exit the only application I had open to get back to the desktop, so I could launch another program with Usher. I was trapped! Perhaps there is something specific about my machine that needs progman or file Manager to fully activate the alt-tab function.. this is really getting sort of strange. I will keep you posted on new discoveries as I go. Thanks for the help. Stephen
cchapman@msd.gatech.edu (Chuck H. Chapman) (04/03/91)
In <1991Apr2.133528.29408@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu> 2fmmempty@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu writes: >In article <cchapman.670598294@romeo>, cchapman@msd.gatech.edu (Chuck H. Chapman) writes: >> Perhaps I don't understand what you want to do but Alt-Tab still works with >> Usher. You can hold down the Alt key and each time you hit tab, Windows >> cycles to the next program. For full screen DOS programs, Windows puts a >> red title bar at the top of the screen with the name of the application that >> will become active when you release the Alt key. It seems to work the same >> way it did when I was using Progman. >The alt-tab function works fine for me as long as I have progman loaded (it >doesn't have to be the shell, just loaded.) What I want to do is use Usher for >my shell, not load progman, and still have the alt-tab function. >I suspect that when you use the alt-tab function you either have progman >loaded, or another program is duplicating the effect ( I have a suspician >file manager will do this.) I do not have file manager or program manager loaded. I use Usher as my shell. The only other programs I have loaded are Screen Peace, WinClock and WinPost and I seriously doubt if any of these programs is handling Alt-Tab. Alt-Tab is not handled by file manager or program manager. -- Charles H. Chapman (GTRI/MATD) (404) 528-7588 Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332 ************************************************************** * Home of the 1990 National Champion Ga. Tech Yellow Jackets * ************************************************************** uucp: ...!{allegra,amd,hplabs,ut-ngp}!gatech!msd!cchapman Internet: cchapman@msd.gatech.edu
mcclaugh@sp1.csrd.uiuc.edu (Patrick McClaughry) (04/04/91)
I have used Usher in place of Progman. I am able to alt-tab back and forth between DOS windows and other applications. I have found that if I alt-tab quickly, the bar at the top is not displayed. If I press alt, then press tab while holding alt, I get the bar and can in fact press tab again to 'scroll' through the running applications. Works quite nicely. I think you are correct about needing a running application on the desktop to alt-tab back to the desktop. I haven't had this problem as Magic is loaded at startup. I can always get back to the desktop by alt-tab'ing to Magic. -Pat -- _____________________________________________________________________________ Patrick McClaughry <mcclaugh@csrd.uiuc.edu> >>No opinions - No problems<< ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
cchapman@msd.gatech.edu (Chuck H. Chapman) (04/04/91)
In <1991Apr3.092731.29429@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu> 2fmmempty@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu writes: >In article <cchapman.670684055@romeo>, cchapman@msd.gatech.edu (Chuck H. Chapman) writes: >> >> I do not have file manager or program manager loaded. I use Usher as my >> shell. The only other programs I have loaded are Screen Peace, WinClock and >I have made a new discovery... I can alt-tab between windows.. but I do not get >the little bar at the top of a dos screen, I simply alt-tab to the next >program, whether that is in windows or not. (the beauty of alt-tab from dos is >of course that you do not have to go to the actual windows screen to switch >programs, however this is not working for me without progman or file manager - >i did find out it will do this as well.) Curious. I do get the title bar at the top of DOS screens when using Alt-Tab but I always have at least one Windows application loaded (like Screen Peace). I never load file manager or program manager. >And I have made one more discovery, having at any time loaded and unloaded file >manager or progman, I then get the bar at the top of a dos screen when >alt-tabbing. Now that is weird. >And I have discovered one pitfall, I must have a windows application open >somewhere on the desktop, or I cannot alt-tab back to it! I have had to exit >the only application I had open to get back to the desktop, so I could launch >another program with Usher. I was trapped! I bet you could hit Alt-Escape to iconize your DOS application and that should take you back to the desktop. Chuck -- Charles H. Chapman (GTRI/MATD) (404) 528-7588 Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332 ************************************************************** * Home of the 1990 National Champion Ga. Tech Yellow Jackets * ************************************************************** uucp: ...!{allegra,amd,hplabs,ut-ngp}!gatech!msd!cchapman Internet: cchapman@msd.gatech.edu
gpsteffl@sunee.waterloo.edu (Glenn Steffler) (04/04/91)
In article <1991Apr3.092731.29429@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu> 2fmmempty@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu writes: > >And I have discovered one pitfall, I must have a windows application open >somewhere on the desktop, or I cannot alt-tab back to it! I have had to exit >the only application I had open to get back to the desktop, so I could launch >another program with Usher. I was trapped! Why didn't you hit Ctrl+Esc to get the Windows Task Manager? That would have brought you back to the Windows. > Stephen -- Windows Sumo Wrestler "Bo doesn't know software" - George Brett --(Windows 3.0, a combination of modern moodring technology and voodoo)-- "I guess she had a way, of making every night seem bright as day" `I Don't Believe In Love` -Queensryche (Oper. Mindcrime) Glenn Steffler
2fmmempty@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu (04/04/91)
In article <cchapman.670707654@romeo>, cchapman@msd.gatech.edu (Chuck H. Chapman) writes: > > Curious. I do get the title bar at the top of DOS screens when using Alt-Tab > but I always have at least one Windows application loaded (like Screen Peace). > I never load file manager or program manager. I have experimented a bit more and have found that I can use alt-tab fine, as long as I have opened one windows program, not necessarily Progman. So that was the reason my experience was different from yours. I wasn't using a screen saver, or any other win program when I encountered the problem. > I bet you could hit Alt-Escape to iconize your DOS application and that > should take you back to the desktop. Alt-Escape wasn't working, but I bet I could have alt-returned, and windowed my dos app. that would have gotten me back to the windows screen without haveing to close the app. I so seldom run dos apps in windows that I forgot all about that until I read this. Thanks again for the help. Stephen
george@hobbes.ncsu.edu (George Browning) (04/04/91)
Howdy Usher users! As the author of Usher I thought I'd try out this latest oddity. My findings have confirmed the following: ** With Usher as shell and *no* other Windows apps running, the title bar which normally appears when alt-tab switching doesn't appear. I always have at least one other Windows app running (actually two: Intermission and Ralph), so I've never seen this problem. Darn good question as to why this happens. I didn't add a secret line into Usher such as AltTabTitleDisable (). :-) By the by, I'm going to release Usher 1.2 shortly. Mainly bug fixes dealing with the "sticky" right button. Sorry, no new features. Thanks to those who have registered your copy of Usher -- it gives me incentive to keep working.... Please write if you have any bug notifications or would like to suggest any new (reasonable) features. To reiterate what I've stated in the past: I don't know of any way to allow the user to select an item from the right button menu using the right button -- you have to use the left. If *anyone* has any suggestions to fix this please write back. Thanks again! george (author of Usher and soon a graduate of NCSU!) -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------ | o | George Browning george@catt.ncsu.edu | o | | o | NC State University Raleigh, NC | o | ------------------------------------------------------------------------
akm@geriatrix.cs.uoregon.edu (Anant Kartik Mithal) (04/04/91)
In article <1991Apr4.005757.17866@ncsu.edu> george@hobbes.ncsu.edu (George Browning) writes: > >Howdy Usher users! As the author of Usher I thought I'd try out this >latest oddity. My findings have confirmed the following: > >** With Usher as shell and *no* other Windows apps running, the title bar > which normally appears when alt-tab switching doesn't appear. > > I always have at least one other Windows app running (actually two: > Intermission and Ralph), so I've never seen this problem. > > Darn good question as to why this happens. I didn't add a secret > line into Usher such as AltTabTitleDisable (). :-) > I suspect that this is because usher doesn't have a main window/main window procedure etc. (note that I haven't seen Usher's code, so this is just a guess. I think that that Alt-Tab but only works when an application declares a window and window class for itself. (and then creates such a window). I suspect that Usher doesn't have one of the things that Windows expects.. (And I am not saying that usher should have them...) Usher doesn't appear in, say, the task manager. Which brings up a related question: what does the task manager look at to figure out what windows are available? (I suspect this is related to Usher' behavior.) -- Anant Kartik Mithal akm@cs.uoregon.edu Research Assistant, (503)346-4408 (msgs) Department of Computer Science, (503)346-3989 (direct) University of Oregon, Eugene, OR 97403-1202
d89-bfr@sm.luth.se (Bjorn Fahller) (04/06/91)
Just thought I'd include another usher/progman difference, I've noticed. I'm using usher as the shell (Okay George, I'll register!), and if I start windows with "win progname", the program does not load or execute. We all know it does with progman. Also, a few notes on ver 1.3. Wouldn't it be a good idea to have the "default" menu on the icon? Also, I would like it if I could choose to hide the icon if I want to (take a look at icon-fixer and raise, by Robert F Nee, and you'll get the idea). Since I always have other applications running, like screen-peace for example, the lack of an icon never bothered me. As a matter of fact, I liked it. _ /Bjorn.
george@garfield.catt.ncsu.edu (George Browning) (04/08/91)
In article <1525@tau.sm.luth.se> d89-bfr@sm.luth.se (Bjorn Fahller) writes: >Organization: University of Lulea, Sweden >Lines: 15 > > >Just thought I'd include another usher/progman difference, I've noticed. >I'm using usher as the shell (Okay George, I'll register!), and if I start >windows with "win progname", the program does not load or execute. We all >know it does with progman. Yeah, I know. I meant to add that in to 1.3 but I forgot. I promise it'll be in the next version. >Also, a few notes on ver 1.3. Wouldn't it be a good idea to have the >"default" menu on the icon? Also, I would like it if I could choose to hide >the icon if I want to (take a look at icon-fixer and raise, by Robert F Nee, >and you'll get the idea). Since I always have other applications running, >like screen-peace for example, the lack of an icon never bothered me. As a >matter of fact, I liked it. I didn't know what to put on the icon menu since none of the default menu choices were valid (how can you 'restore' Usher, ditto for max/min). Adding the icon fixed *a lot* of problems when Usher is the shell. If I make it optional, and the user happens to close all other Windows icons then those bugs will return. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ | o | George Browning george@catt.ncsu.edu | o | | o | NC State University Raleigh, NC | o | ------------------------------------------------------------------------
d89-bfr@sm.luth.se (Bjorn Fahller) (04/10/91)
george@garfield.catt.ncsu.edu (George Browning) writes: >In article <1525@tau.sm.luth.se> d89-bfr@sm.luth.se (Bjorn Fahller) writes: >>Also, a few notes on ver 1.3. Wouldn't it be a good idea to have the >>"default" menu on the icon? Also, I would like it if I could choose to hide >>the icon if I want to (take a look at icon-fixer and raise, by Robert F Nee, >>and you'll get the idea). Since I always have other applications running, >I didn't know what to put on the icon menu since none of the default >menu choices were valid (how can you 'restore' Usher, ditto for Ah, misunderstanding. I guess I could have been more specific. I didn't mean the windows default menu, which is indeed of zero interest. What I meant was the usher @default@ menu. >max/min). Adding the icon fixed *a lot* of problems when Usher is >the shell. If I make it optional, and the user happens to close >all other Windows icons then those bugs will return. That is true. You are so right. But I don't think I'm the only one who always have other applications running. For those of us who always have other applications running, it is no problem. If you describe the nature of the problem in the documentation, and leave it to the user to choose whether to have an icon or not, I think it's fair. Default would of course be an icon. Just add a "show icon" item on the usher default menu. It should of course be a checkmarked item. I don't think that would lead to any problems, or am I wrong? _ /Bjorn.