jcd@ecersg.ncsu.edu (Joseph C. Davis) (11/08/90)
several weeks ago, the developer of Stuart told us to stop complaining about a general lack of software for the next, and to start coming up with specifics. well, i haven't thought too much about it, but this last week, i was looking through my roommates MacWeek, and saw a few things that i would like to see on the Next. The first of these is a graphical SPICE interface that allows the user to run SPICE by constructing circuit diagrams and using libraries of devices. Of course, you can create your own device. With the great GUI and IB, why hasn't this been done? Or has it, and i just don't know about it? Is there a way to use the power of the DSP to do the number crunching? #2 - project management programs of the MacProject style ( Gantt charts, etc. ) #3 - stand-alone equation writer for use with any WP ( Expressionist type ) #4 - soft process controll ( stuff like Labview ) ok, guys, fill this out, and you hot-shot programmers can start. and, please, only constructive comments. flames are stupid.
jasmerb@prism.cs.orst.edu (Bryce Jasmer) (11/10/90)
In article <1990Nov8@ncsuvx.ncsu.edu> (Joseph C. Davis) writes: >#1 - a graphical SPICE interface Check out NXSpice.tar.Z on the archives (cs.orst.edu and purdue.) I think it might be a start in the right direction but I know nothing about EECAD types of programs so I've never used it and don't know much about it. >#2 - project management programs of the MacProject style ( Gantt charts, etc. ) >#3 - stand-alone equation writer for use with any WP ( Expressionist type ) >#4 - soft process controll ( stuff like Labview ) And some things that I would like (no... make that *pay*) to see: 5) NeXTInTax!!!!! (I'm actually considering buying a Macintosh (ugh!) who's sole purpose in life would be to do my taxes. So think about it, I'm willing to pay $1000 just for a solution to my taxes problem.) 6) an outliner (ala More II without all the presentation stuff built in.) 7) a really simple plotting package (like CricketGraph or a front end to gnuplot.) 8) games games games (I'm in love with Solarian!) 9) a good calculator (maybe even a construction kit too.) 10) good hard disk formatting interface (like SilverLining.) 11) backup software (a port of fastback would be nice.) 12) a good appointments program (Calendoscope, Cassandra, Date, and others for the NeXT all have problems.) So there you have, the wish list of Bryce Jasmer. Stuff that I would lay money down to use. I'll write #12 when I get a chance, but that probably won't be too soon. Bryce Jasmer jasmerb@ohsu.edu #import <sys/disclaimer.h>
bb@reef.cis.ufl.edu (Brian Bartholomew) (11/12/90)
Sorry, Bruce. In article <1990Nov09.201239.29351@scion.CS.ORST.EDU> you write: > 11) backup software (a port of fastback would be nice.) Grrrrrrr. You have an OS containing a complete set of backup options. You may backup by disk partitions (NeXT's ship with only one), in an incremental fashion by file modification time, with dump / restore. Or, over the with network with rdump. You may backup by directory tree with tar. You may check and repair filesystems with fsck. You may reduce the storage requirements of any of these options with compress / uncompress. If you get tired of those alternatives, there is always find / cpio (yuk). Each of these options may be automated to whatever extent is desired with a script or two run from cron. The simplest, and my favorite option, is just to *copy* the target directory tree to a *floptical*, by dragging a folder icon with the *mouse*. In this case, you may browse the "backup" in a normal fashion, and you don't have to do anything unusual to get the files back. Please understand that I have used several versions of Fastback regularly on PC's, and I think that for the platform, it's wonderful. However, the NeXT world does *not* need another port of a completely un-portable, un-configurable, un-networkable, wheel-reinventing product of PC think like Fastback. Let's not forget that we are dealing with a *workstation* here, which should be connected to a world-wide network like the Internet (where are you reading this news from?) for the greatest gain. Of course, that is not to say that a NeXTStep front end to the above utilities should not be written, with some simple, pre-configured backup strategies designed for the stand-alone or almost stand-alone system. This could be a big win for a large percentage of users, who do not have a centralized network management and filestore maintenance organization in place. Any takers? "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from a rigged demo." ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Brian Bartholomew UUCP: ...gatech!uflorida!mathlab.math.ufl.edu!bb University of Florida Internet: bb@math.ufl.edu -- "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from a rigged demo." ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Brian Bartholomew UUCP: ...gatech!uflorida!mathlab.math.ufl.edu!bb University of Florida Internet: bb@math.ufl.edu
pbiron@weber.ucsd.edu (Paul Biron) (11/12/90)
In article <25376@uflorida.cis.ufl.EDU> bb@reef.cis.ufl.edu (Brian Bartholomew) writes: > >Sorry, Bruce. > >In article <1990Nov09.201239.29351@scion.CS.ORST.EDU> you write: > >> 11) backup software (a port of fastback would be nice.) > >Grrrrrrr. You have an OS containing a complete set of backup options. [stuff deleted] >Let's not forget that we are >dealing with a *workstation* here, which should be connected to a >world-wide network like the Internet (where are you reading this news >from?) for the greatest gain. >"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from a rigged demo." >------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >Brian Bartholomew UUCP: ...gatech!uflorida!mathlab.math.ufl.edu!bb >University of Florida Internet: bb@math.ufl.edu Here! Here! I bought a NeXT *BECAUSE* its a unix box, because just about everything that I need is there already (and what's not in unix per se is there is the bundled apps or in an archive somewhere on the net). NeXT's strategy is to sell the boxes to people telling them that they don't have to learn any unix to be able to use them. "Unix for the rest of us" is the way its worded in some of the glossies I've seen. I've said it before, the NeXT and the NeXTStep GUI are *NOT* unix for the rest of us, its multi-{tasking,user} for the rest of us (sic). Unfortunately, this kind of strategy hides many of the wonderful tools which are *ALREADY* there, and puts people in the Mac/PC mode of "I need something done, I guess I'll have to go buy some software to do it". Please, people, do not shune unix, its not the devil incarnate! Here's an idea (NeXT, are you listening?). NeXT is way ahead of everyone else in the market as far as bundling software with their machines (yeah!). How about bundling a good "intro" to unix book as well? Make a deal with the publisher of one of the following books (or any other "intro" to unix book) and ship the book (either hard or soft copy version would be fine) with every new machine: Life with UNIX : a guide for everyone / Don Libes & SandyRessler. Englewood Cliffs, N.J. : Prentice Hall, c1989. UNIX for people : a modular guide to the UNIX operating system : visual editing, document preparation, & other resources / Peter M. Birns, Patrick B. Brown, John C. C. Muster. Englewood Cliffs, N.J. : Prentice-Hall, c1985. The UNIX for beginners book : a step-by-step introduction / Bryan Strong, Jay Hosler. New York : Wiley, c1987. That way, new users would get an idea of what kinds of utilities are *ALREADY* available to them. It wouldn't cost NeXT or its users that much money (just a guess, but I'd say no more than $5-$10 a box, and I'd never notice it if the price went up that much). I think that would do a world of good for NeXT, its users and the publishers. Sure, everyone who buys a NeXT (and is a unix novice) can just go down to their local bookstore and buy one of these books, but *THEY DON'T*. The posting I've seen in this group asking if anyone has written/ported an "APPLICATION which does X" when there is ALREADY a "PROGRAM in unix which does X" testify to that! Paul Biron pbiron@ucsd.edu (619) 534-5758 Central University Library, Mail Code C-075-R Social Sciences DataBase Project University of California, San Diego, La Jolla, Ca. 92093
declan@remus.rutgers.edu (Declan McCullagh/LZ) (11/12/90)
In article <4011@network.ucsd.edu>, pbiron@weber.ucsd.edu (Paul Biron) writes: [Cogent pro-UNIX argument deleted] > Please, people, do not shune unix, its not the devil incarnate! WE, as people technically inclined enough to read comp.sys.next and follow discussions on here, most likely know that. Personally, one of the major reasons I got a NeXT is because it IS a UNIX system - but comp.sys.next readers (including myself) are far from being a representative sample of the kind of user NeXT is courting. NeXT is targeting Big Business. Big Business people with NeXTs on their desks don't necessarily want to know about UNIX commands - they probably have a support staff fluent in UNIX arcana. But they DO want nice NeXTstep front ends to traditional UNIX commands; to take up the argument advanced earlier, an equivalent of Silverlining might help sell machines, whereas a UNIX book might turn people off... Agreed, there are some UNIX solutions included with the system. But why not promote NeXTstep ones as well? It will not only encourage innovation in interfaces and program design, but stimulate third party software development and show people that there ARE good applications out for the NeXT... -------------------------------------------------------------------- Declan McCullagh / NeXT Campus Consultant \ declan@remus.rutgers.edu --------------------------------------------------------------------
edwardj@microsoft.UUCP (Edward JUNG) (11/13/90)
In article <4011@network.ucsd.edu> pbiron@weber.ucsd.edu (Paul Biron) writes: [...] >machines (yeah!). How about bundling a good "intro" to unix book >as well? Make a deal with the publisher of one of the following >books (or any other "intro" to unix book) and ship the book >(either hard or soft copy version would be fine) with every new machine: [...] >UNIX for people : a modular guide to the UNIX operating system : visual > editing, document preparation, & other resources / Peter M. Birns, Patrick > B. Brown, John C. C. Muster. Englewood Cliffs, N.J. : Prentice-Hall, c1985. This is interesting since, as I recall, Peter Birns is now at NeXT as a guy on their developers education group (or something like that). One would hope that this means that there is someone who can become proactive about having good learning and tutorial tools on the NeXT machine. I do, however, take exception to the assertation that the NeXT machine has good backup utilities (eg just because it is Unix). On the contrary, the backup tools are very poor, non-user friendly in operation, error reporting, and documentation, and in many cases (eg OD and backup/restore) plain non-functional for practical use. Hopefully these things are fixed in the release of 2.0. -- Edward Jung Microsoft Corp. My opinions do not reflect any policy of my employer.