[comp.sys.next] Price of Diagram!

bmwu@athena.mit.edu (Benson M. Wu) (11/14/90)

	I received the following e-mail from Jonathan Schwartz 
of Lighthouse Design, Ltd. after I whined on the net about
the high prices of NeXt peripherals and softwares.  
What a deal!  Every university that carries NeXT should
consider carrying Diagram!  I definitely want to check this
software out.  I just hope other software vendors are
as reasonable as Lighthouse Design and not like Frame Technology.

	Best regards,

	Benson Wu
	bmwu@athena.mit.edu

Enc:  See the letter below.
----------------------------------------------------------------

>From: lighthouse!jis@uunet.uu.net
>Date: Mon, 12 Nov 90 00:31:48 EST
>Received: by NeXT Mailer (1.58)
>To: bmwu@ATHENA.MIT.EDU
>Subject: Re: comp.sys.next post
>Cc: jis@uunet.UU.NET

>Benson-

>Re: your post of 10 Nov:

>[...]

>>In any case, I went to a demo put out by Boston Computer
>>Society last night for NeXT.  I was really impressed by 2.0
>>and the '040 station there.  I just wish the prices of
>>the software and peripherals will come down from Workstation
>>price range to PC range.  If that doesn't happen, NeXT will
>>never become affordable for joe average.

>[...]

>As the sales and marketing manager for Lighthouse Design (we produce Diagram!, a  
>graphics app, along with a variety of freeware and PD material), I was wondering  
>what you thought were fair prices for PC software, ie, not Workstation material. I  
>>can tell you that we as a company wrestled for a good long time over an appropriate  
p>rice. In the end, we decided to list our app at $399, to be discounted through  
>NeXT Connection for under $250. These are Commercial prices. For Academia...

>The first copy to a university will be $200 (on floppy). Subsequent copies to  
>faculty/staff will be $75. For students, Diagram! will be $10. That's ten dollars.  
>Surely this will be affordable? (And if it's not, just tell us what is...).

>The $10 copy will come with license and registration, documentation and sample  
>files. The full commercial distribution. If this sounds unreasonable, please offer  
>your suggestions--we pride ourselves on being attentive listeners. 


>If it sounds reasonable, please tell a couple friends, and have them do the same...

>We'd like to think we're keeping "joe average" in mind. After all, we're a company  comprised of them. Thanks for your ear.

>Jonathan Schwartz
>Lighthouse Design, Ltd.

ppham@gmuvax2.gmu.edu (Phuong Pham) (11/16/90)

Only $10.00 Dollars !! (Student price of Diagram! program)
 
Forget Piracy! $10 for media, docs, registration, etc. and mental
relief, it wouldn't be worth it !

-Lighthouse probably is tapping an underdevloped market for many
students pirate or "borrow" the soft then pay the rediculus
commercial price, for a student. But now they can get ligitimate copies
for what they can really afford. 

Way to go  Lighthouse ! 
 
-> NO, I don't work for these guys.<grin>
 

bostrov@storm.UUCP (Vareck Bostrom) (11/17/90)

In article <2907@gmuvax2.gmu.edu> ppham@gmuvax2.UUCP (Phuong Pham) writes:
>Only $10.00 Dollars !! (Student price of Diagram! program)
> 
>Forget Piracy! $10 for media, docs, registration, etc. and mental
>relief, it wouldn't be worth it !

Uh, that sounds really cool. Uh, what is diagram! ? I must have missed 
something in the receint disk crash.


- Vareck Bostrom (Reply to: bostrov@mist.cs.orst.edu) 

charlie@wam.umd.edu (Charles William Fletcher) (11/18/90)

In article <648@storm.UUCP> bostrov@storm.UUCP (Vareck Bostrom) writes:
>In article <2907@gmuvax2.gmu.edu> ppham@gmuvax2.UUCP (Phuong Pham) writes:
>>Only $10.00 Dollars !! (Student price of Diagram! program)
>> 
>>Forget Piracy! $10 for media, docs, registration, etc. and mental
>>relief, it wouldn't be worth it !
>
>Uh, that sounds really cool. Uh, what is diagram! ? I must have missed 
>something in the receint disk crash.
>
>
>- Vareck Bostrom (Reply to: bostrov@mist.cs.orst.edu) 


Diagram is software for (ta-da) drawing diagrams. It has several
tools for this but its two main features seem to be-

  a) Once a diagram (or say flow chart) is drawn and links make,
then boxes, etc. may be moved around and the links maintained
without redrawing(ie, rubberbanding.)

  b) Boxes, etc may be linked to outside data or programs to bring
up charts, graphs, calculation, or whatever.

See page 128 of the Fall NeXT 'Software and Peripherals' for more 
details.

I called the developer (Lighthouse Design--there local here) about
the 10 dollar deal. Here's the deal--They sell the university
bookstore (or whatever) the first copy for 200 dolars (retail
is listed at 249.) They also give the bookstore the right tomake
copies to faculty and student charging the fac 75 bucks and students
10 dollars each. It is the bookstore's responsibility to check ID's
and send names, etc. to Lighthouse. In addition,  you do NOT get
documentation--BUT ALL manual (I was told) are online.

If you are interested call your bookstore or call Lighthouse
(at 800-366-2279) and they'll contact your local comuter reps.

That's all I know.

-Charlie

>Soon to appear here--some nifty follow-up!

rock@lighthouse.com (11/19/90)

In article <2907@gmuvax2.gmu.edu> ppham@gmuvax2.gmu.edu (Phuong Pham)
writes:

>Only $10.00 Dollars !! (Student price of Diagram! program)
> 
>Forget Piracy! $10 for media, docs, registration, etc. and mental
>relief, it wouldn't be worth it !

I'd like to clarify. The copies don't come with printed docs, but
they're on-line and DL indexed anyway, so no problem. Mental relief,
however, is included. (We considered bundling academic success too,
but until more overseas production facilities come on line, it's just
too expensive.)

Here's how it works:

- Some department of your school (like the computer or book store)
agrees to administer sales, and signs an agreement with us.

- The department buys a master copy of Diagram! (for $200 on floppy,
still a discount).

- The department makes copies, on its own media, etc., for academic
customers. For each copy made for a student, the department pays us
$10. For each copy made for faculty/staff, the department pays us $75.

>Lighthouse probably is tapping an underdevloped market for many
>students pirate or "borrow" the soft then pay the rediculus
>commercial price, for a student. But now they can get ligitimate
>copies for what they can really afford. 
>
>Way to go Lighthouse !

Thanks! We remember what it's like. And we'd rather not force the tens
of millions of students who just can't live another day without
Diagram! to experience the guilt of pirating.

For more information or to get us to hound your school, call us. 

Roger Rosner
rock@lighthouse.com
1-800-366-2279

cyliao@hardy.u.washington.edu (Chun-Yao Liao) (11/20/90)

In article <2907@gmuvax2.gmu.edu> ppham@gmuvax2.UUCP (Phuong Pham) writes:
>Only $10.00 Dollars !! (Student price of Diagram! program)
> 
>Forget Piracy! $10 for media, docs, registration, etc. and mental
>relief, it wouldn't be worth it !
>
Well, actually it's not that simple. You have to convince some one in the
department to purchase a "real" and "complete" copy. Then this person will
be resposible to deal with licensing copy to student and other faculties.
Unless you can find someone in your school to buy a copy, you  just
can't get a copy at $10.

Anyway,  Lighthouse Design made our life much easier with this kind offer,
I am sure all of us appreciate Lighthouse Design, right?


cyliao@wam.umd.edu     		o NeXT :  I put main frame power on two chips.
      @epsl.umd.edu		o people: We put main flame power on two guys.
      @bagend.eng.umd.edu       o ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
 xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxx (reserved)	o RC + Apple // + Classic Music + NeXT = cyliao