[comp.sys.next] Lino problem

jchin@van-bc.wimsey.bc.ca (Joseph Chin) (12/13/90)

Problem:

I sent a four-page corporate newsletter to a Lino shop for film output. Two
out of four pages came out fine. But the two pages that contained scanned
images (300 dpi, 256 grayscale, HSD Scan-X Professional scanner) could not
print out! The shop has a Lino L300 with RIP4. The first page was about 3MB,
second page and third page about 40KB each, fourth page about 3MB. As you've
probably guessed, the first and fourth pages contain the scanned images. I
selected the Lino printer from the print panel, and then use the "Save"
option to save everything to Postscript.

The newsletter was created using FrameMaker 2.0b. Images (two) were scanned
in using the HSD Scan-X Professional scanner at 300-dpi and 256 grayscale.
The scanned images were saved in TIFF and imported into FrameMaker.
The pages were "printed" into separate files (i.e. page1.ps, page2.ps, etc.).
The files were then FTP'ed to my 386SX PC (ASCII transfer). The big files
were compressed using PKZIP (LZH algorithm) in order to fit them onto several
1.44MB floppies to take to the Lino shop.

I assumed that since pages which didn't contain scanned images printed
without any problem, the culprit must be the scanned images. But Postscript
is Postscript and it should be compatible ... from one true Postscript
machine (NeXT) to another true Postscript device (the Linotronic L300). Are
the pages with scanned images too "complicated" for the L300? Any thing I've
missed so far?

Anyways, this problem is driving me nuts! I welcome any suggestions or words
of wisdom any of you can offer ... some real experience would help.

Thanks in advance.

:-( Joe
jchin@van-bc.wimsey.bc.ca

-- 
 ***************** "Happiness is a warm gun ... " ***************
 |    NeXT --> The ultimate electronic publishing platform!     |
 |         Joseph Chin --> jchin@van-bc.wimsey.bc.ca            |
 ****************************************************************

rob@lighthouse.com (12/14/90)

I've seen some PostScript, generated by the NeXT computer that had the
images stored as *binary* data.  If you just did an "ASCII transfer"
to the PC, then you may have lost some of the data for that page.

To check if your PostScript files have binary data in them you can
check them for the string, "%%BeginBinary:".

Another possible problem (although I don't think many people will hit
this) is that the PostScript dictionary, userdict is defined to have
300 entries on the NeXT, but only 200 on the RIP4.

I hope this helps.  We just had our battle with documents printing on the
NeXT printer and not on the Lino so I can empathize completely!!

Rob Kedoin		rob@lighthouse.com
Lighthouse Design, Ltd
6516 Western Avenue Chevy Chase, MD 20815

glenn@heaven.woodside.ca.us (Glenn Reid) (12/17/90)

In article <904@van-bc.wimsey.bc.ca> jchin@van-bc.wimsey.bc.ca (Joseph Chin) writes:
>Problem:
>The newsletter was created using FrameMaker 2.0b. Images (two) were scanned
>in using the HSD Scan-X Professional scanner at 300-dpi and 256 grayscale.
>The scanned images were saved in TIFF and imported into FrameMaker.
>The pages were "printed" into separate files (i.e. page1.ps, page2.ps, etc.).
>The files were then FTP'ed to my 386SX PC (ASCII transfer). The big files
>were compressed using PKZIP (LZH algorithm) in order to fit them onto several
>1.44MB floppies to take to the Lino shop.

You should take a look at the PostScript files that you created on the
disk to see if the image data is in ASCII form or binary.  If they're
binary, you may have just lost (or added) some bits during the process
of transferring them onto floppies, etc.  Binary image data is *very*
sensitive, and even one extra carriage return can make the image operator
fail.  That's why you use ASCII hex data, for portability and a little
more robustness (although it's twice the size).  The scanner software
may have options for saving as ASCII if it turns out that the files are
indeed binary.

>I assumed that since pages which didn't contain scanned images printed
>without any problem, the culprit must be the scanned images. But Postscript
>is Postscript and it should be compatible ... from one true Postscript
>machine (NeXT) to another true Postscript device (the Linotronic L300). Are
>the pages with scanned images too "complicated" for the L300? Any thing I've
>missed so far?

Another possibility is to send your optical disk directly to a service
bureau that supports NeXT machines printing to Linos.  There is at least
one in Portland, Oregon, and perhaps others.  The NeXT catalog lists them
in the back, and you might call NeXT to see if there are more of them
popping up near you.  That would at least eliminate the process of
transferring them to other computers.

It is also possible that the service bureau sets the job timeout value
in PostScript to abort jobs that take longer than X minutes to image.

In summary, there is nothing inherent in PostScript that would cause
that kind of problem.  It is more a "systems" problem of too many kinds
of networks, computers, and so forth.  I have successfully printed
scanned images from the NeXT on a Lino through a service bureau, and it
is certainly possible and a reasonable thing to do.  Some service bureaus
try harder and know more than others, however.

I hope this helps a little bit.

Glenn
-- 
 Glenn Reid				RightBrain Software
 glenn@heaven.woodside.ca.us		PostScript/NeXT developers
 ..{adobe,next}!heaven!glenn		415-851-1785

adonis1@nwnexus.WA.COM (Adonis Corporation ) (12/20/90)

In article <904@van-bc.wimsey.bc.ca> jchin@van-bc.wimsey.bc.ca (Joseph Chin) writes:
>Problem:
>
>I sent a four-page corporate newsletter to a Lino shop for film output. Two
>out of four pages came out fine. But the two pages that contained scanned
>images (300 dpi, 256 grayscale, HSD Scan-X Professional scanner) could not
>print out! The shop has a Lino L300 with RIP4. The first page was about 3MB,
>second page and third page about 40KB each, fourth page about 3MB. As you've
>probably guessed, the first and fourth pages contain the scanned images. I
>selected the Lino printer from the print panel, and then use the "Save"
>option to save everything to Postscript.
>
>The newsletter was created using FrameMaker 2.0b. Images (two) were scanned
>in using the HSD Scan-X Professional scanner at 300-dpi and 256 grayscale.
>The scanned images were saved in TIFF and imported into FrameMaker.
>The pages were "printed" into separate files (i.e. page1.ps, page2.ps, etc.).
>The files were then FTP'ed to my 386SX PC (ASCII transfer). The big files
>were compressed using PKZIP (LZH algorithm) in order to fit them onto several
>1.44MB floppies to take to the Lino shop.
>

I don't know much about tiff formats or how they are converted to ps, but I
do know that I've had a problem transferring eps files from my pc to
my NeXT.  I use kermit in either binary or text mode and the file is
unreadable on the NeXT.  My suspicion is that the eps file is comprised
of both text and binary information, the combination of which cannot
be handled by just text or binary transfer modes alone.  I also wonder
whether the eps format is different for the pc than for the NeXT (there
is some binary information at the very beginning of the file for
instance which I don't expect to be there on the NeXT).

At any rate, I wonder if you have a similar problem where text or binary
transfer modes just don't cut it.

I'd be interested in hearing the resolution to your problem!

-Doug Kent
Independent NeXT Developer

Newsgroups: poster
Subject: Re: Lino problem
Summary: 
Expires: 
References: <904@van-bc.wimsey.bc.ca>
Sender: 
Reply-To: adonis1@nwnexus.UUCP (Adonis Corporation (Doug Kent))
Followup-To: 
Distribution: 
Organization: Northwest Nexus Inc.; Seattle, WA
Keywords: Linotronic, FrameMaker

In article <904@van-bc.wimsey.bc.ca> jchin@van-bc.wimsey.bc.ca (Joseph Chin) writes:
>Problem:
>
>I sent a four-page corporate newsletter to a Lino shop for film output. Two
>out of four pages came out fine. But the two pages that contained scanned
>images (300 dpi, 256 grayscale, HSD Scan-X Professional scanner) could not
>print out! The shop has a Lino L300 with RIP4. The first page was about 3MB,
>second page and third page about 40KB each, fourth page about 3MB. As you've
>probably guessed, the first and fourth pages contain the scanned images. I
>selected the Lino printer from the print panel, and then use the "Save"
>option to save everything to Postscript.
>
>The newsletter was created using FrameMaker 2.0b. Images (two) were scanned
>in using the HSD Scan-X Professional scanner at 300-dpi and 256 grayscale.
>The scanned images were saved in TIFF and imported into FrameMaker.
>The pages were "printed" into separate files (i.e. page1.ps, page2.ps, etc.).
>The files were then FTP'ed to my 386SX PC (ASCII transfer). The big files
>were compressed using PKZIP (LZH algorithm) in order to fit them onto several
>1.44MB floppies to take to the Lino shop.
>

I don't know much about tiff formats or how they are converted to ps, but I
do know that I've had a problem transferring eps files from my pc to
my NeXT.  I use kermit in either binary or text mode and the file is
unreadable on the NeXT.  My suspicion is that the eps file is comprised
of both text and binary information, the combination of which cannot
be handled by just text or binary transfer modes alone.  I also wonder
whether the eps format is different for the pc than for the NeXT (there
is some binary information at the very beginning of the file for
instance which I don't expect to be there on the NeXT).

At any rate, I wonder if you have a similar problem where text or binary
transfer modes just don't cut it.

I'd be interested in hearing the resolution to your problem!

-Doug Kent
Independent NeXT Developer