john@csrnxt1.ae.utexas.edu (John R. Schutz) (02/08/91)
Howdy all. While I am waiting ever so patiently for my '040 upgrade (March sometime? jeeesh), I would like to upgrade to NextStep 2.0. The center here told us that they don't have any, 'but some are on order'. I really can't believe that NeXT is backlogged on the operating system, since all they have to do is duplicate it. Anyways, are there any colleges out there that have a copy in stock (on optical preferably) that they can sell to us at educational prices? Any info appreciated. john -- | John R. Schutz | Email&NeXTmail: | | A learning NeXTie | john@csrnxt1.ae.utexas.edu | | (512)328-0587 | The 23rd periodic element is Vanadium | | 3009 Hatley Dr., Austin, TX 78746 | 'V'. V is roman numeral for 5. Hmmm |
anderson@sapir.cog.jhu.edu (Stephen R. Anderson) (02/08/91)
In article <john.665970015@csrnxt1.ae.utexas.edu> john@csrnxt1.ae.utexas.edu (John R. Schutz) writes:
I would like to upgrade to NextStep 2.0.
The center here told us that they don't have any, 'but some are on
order'. I really can't believe that NeXT is backlogged on the
operating system, since all they have to do is duplicate it.
Yes, but to do that (so as to be useful for old cubes), they need
OD's. Which (apparently) they have not got. So we get to wait.
Steve Andersongarnett@cs.utexas.edu (John William Garnett) (02/11/91)
In article <john.665970015@csrnxt1.ae.utexas.edu> john@csrnxt1.ae.utexas.edu (John R. Schutz) writes: >Howdy all. While I am waiting ever so patiently for my '040 upgrade >(March sometime? jeeesh), I would like to upgrade to NextStep 2.0. >The center here told us that they don't have any, 'but some are on >order'. I really can't believe that NeXT is backlogged on the >operating system, since all they have to do is duplicate it. Anyways, Duplicating isn't so hard... Finding something to duplicate onto appears to be the problem :-). Someone, somewhere, seriously misjudged demand for blank r/w optical disks. What I would propose is to buy the license only (no media) from NeXT or B'land (good luck in getting the University to sell this) for the ~ $65 that it costs. Take the license and a blank optical to someone who has 2.0 installed (yes there are a lucky few :-) and do a BuildDisk. Can someone in-the-know comment on the feasibility (legality etc.) of doing this? Of course you still have the problem of finding a blank optical. However, this appears to be somewhat easier than getting ahold of 2.0. >are there any colleges out there that have a copy in stock (on optical >preferably) that they can sell to us at educational prices? Any info >appreciated. Not likely that you could buy from another University. You might be able to get someone to buy for you (questionable). Most likely, other Universities are having the same problem. -- John Garnett University of Texas at Austin garnett@cs.utexas.edu Department of Computer Science Austin, Texas
jmunkki@hila.hut.fi (Juri Munkki) (02/17/91)
>john@csrnxt1.ae.utexas.edu (John R. Schutz) writes: >> I would like to upgrade to NextStep 2.0. >> The center here told us that they don't have any, 'but some are on >> order'. I really can't believe that NeXT is backlogged on the >> operating system, since all they have to do is duplicate it. anderson@sapir.cog.jhu.edu (Stephen R. Anderson) writes: >Yes, but to do that (so as to be useful for old cubes), they need >OD's. Which (apparently) they have not got. So we get to wait. We have now had a NeXTStation for about a month and we are still waiting for the 2.0 extended. Using a NeXT without the man pages and with practically no programs to speak of isn't fun. I wonder why NeXT has trouble duplicating 3.5" disks. This whole situation reminds me of 1984, when I had only MacWrite and MacPaint to use with my Macintosh. I also dislike the fact that 2.0 is not included on diskettes with the computers. Every other computer manufacturer that I know of provides an installable copy of the operating system. What happens if our NeXT disk is accidentally erased and I find out that I goofed when I made the backup? There's no way to boot the system and no way to restore the disk. We only have one NeXT, so we can't even use other computers for booting. ____________________________________________________________________________ / Juri Munkki / Helsinki University of Technology / Wind / Project / / jmunkki@hut.fi / Computing Center Macintosh Support / Surf / STORM / ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
mikec@wor.umd.edu (Michael D. Callaghan) (02/17/91)
In article <1991Feb17.113832.2803@santra.uucp> jmunkki@hila.hut.fi (Juri Munkki) writes: >>john@csrnxt1.ae.utexas.edu (John R. Schutz) writes: >>> I would like to upgrade to NextStep 2.0. >>> The center here told us that they don't have any, 'but some are on >>> order'. I really can't believe that NeXT is backlogged on the >>> operating system, since all they have to do is duplicate it. > >anderson@sapir.cog.jhu.edu (Stephen R. Anderson) writes: >>Yes, but to do that (so as to be useful for old cubes), they need >>OD's. Which (apparently) they have not got. So we get to wait. > I have NS2.0 Extended on Optical Disk. If someone can check the legaltity issue and get back to me, I will be more than willing to sell to disk to whomever makes me the first unrefusable offer. Apparently, if you own have any 040 machine, or will have an 040 Cube as soon as your upgrade arrives, then you have the licensing required to run 2.0 Extended. So, if you're on a NeXTStation, and have access to a Cube still running 1.0, or whatever...and you want a permanent copy of 2.0 Extended, let me know. I'll sell the one original OD I got in my upgrade box. MikeC (If anyone from NeXT determines, or can point out, that this is not a legal thing to do, let me know. I'm not out to be malicious. I'm just trying to help with the shortages) -- _________________________________________________________ Michael D. Callaghan, MDC Designs, University of Maryland mikec@wam.umd.edu
lang@panews (02/19/91)
In article <1991Feb17.152339.7078@wam.umd.edu> mikec@wor.umd.edu (Michael D. Callaghan) writes: >In article <1991Feb17.113832.2803@santra.uucp> jmunkki@hila.hut.fi (Juri Munkki) writes: >>>john@csrnxt1.ae.utexas.edu (John R. Schutz) writes: >>anderson@sapir.cog.jhu.edu (Stephen R. Anderson) writes: >>>Yes, but to do that (so as to be useful for old cubes), they need >>>OD's. Which (apparently) they have not got. So we get to wait. >> >I have NS2.0 Extended on Optical Disk. If someone can check the >legaltity issue and get back to me, I will be more than willing to >sell to disk to whomever makes me the first unrefusable offer. Don't. When you purchase "NextStep" you are legally purchasing a license to use the software. You don't own the software, the copy of it, or the medium on which it was delivered. It is possible, under some license agreements (I can't speak for NeXT's), to transfer ownership of the license to use the software, but once you transfer it you no longer have it. In other words, you cannot sell the disk or a copy of it, since you don't own them; all you can sell, if permitted by the license agreement, is the right to use the software--and once you transfer that right to somebody else, you no longer have it. Be seeing you... ++Lang
scott@erick.gac.edu (Scott Hess) (02/19/91)
In article <1991Feb18.160300.1@capd.jhuapl.edu> waltrip@capd.jhuapl.edu writes: In article <1991Feb17.113832.2803@santra.uucp>, jmunkki@hila.hut.fi (Juri Munkki) writes: [...material deleted...] > I also dislike the fact that 2.0 is not included on diskettes with the > computers. Well, I understand you can buy it...but the large number of floppies required for an extended release together with their high price makes it quite a lot to give away (even for Steve Jobs and Ross Perot;^)-- especially in view of the intended use of NeXTstations as network nodes that could avail themselves of a central file server. Well, the obvious solution is to purchase the floppies with your machine. Right now I guess you probably won't get them for awhile, but once NeXT has the logistics down, you shouldn't have a problem. But don't make _me_ pay for floppies that I don't want. In the end, if the Extended release were included on floppy, we'd all be paying that extra 200-odd dollars, rather than only those who really need it. [I can use our lab machines to rebuild, if I need to -scott] Besides, they'd not have had the media to include at this time, from the way it sounds. Later, -- scott hess scott@gac.edu Independent NeXT Developer GAC Undergrad <I still speak for nobody> "Tried anarchy, once. Found it had too many constraints . . ." "Buy `Sweat 'n wit '2 Live Crew'`, a new weight loss program by Richard Simmons . . ."
scott@erick.gac.edu (Scott Hess) (02/19/91)
In article <1991Feb18.202925.26747@ibmpa.awdpa.ibm.com> lang@panews writes: In article <1991Feb17.152339.7078@wam.umd.edu> mikec@wor.umd.edu (Michael D. Callaghan) writes: >In article <1991Feb17.113832.2803@santra.uucp> jmunkki@hila.hut.fi (Juri Munkki) writes: >I have NS2.0 Extended on Optical Disk. If someone can check the >legaltity issue and get back to me, I will be more than willing to >sell to disk to whomever makes me the first unrefusable offer. Don't. When you purchase "NextStep" you are legally purchasing a license to use the software. You don't own the software, the copy of it, or the medium on which it was delivered. It is possible, under some license agreements (I can't speak for NeXT's), to transfer ownership of the license to use the software, but once you transfer it you no longer have it. In other words, you cannot sell the disk or a copy of it, since you don't own them; all you can sell, if permitted by the license agreement, is the right to use the software--and once you transfer that right to somebody else, you no longer have it. My understanding of the license is that those who have purchased the new machines are automagically licensed for 2.0 - they have to be, as the new machines cannot run 1.0. [I'm not sure where upgrades fall, though.] So, you can loan out your disk/network connection for people who want to snarf parts of Extended, provided that they already have the Standard release. The fuzzy part is wrt upgrades (and cubes which retain the '030, of course). These will require at the least a purchase of the license (the one without included media). I believe that the license itself can only be purchased at institutions which have purchased a media/license combination, though. When it comes down to it, you pay $xx for the license, and $yy for the media it's on. Presumably, you could sell the media for $yy to some third party, but I would certainly not want to be the first to try it. I would recommend calling up your NeXT rep, or NeXT itself, and asking them. I'd be surprised if anyone got taken to court over something like this (is sort of hard to catch, after all), but I'd not take my chances for $200-odd dollars (for a $3500-$10,000 machine, at that). Just consider the amount of questionable material on comp.sys.next (this post included, I'm sure), and just pretend the idea never occurred . . . :-). If I were a lawyer, I probably wouldn't read this . . . Later, -- scott hess scott@gac.edu Independent NeXT Developer GAC Undergrad <I still speak for nobody> "Tried anarchy, once. Found it had too many constraints . . ." "Buy `Sweat 'n wit '2 Live Crew'`, a new weight loss program by Richard Simmons . . ."
waltrip@capd.jhuapl.edu (02/19/91)
In article <1991Feb17.113832.2803@santra.uucp>, jmunkki@hila.hut.fi (Juri Munkki) writes: [...material deleted...] > I also dislike the fact that 2.0 is not included on diskettes with the > computers. Well, I understand you can buy it...but the large number of floppies required for an extended release together with their high price makes it quite a lot to give away (even for Steve Jobs and Ross Perot;^)-- especially in view of the intended use of NeXTstations as network nodes that could avail themselves of a central file server. Personally, I'm just hoping DAT drives keep getting cheaper FAST! c.f.waltrip Internet: <waltrip@capsrv.jhuapl.edu> Opinions expressed are my own.