dltaylor@cns.SanDiego.NCR.COM (Dan Taylor) (04/23/91)
In <1991Apr20.063819.8726@marlin.jcu.edu.au> cpmwc@marlin.jcu.edu.au (Matthew W Crowd) writes: >In case all you Amiga Freaks hadn't forgot, the only real reason why a >computer has to emulate another is beacause of the lack of REAL software >for its own base. No, not really. I had a professor who wanted an assignment done in dBase, maybe a name, but not REAL software IMHO. I bought an A1000 and Transformer to do it. Haven't touched dBase since. It wasn't that there is NO database software, it's just that a particular piece was SPECIFIED. Same thing for AMAX, I presume. There's one particular title that someone needs to run. Otherwise, the Amiga provides everything needed. By the way, since there are all of 8 or 9 commercial NeXT titles, perhaps that's why NeXT provides a translator for Sun 3 software? Dan Taylor /* My opinions, not NCR's. */
dltaylor@cns.SanDiego.NCR.COM (Dan Taylor) (04/23/91)
In <9104190943.12.2494@INSIDER> sysop@insider.zer.sub.org writes: >The NeXT's hardware is about the same to the Amiga's hardware as the Amiga >is to those machines. So: NO WAY... Actually, the ONLY thing hard to emulate on a NeXT is the DSP. The CPU may be an '040 on some models, but I can run the binaries on my '030 and '882. What are a pain to "emulate" are the NeXTOS system calls. However, just as NeXT provided a Sun 3 translator, we could have a NeXT translator, use one of the PD Postscript interpreters (for a commercial project, get an Adobe license) and run all of the non-dsp applications. With an adapter board, we could even do those. A NeXT has LESS hardware than an Amiga. There are no graphics accelerators to speak of, just the DSP, and I've already listed that. We have a very powerful blitter that performs graphics on its own, including boolean operations on regions of memory. We have sound output, not as many bits, but more channels. '040 opcodes could be emulated with traps on the 68000 Amigas, but I wouldn't recommend it. I'm constantly amazed by the ignorance of the NeXT posters who "cross over". Not only do they not know anything about Amigas, but they often know EXTREMELY little about their own computers. What "hardware" is this poster refering to? The only thing in there is an '040 and 56001. The former is mostly an '030 core + parts of an '881 + 8k cache. The 56001 is nice, but, these days, a 96001 is real power (no we don't have one either). Perhaps the knowledgable NeXT owners don't have to pester us, since they're comfortable with their purchase, suspect that we are, too, and don't have to try to convince themselves by blasting us. Dan Taylor /* My opinions, not NCR's. */
cpmwc@marlin.jcu.edu.au (Matthew W Crowd) (04/23/91)
In article <904@cns.SanDiego.NCR.COM> dltaylor@cns.SanDiego.NCR.COM (Dan Taylor) writes: >In <1991Apr20.063819.8726@marlin.jcu.edu.au> cpmwc@marlin.jcu.edu.au (Matthew W Crowd) writes: > >>In case all you Amiga Freaks hadn't forgot, the only real reason why a >>computer has to emulate another is beacause of the lack of REAL software >>for its own base. > >No, not really. I had a professor who wanted an assignment done in >dBase, maybe a name, but not REAL software IMHO. I bought an A1000 and >Transformer to do it. Haven't touched dBase since. It wasn't that No wonder! Running the Transformer at about 0.5Mhz is not exactly the best platform to run/comment a peice of software on. >there is NO database software, it's just that a particular piece was >SPECIFIED. Same thing for AMAX, I presume. There's one particular title >that someone needs to run. Otherwise, the Amiga provides everything >needed. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^ If Amiga provides everything needed then why the HELL did Commodore put IBM Bus Slots in the 2000?!?!?! >By the way, since there are all of 8 or 9 commercial NeXT titles, perhaps >that's why NeXT provides a translator for Sun 3 software? I've never supported the NeXT and i never will. >Dan Taylor matt.
dltaylor@cns.SanDiego.NCR.COM (Dan Taylor) (04/25/91)
In <1991Apr23.102600.27667@marlin.jcu.edu.au> cpmwc@marlin.jcu.edu.au (Matthew W Crowd) writes: >In article <904@cns.SanDiego.NCR.COM> dltaylor@cns.SanDiego.NCR.COM (Dan Taylor) writes: >No wonder! Running the Transformer at about 0.5Mhz is not exactly the >best platform to run/comment a peice of software on. I'd run dBase, elsewhere, before. Both PC's and fast CP/M-80s. I just don't like the language. The point was that since I HAD to use dBase, I might as well emulate the PC, as buy one, since the PC didn't do anything else I needed, or wanted. >If Amiga provides everything needed then why the HELL did Commodore >put IBM Bus Slots in the 2000?!?!?! Like I said, sometimes there's that one or two things you can't avoid. F'rinstance, I upgraded to an A2500/30, a few months back. I needed a PAL/EPROM/FPLA/MicroCPU programming device. The nicest inexpensive one I could find used an XT card as a host. I still do the software development on the Amiga side, but I burn the EPROMs on the A8088 side. I could have bought a programmer that attached by serial port, and not needed the XT, but the A8088 solution was cheaper. Also, Transformer can't emulate all the physical hardware interfaces, and you're right, it's slow. So, the BridgeBoard solution works nicely when you HAVE to have a PC. If the only software a person ever wants to run is PC, or Mac, then they should buy THAT computer, not an Amiga. If there's only an occasional need, why not emulate, or coprocess, and do it well? Dan Taylor
eps@toaster.SFSU.EDU (Eric P. Scott) (04/25/91)
In article <1991Apr23.102600.27667@marlin.jcu.edu.au> cpmwc@marlin.jcu.edu.au (Matthew W Crowd) writes: >>>In case all you Amiga Freaks hadn't forgot, the only real reason why a >>>computer has to emulate another is beacause of the lack of REAL software >>>for its own base. A more practical reason: many commercial software vendors price their products based on the hardware cost of the machine it will run on; something like SoftPC pays for itself in no time if you can get "the same program" for a PeeCee price rather than a "Sun" one (look, feel, and performance notwithstanding). This is why I suspect anyone who comes up with a Mac IIci emulator for the NeXT is going to make a killing... -=EPS=- -- Nothing is as effective in stopping software piracy as selling products at a *reasonable* price.
dusek@motcid.UUCP (James P. Dusek) (04/27/91)
cpmwc@marlin.jcu.edu.au (Matthew W Crowd) writes: >If Amiga provides everything needed then why the HELL did Commodore >put IBM Bus Slots in the 2000?!?!?! The IBM slots are for the bridgeboard which runs IBM software. With the slots you than can expand the IBM side of the machine. You really should look into these things before posting them. It seems to me that you know very little about the Amiga. I own an Amiga 2000HD, and it does provide everything I need. >I've never supported the NeXT and i never will. Than what do you support?? -J.D- Motorola FSD P.S. and I am a trained NeXT service person :)
daveh@cbmvax.commodore.com (Dave Haynie) (05/02/91)
In article <909@cns.SanDiego.NCR.COM> dltaylor@cns.SanDiego.NCR.COM (Dan Taylor) writes: In <1991Apr23.102600.27667@marlin.jcu.edu.au> cpmwc@marlin.jcu.edu.au (Matthew W Crowd) writes: >If Amiga provides everything needed then why the HELL did Commodore >put IBM Bus Slots in the 2000?!?!?! It's easy. Here's a relative comparison of cards on the market: NeXT : ZorroII: .. PC : .......................................................................................................................................................................... Some cards available for the PC bus even hit a relatively small market in the 40 million+ PC industry. You'll never see these kinds of things on any other bus. A practical example are the Truevision boards. They did eventually do one for the Mac NuBus, and who knows, maybe someday there will be a Zorro bus version (there actually are similar boards from other companies out now). But Active Circuits had Truevision+BridgeCard running from Amiga software many, many moons ago. That, in my opinion, is the reason to have an AT slot extension included in the set of available Zorro bus extensions (the other, at present, obviously being the video slot). -- Dave Haynie Commodore-Amiga (Amiga 3000) "The Crew That Never Rests" {uunet|pyramid|rutgers}!cbmvax!daveh PLINK: hazy BIX: hazy "That's me in the corner, that's me in the spotlight" -R.E.M.