london@oddjob.UChicago.UUCP (David London) (04/26/84)
I would like to add my two cents to this discussion of strategy. I agree with Chuq about almost everything, but I think there are a few exceptions to his rules: 1. If I find good armour (Ac 6 or better) early, I tend to read scrolls fairly quickly to find Protect Armour. Even then I usually wait until I have something to identify in each of the categories (potions, scrolls, ring/staff/wand. However, if I find *VERY* good armour (Ac 8 or better), I tend to read scrolls as soon as I find them. The possibility of getting Protect Armour with very good armour is worth the risk of blowing a scroll. (I have had very good success with these tactics, having won 5.3 4 times). Also, this may be obvious, but one should always drag monsters over unknown scrolls to identify the SCARE MONSTER scroll. 2. I haven't found that a long sword is that much better than the mace. In 5.2, an unenchanted mace was worth 2d4 (damage), a long sword 3d4, and a two-hander 4d4. In 5.3, I haven't found this to be different. I have found that without good armour, a two-handed sword won't get you through the lower levels, but with good armour, even your mace will often do. The one other tactic that I use (also probably obvious) is to start dropping around level 17. David (Guitar) London
chuqui@nsc.UUCP (Chuq Von Rospach) (06/08/84)
I disagree with a few of the hints. Here are my views on the subject: >Only kill L/N/I's if you can get at least 7 arrow shots into them. As long as your strength is reasonable Ice monsters should only need one or two arrows. If you hit them once you can almost always whap them to death with one blow. Ice monsters give you lots of experience points (5 normally) for the level they are at and are neccessary to get the levels you need to survive deeper. You can't afford to ignore them that much. >Discard cursed items *immediately* (unless it's cursed armor, like -1 plate, >which can be spruced up). This includes bad potions, rings, scrolls, etc. It is better to keep things as long as possible (without using them of course) and discarding them only when your pack is full and you find something you want. If you get hit by a nymph and all you have is good stuff, you lose something worthwhile. If you have your pack full of junk there is a better chance of losing something you won't really miss. Besides, certain 'cursed' things have their own advantages in certain circumstances. >Rings of regeneration are >generally more useful in the earlier stages of the game, to save you from >hobgoblins, quaggas, and centaurs. They don't work fast enough by the time >you are attacking trolls. if you haven't discovered the fine art of 'running away' then you haven't figured out how useful regeneration is. It is CRITICAL in lower levels. >Past level 16, potions of healing aren't much use. Quaff them right away >if you are at full hit points; they will add 2 or 3 HP to your total. healing adds one point. Extra healing adds 2 and occasionally three. -- From the ledge of the seventh cornice: Chuq Von Rospach {amd70,fortune,hplabs,ihnp4}!nsc!chuqui (408) 733-2600 x242 If you let a smile be your umbrella you will get rain up your nose.
chip@t4test.UUCP (06/09/84)
=== REFERENCED ARTICLE =================================== From: chuqui@nsc.UUCP (Chuq Von Rospach) >Discard cursed items *immediately* (unless it's cursed armor, like -1 plate, >which can be spruced up). This includes bad potions, rings, scrolls, etc. It is better to keep things as long as possible (without using them of course) and discarding them only when your pack is full and you find something you want. If you get hit by a nymph and all you have is good stuff, you lose something worthwhile. ========================================================== It is simply *amazing* what one can do with a full pack and a scare monsters scroll... -- Chip Rosenthal, Intel/Santa Clara {idi|intelca|icalqa|imcgpe|kremvax|qubix|ucscc}!t4test!{chip|news}
robison@eosp1.UUCP (Tobias D. Robison) (06/14/84)
References: David Norris's set of hints contains several suggestions that I believe are wrong: You generally do not need 7 arrows to kill L/N/I's. Your current strength and experience is a big factor, and you should develop a feel for the space you really need. L's should ALWAYS be attacked on the way down; all you can lose is gold, and they may be standing on the object you need to win. When you want to build up your experience, don't sit at the stairway, for levels 1 to 16 at least. Instead, search rapidly about the level, going to the doorway of every room. You will find more monsters, and they will rarely get a chance to gang up on you. If you are wearing a ring of slow digestion, be careful of its adverse effect on your dexterity. Try rings on at the start of a game that you don't really care about. You can always start over if the ring is cursed. In rogue 5.2, your chances of surviving a cursed ring are not good. I don't know about 5.3 in this regard. For rogue 5.2 and lower revs, but not rogue 5.3: Instead of discarding cursed items at once, get used to being careful not to use them. You need a full pack to get maximum use of a scroll of scare monster. It usually takes a while longer to build a full pack of useful items. The list of useful objects did not include the single most useful object in rogue 5.2 -- the ring of stealth. You get excellent value from this ring if you put it on just before entering a room, or changing levels, and take it off as soon as you enter the room. It often works well in a party room. A most important hint: If you are getting consistently killed by one kind of monster, the most likely reason is that you are meeting the monster before building up an adequate level of experience. The game makes this a problem at several points in the adventure. The easiest way to build up lots of experience is to have plenty of the game's second most valuable item -- food. - Toby Robison (not Robinson!) allegra!eosp1!robison decvax!ittvax!eosp1!robison princeton!eosp1!robison
ray@utcsrgv.UUCP (Raymond Allen) (06/15/84)
> If you are wearing > a ring of slow digestion, be careful of its adverse effect on your > dexterity. Is this true? Does wearing a ring of slow digestion reduce your dexterity? By how much? Anyone got any info on this? Ray Allen utcsrgv!ray (416) 978-5036
alex@utcsrgv.UUCP (Alexander Stoyenko) (06/15/84)
Just a short question. What kind of effect does the ring of slow digestion have on one's dexterity? Alex Stoyenko Caesar
acscmjm@sunybcs.UUCP (Michael J. Moroney) (06/18/84)
Also, another use for cursed/useless items is, if you have high strength and lots of room, you can actually THROW them and kill wimpy creatures like nymphs. I once had 18 str, rustproofed splint armor, lots of extra useless armor (some cursed, some just worse than what I had) and exactly 0 arrows. I walked into a large room with a nymph, and being too greedy to just leave her alone, I stood back and threw ARMOR at her, and yes, I killed her!! It took 6 suits of armor to do her in, though. I am not sure, but I think armor does 1d0 or 1d1 so I got her on strength bonuses alone. So don't try this unless you are STRONG (or really want to lose a real goody and are a bit of a masochist :-)) Madman
ksl@hou2e.UUCP (K.LIU) (10/17/84)
reply to all those "what is this scroll message": Yes, I agree that "maniacal laughter" is the scare monster. I'm not to sure, but I, note that I, think that a "strange sence of loss", at least on SuperRogue, is one of the "detect" scrolls. Either that, or "hold monster" as suggested. To those playing "old" versions and wish for super armor: For your sake, the chances of finding plate mail is 1 in 100. The chance of finding armor is 1 in 12 (close). Therefore, there is only a 1 in 1200 chance of finding plate mail (discouraging). Also, leather is 1 in 20, making it have a chance of being found 1 in 240. The chances for super-items are LOW. For example, genocide has about a 1 in 250 chance of being found. Others, such as two-handed swords and scare monster scrolls are very low. Please note, though, that scare monster scrolls will NORMALLY come in groups of 2-5, although 1 is possible. Hope this is new stuff, I've been here neting since December! ___ Gandalf "I can't kill monsters - it's against my religion."
colonel@gloria.UUCP (George Sicherman) (10/23/84)
[R.I.P. ... killed by a Bug] > To those playing "old" versions and wish for super armor: > For your sake, the chances of finding plate mail is 1 in 100. > The chance of finding armor is 1 in 12 (close). > Therefore, there is only a 1 in 1200 chance of finding plate > mail (discouraging). Also, leather is 1 in 20, making it > have a chance of being found 1 in 240. For the record, here are the corresponding stats for BSD rogue: Symbol Item %(V3) %(V5.2) ------ ] Armor 9 8 : Food 18 17 ! Potion 27 27 = Ring 5 5 ? Scroll 27 30 / Staff or Wand 5 5 ) Weapon 9 8 Name Class (5.3) % ---- Leather armor [8] [2] 20 Studded leather armor [7] [3] 15 Ring mail [7] [3] 15 Scale mail [6] [4] 13 Chain mail [5] [5] 12 Splint mail [4] [6] 10 Banded mail [4] [6] 10 Plate mail [3] [7] 5 (Extracted from the R.V.M., of course.) -- Col. G. L. Sicherman ...seismo!rochester!rocksanne!rocksvax!sunybcs!gloria!colonel
ksl@hou2e.UUCP (K.LIU) (10/27/84)
I have a different story from that of the colonel.
Below is an extraction from the actual source... (My comments in [])
"leather armor", [names - match with below figures]
"ring mail",
"studded leather armor",
"scale mail",
"chain mail",
"splint mail",
"banded mail",
"plate mail",
...
20, [1 in n chance for armor - corresponds to above]
35,
50,
63,
75,
85,
95,
100
...
8, [and it's AC]
7,
7,
6,
5,
4,
4,
3,
[below, monster damage etc. added for your use]
[ISMEAN - does something bad to you; ISINVIS - invisible; ISGREED - runs to
loot; ISREGEN - regenerates]
/* Name CARRY FLAG str, exp, lvl, amr, hpt, dmg */
{ "giant ant", 0, ISMEAN, { XX, 9, 2, 3, ___, "1d6" } },
{ "bat", 0, 0, { XX, 1, 1, 3, ___, "1d2" } },
{ "centaur", 15, 0, { XX, 15, 4, 4, ___, "1d6/1d6" } },
{ "dragon", 100, ISMEAN, { XX,6800, 10, -1, ___, "1d8/1d8/3d10" } },
{ "floating eye",0, 0, { XX, 5, 1, 9, ___, "0d0" } },
/* NOTE: the damage is %%% so that xstr won't merge this */
/* string with others, since it is written on in the program */
{ "violet fungi",0, ISMEAN, { XX, 80, 8, 3, ___, "%%%d0" } },
{ "gnome", 10, 0, { XX, 7, 1, 5, ___, "1d6" } },
{ "hobgoblin", 0, ISMEAN, { XX, 3, 1, 5, ___, "1d8" } },
{ "invisible stalker",0,ISINVIS,{ XX,120, 8, 3, ___, "4d4" } },
{ "jackal", 0, ISMEAN, { XX, 2, 1, 7, ___, "1d2" } },
{ "kobold", 0, ISMEAN, { XX, 1, 1, 7, ___, "1d4" } },
{ "leprechaun", 0, 0, { XX, 10, 3, 8, ___, "1d1" } },
{ "mimic", 30, 0, { XX,100, 7, 7, ___, "3d4" } },
{ "nymph", 100, 0, { XX, 37, 3, 9, ___, "0d0" } },
{ "orc", 15, ISGREED,{ XX, 5, 1, 6, ___, "1d8" } },
{ "purple worm", 70, 0, { XX,4000, 15, 6, ___, "2d12/2d4" } },
{ "quasit", 30, ISMEAN, { XX, 32, 3, 2, ___, "1d2/1d2/1d4" } },
{ "rust monster",0, ISMEAN, { XX, 20, 5, 2, ___, "0d0/0d0" } },
{ "snake", 0, ISMEAN, { XX, 2, 1, 5, ___, "1d3" } },
{ "troll", 50, ISREGEN|ISMEAN,{ XX, 120, 6, 4, ___, "1d8/1d8/2d6" } },
{ "umber hulk", 40, ISMEAN, { XX,200, 8, 2, ___, "3d4/3d4/2d5" } },
{ "vampire", 20, ISREGEN|ISMEAN,{ XX,350, 8, 1, ___, "1d10" } },
{ "wraith", 0, 0, { XX, 55, 5, 4, ___, "1d6" } },
{ "xorn", 0, ISMEAN, { XX,190, 7, -2, ___, "1d3/1d3/1d3/4d6" } },
{ "yeti", 30, 0, { XX, 50, 4, 6, ___, "1d6/1d6" } },
{ "zombie", 0, ISMEAN, { XX, 6, 2, 8, ___, "1d8" } }
};
[chances for treasure...]
{ 0, 27 }, /* potion */
{ 0, 30 }, /* scroll */
{ 0, 17 }, /* food */
{ 0, 8 }, /* weapon */
{ 0, 8 }, /* armor */
{ 0, 5 }, /* ring */
{ 0, 5 }, /* stick */
[chances for scrolls max. # found, chance]
[ in group]
{ "monster confusion", 8, 140 },
{ "magic mapping", 5, 150 },
{ "hold monster", 3, 180 },
{ "sleep", 5, 5 },
{ "enchant armor", 8, 160 },
{ "identify", 27, 100 },
{ "scare monster", 4, 200 },
{ "gold detection", 4, 50 },
{ "teleportation", 7, 165 },
{ "enchant weapon", 10, 150 },
{ "create monster", 5, 75 },
{ "remove curse", 8, 105 },
{ "aggravate monsters", 4, 20 },
{ "blank paper", 1, 5 },
{ "genocide", 1, 300 },
Gandalfrwl@uvacs.UUCP (Ray Lubinsky) (10/30/84)
> I have a different story from that of the colonel. > Below is an extraction from the actual source... (My comments in []) > > "leather armor", [names - match with below figures] > "ring mail", > "studded leather armor", > "scale mail", > "chain mail", > "splint mail", > "banded mail", > "plate mail", > ... > > Gandalf This is great, but I'm not familiar with any of the creatures in the version described. Does have access to the same info for Version 5.3 ? If so, I'm sure there are a lot of us out here in net-land that would love to see it posted! Any takers? ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Ray Lubinsky University of Virginia, Dept. of Computer Science uucp: decvax!mcnc!ncsu!uvacs!rwl
rwl@uvacs.UUCP (Ray Lubinsky) (10/30/84)
<<You hear maniacal laughter in the distance--More-->> > I have a different story from that of the colonel. > Below is an extraction from the actual source... (My comments in []) > > "leather armor", [names - match with below figures] > "ring mail", > "studded leather armor", > "scale mail", > "chain mail", > "splint mail", > "banded mail", > "plate mail", > ... > > Gandalf This is great! My problem is that I'm playing version 5.3 with different monsters and slightly different magic. Does anyone have something similar for 5.3? If so, I'm sure a lot of us rogueists in net-land would love to see it posted! ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Ray Lubinsky University of Virginia, Dept. of Computer Science uucp: decvax!mcnc!ncsu!uvacs!rwl