ir230@sdcc6.ucsd.EDU (john wavrik) (08/12/88)
I've used PKARC because it is fast and because of the support program PKFIND (it works like WHEREIS programs -- but will also search for a file inside archive files). I've recently started to use ZOO because it can handle directory hierarchy and because of the support program STUFF (it allows users to archive files meeting certain conditions -- for example all those modified after a certain date) The result is that most of my little used files are stored in ARC format (to save space on hard disk) but fractional backups and transfers to another computer are in ZOO format. It would be convenient to use one format. ZOO is probably closer to meeting all my needs -- if only there were a "ZOOFIND" utility [and a small "ZOOE" extractor that could be packaged with software sent to people who might not have ZOO]. --John J Wavrik jjwavrik@ucsd.edu
dhesi@bsu-cs.UUCP (Rahul Dhesi) (08/13/88)
In article <19807@tut.cis.ohio-state.edu> mdf@tut.cis.osu-state.edu (Mark D. Freeman) writes: >The only major thing left to put into ZOO >is the ability to create needed directories. It is a real drag to have >to create all the needed directories manually before I can un-ZOO an >archive. Bill Davidsen has suggested (quite gently) that the zoo documentation could use some improvement, and I'm beginning to (reluctantly) believe him. It *is* a real drag to manually create all needed directories, but only if you don't tell zoo to do it for you: zoo x archive -- extract files into current directory zoo x/ archive -- extract files into correct subdirectories, but subdirectories must already exist zoo x// archive -- extract files into correct subdirectories, creating subdirectories as needed zoo x.// -- as above, but create all subdirectories relative to current directory -- Rahul Dhesi UUCP: <backbones>!{iuvax,pur-ee,uunet}!bsu-cs!dhesi
svirsky@ttidca.TTI.COM (William Svirsky) (08/13/88)
In article <19807@tut.cis.ohio-state.edu> mdf@tut.cis.osu-state.edu (Mark D. Freeman) writes: >STUFF is a wonderful tool. The only major thing left to put into ZOO >is the ability to create needed directories. It is a real drag to have >to create all the needed directories manually before I can un-ZOO an >archive. I don't know which version of ZOO you have but version 2.00 has that capability, and I think versions from 1.5 on do also. From the STUFF manual: _The primary purpose of the public domain program Stuff 1.0 is to generate _pathnames that may be fed to zoo version 1.5 or later to allow it to _recursively archive a directory hierarchy in compressed form. Invoke it as _"stuff" without any parameters to get a help screen. Stuff should work on _any MS-DOS system; IBM compatibility is not a requirement. _ _Stuff is generally used as follows: _ _ stuff /new | zoo aI newfiles _ _The above pipeline causes Stuff to generate a list of all files in /new and _its subdirectories and feed them to zoo, which in turn reads each filename _and adds that file to the archive "newfiles.zoo". Later, the zoo archive _can be extracted with _ _ zoo x.// newfiles _ _to recreate the original directory hierarchy. One '/' tells zoo to un-zoo a directory hierarchy. Two '/'s tell zoo to un-zoo a directory hierarchy AND to create a directory if it doesn't exist. -- Bill Svirsky, Citicorp+TTI, 3100 Ocean Park Blvd., Santa Monica, CA 90405 Work phone: 213-450-9111 x2597 svirsky@ttidca.tti.com | ...!{csun,psivax,rdlvax,retix}!ttidca!svirsky
rickc@agora.UUCP (Rick Coates) (08/14/88)
In article <3647@bsu-cs.UUCP>, dhesi@bsu-cs.UUCP (Rahul Dhesi) writes: > ... > zoo x// archive -- extract files into correct subdirectories, > creating subdirectories as needed > zoo x.// -- as above, but create all subdirectories relative > to current directory > -- > Rahul Dhesi UUCP: <backbones>!{iuvax,pur-ee,uunet}!bsu-cs!dhesi I greatly appreciate Mr. Dhesi's efforts (in creating ZOO and moderating comp.binaries.ibm.pc) but: (there's always one of those... :-) ) the problem that I have with zoo is the good old CRLF problem between DOS and unix. So, I am still forced to make a tar file and then zoo that. Note that ARC has this problem, too, plus is far harder to port than zoo (SO - ZOO is better than ARC). Incidently, I find zoo files better than straight tar files to transfer, not because of the compression, but because of the error checking. I have had to use an ethernet connection that dropped blocks on occasion without notice, and tar does not check that. Why did the creators of the tar format include _directory_ checksums but not _file_ checksums? Rick Coates tektronix!reed!percival!agora!rickc OR tektronix!sequent!islabs!ateq!rick
feg@clyde.ATT.COM (Forrest Gehrke) (08/16/88)
In article <3802@sdcc6.ucsd.EDU>, ir230@sdcc6.ucsd.EDU (john wavrik) writes: > > I've used PKARC because it is fast and because of the support program > PKFIND (it works like WHEREIS programs -- but will also search for a > file inside archive files). > -- if only there were a "ZOOFIND" > utility [and a small "ZOOE" extractor that could be packaged with software > sent to people who might not have ZOO]. > > I would guess that a lot of us have arrived at the stage of thinking "a plague on both your houses" with the SEA/PK battles. Along with John Wavrik I would miss the many little supporting utilities for ARC and PK, particularly file finders that can search globally through a HD, archives an all, as well as the menu utilities such as SHARC and PKARCM. Hopefully these will come along if we shift over to ZOO. I am glad that Rahul has pointed out that ZOO can be prevented from creating a directory structure. This may be inviting to some, but I prefer no external choices of directories on my disk. Forrest Gehrke
jgray@toad.pilchuck.Data-IO.COM (Jerry Late Nite Gray) (08/16/88)
In article <19807@tut.cis.ohio-state.edu>, mdf@tut.cis.ohio-state.edu (Mark D. Freeman) writes: > In <3802@sdcc6.ucsd.EDU> ir230@sdcc6.ucsd.EDU (john wavrik) writes: > >I've used PKARC because it is fast and because of the support program > >PKFIND (it works like WHEREIS programs -- but will also search for a > >file inside archive files). > > ... > > STUFF is a wonderful tool. The only major thing left to put into ZOO > is the ability to create needed directories. It is a real drag to have > to create all the needed directories manually before I can un-ZOO an > archive. > -- I've noticed the same limitation to the point I refuse to use ZOO. DOS is such a pain there is no way to automate the process of CD'ing and MKDIR'ing to hell and back just to unarchive a complex collection. I tried experimenting with ZOO about a year ago and had hoped that this was just a lack of maturity in the product and I might test it again when it grows up. Sad to here that after a year it has not. There is one possibility though. We both might be misusing the product. How do all you ZOOites out there unpack a ZOO archive into non-existent subdirectories? I wonder if the present survey would show different results if someone would publish a document showing how one does comparative operations in both tools such as: 1) Blind packing of everything in present directory down into one archive file. 2) Same as (1) but onto multiple floppies, network (PC-NFS or NOVELL) drives and/or tape drives. 3) Blind unpacking of archive (we don't know what sub-directories are needed). 4) Archive inquiries. a) a directory of everything on archive. b) intelligent file/directory searches with RE wild cards (i.e. unix like "FIL*[A-Z]*.*Q*" search strings) c) file/directory statistics (size, dates, CRC, etc.). 5) IN general, how well it works with managing source and binaries on the net. 6) Peculiarities in going from DOS and UNIX. I would love to hear if there is a good automatic algorithm for conversions of mixed case, longer than 8 character Unix filenames into DOS filenames. That last one may seem odd, but I have often come across Unix based software with the desire to someday port it to a PC. It is annoying to have to unpack it, change the filename (and makefile) to fit DOS's conventions and repack it. --------------- Jerrold L. Gray UUCP:{ihnp4|caip|tektronix|ucbvax}!uw-beaver!tikal!pilchuck!jgray USNAIL: 10525 Willows Road N.E. /C-46 Redmond, Wa. 98052 (206) 881 - 6444 x470 Telex: 15-2167
dhesi@bsu-cs.UUCP (Rahul Dhesi) (08/16/88)
In article <973@pilchuck.Data-IO.COM> jgray@toad.pilchuck.Data-IO.COM writes: >How do all you ZOOites out there unpack a ZOO archive into non-existent >subdirectories? (Hmmm...while we're on the subject, how do you ARCites unpack an ARC archive into non-existent subdirectories? Inquiring zoo users want to know.) Anyway, I looked in the zoo 2.0 manual, and here is what it says: / Extract to original pathname. Any needed directories must already exist. In the absence of this modifier all files are extracted into the current directory. If this modifier is doubled as //, required directories need not exist and are created if necessary. I suspect a lot of people are relying on the help screen alone and have not really read the manual. Admittedly, the manual needs some improvement, but the information *is* there. The same information is repeated in the Stuff 1.0 manual too. -- Rahul Dhesi UUCP: <backbones>!{iuvax,pur-ee,uunet}!bsu-cs!dhesi
asg@pyuxf.UUCP (alan geller) (08/17/88)
In article <973@pilchuck.Data-IO.COM>, jgray@toad.UUCP writes: > In article <19807@tut.cis.ohio-state.edu>, mdf@tut.cis.ohio-state.edu (Mark D. Freeman) writes: > > STUFF is a wonderful tool. The only major thing left to put into ZOO > > is the ability to create needed directories. It is a real drag to have > > to create all the needed directories manually before I can un-ZOO an > > archive. > I've noticed the same limitation to the point I refuse to use ZOO. DOS is > such a pain there is no way to automate the process of CD'ing and MKDIR'ing > to hell and back just to unarchive a complex collection. > I tried experimenting with ZOO about a year ago and had hoped that this was > just a lack of maturity in the product and I might test it again when it grows > up. Sad to here that after a year it has not. > > There is one possibility though. We both might be misusing the product. > How do all you ZOOites out there unpack a ZOO archive into non-existent > subdirectories? If you created your zoo archive with directory information saved (which I assume you did; it's the default), then try zoo x// archive file_list to retrieve the listed files, creating directories as needed. If you want to get every file in the archive (i.e., burst the archive), try zoo x// archive This works for me both on Unix and PC-DOS. > 1) Blind packing of everything in present directory down into one > archive file. zoo a archive * or zoo aM archive * (to delete files after creating archive) > 2) Same as (1) but onto multiple floppies, network (PC-NFS or NOVELL) > drives and/or tape drives. I don't think ZOO currently supports this, but neither does ARC, or PKARC, to the best of my knowledge; you have to use BACKUP. > 3) Blind unpacking of archive (we don't know what sub-directories are > needed). zoo x// archive > 4) Archive inquiries. > a) a directory of everything on archive. zoo l archive > b) intelligent file/directory searches with RE wild cards > (i.e. unix like "FIL*[A-Z]*.*Q*" search strings) zoo l archive 'fil*[a-z]*.*q*' you can eliminate the single quotes on MS-DOS, but you need them on Unix. > c) file/directory statistics (size, dates, CRC, etc.). Part of the normal directory. > 6) Peculiarities in going from DOS and UNIX. I would love to hear if > there is a good automatic algorithm for conversions of mixed > case, longer than 8 character Unix filenames into DOS > filenames. I suppose truncation isn't considered a good algorithm ... Actually, I believe the full name is stored in the archive; the case conversion and truncation happens when you extract the file. Alan Geller I have no connection with ZOO or Rahul Dhesi, other than as a highly satisfied user. Bellcore My employer couldn't care less what I think, so neither should you.
pjh@mccc.UUCP (Pete Holsberg) (08/23/88)
Do you have the ZOO source for SysV? Would you mail me a copy if you
do? Thanks.
Pete Holsberg UUCP: {...!rutgers!}princeton!mccc!pjh
Technology Division ...!att!jonlab!mccc!pjh
Mercer College CompuServe: 70240,334
1200 Old Trenton Road GEnie: PJHOLSBERG
Trenton, NJ 08690 Voice: 1-609-586-4800