KOLB@HTIKUB5.BITNET (02/23/89)
hi,
now that Phil Katz' new non-ARC compression program (PKZ090.EXE in
SIMTEL's PD1:<MSDOS.ZIP> directory) is out, people might be interested in
a first evaluation.
After a few days of playing around with it (including transfer of more
than 100 ARC-files to ZIP-files) I got the following impression.
1. PKZIP in default mode ("shrinking") is about as fast PKPAK/PKARC,
mostly insignificantly slower, sometimes slitely faster.
2. The ZIP-files produced in default mode were overall slitely smaller
than the corresponding ARC-files produced by PKPAK/PKARC. Big files
compressed even considerably better than under PKarc, small binaries were
about the same, and small ASCII-files did slitely worse.
3. The extended compression option of PKZIP works like a charm on
binaries. Even level one (50% slower than default mode) produces
ZIP-files considerably smaller than files produced by NoGate's PAK--at not
much more than half the time. And there lay worlds between the filesizes
of a PAK-file and a ZIP-file produced by level 4 (at about the same
speed).
4. On ASCII-files, however, the extended option is a mixed blessing: At
least level 1 seems to consistently produce bigger ZIP-files than the
default method. On not too big files some level will eventually reach and
eventually undercut the size of the NoGate-PAK-file (PAK is not very
efficient on small ASCIIs anyway), but the generalization seems to be: The
bigger an ASCII-file is, the bigger the overhead of the extended
option--up to the point where even level 4 produces bigger ZIP-files than
the default method. Fortunately the modes can (in fact, have to) be
specified seperately for binary and ASCII files.
5. Extraction times are about the same as for PKPAK/PKARC (slitely better
for files compressed with the extended method), and about 3 times as fast
as NoGate's PAK.
Some examples: (time_needed/Size_of_compressed_file)
Small Binaries Big Binaries Small ASCII BIG ASCII
(66 COM/EXE files) (2 EXE files) (40 C-sources) (1 text file)
1003527 bytes 360224 bytes 540531 bytes 643437 bytes
PKPAK/PKARC 1:44/731868 0:58/390219 0:48/242499 0:49/289800
NoGate PAK 4:42/674216 2:35/354061 1:56/240153 2:15/256231
PKZIP (default) 1:46/731595 1:02/381819 0:51/244284 0:55/264638
PKZIP -e?1 3:05/640774 1:39/331441 1:44/253859 1:47/291901
PKZIP -e?2 3:16/632277 1:40/322148 1:46/241161 1:49/275310
PKZIP -e?3 3:42/624898 1:44/315122 1:53/228533 1:56/264278
PKZIP -e?4 4:44/620614 1:58/311045 1:58/220348 2:18/255922
Just to illustrate my point (4), here are the figures for a huge textfile
(942449 bytes): PKPAK/PKARC 1:16/468810
NoGatePAK 3:31/420028
PKZIP(def) 1:23/431879
PKZIP -ea4 3:20/431919
To summarize: PKZIP in default mode is every bit as fast and efficient as
the defunct PKPAK/PKARC, and that means, clearly superior to the infamous
SEA-products. If time is not all that important, the extended mode is a
beauty for binary files. My own compromise between speed and size is
PKZIP -eb3 meaning: extended method level 3 for binaries, default mode for
ASCII.
Overall, I think, Phil Katz and the others did a beautiful job on this new
program. I, myself, will most certainly switch to PKZIP and I'm happy that
the reasons for that don't have to be purely "moral". (just transforming
my ARC-files to ZIP-files gave me another 1.5MB of free space).
P.S.: I have no connection whatsoever with PKWARE Inc. or anyone else in
this business. (In fact, I didn't even pay my registration yet...)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
hans-peter kolb, Tilburg University, Holland kolb@htikub5.bitnetkluge@lan.informatik.tu-muenchen.dbp.de (Oliver Kluge) (03/15/89)
In article <KPETERSEN.12477289400.BABYL@WSMR-SIMTEL20.ARMY.MIL> KOLB@HTIKUB5.BITNET writes: [Some very interesting "benchmark" figures about PAK, PKARC and ARC had to be deleted due to size reduction (compression?).] >the defunct PKPAK/PKARC, and that means, clearly superior to the infamous >SEA-products. If time is not all that important, the extended mode is a >beauty for binary files. My own compromise between speed and size is >PKZIP -eb3 meaning: extended method level 3 for binaries, default mode for >ASCII. > >Overall, I think, Phil Katz and the others did a beautiful job on this new >program. I, myself, will most certainly switch to PKZIP and I'm happy that >the reasons for that don't have to be purely "moral". (just transforming >my ARC-files to ZIP-files gave me another 1.5MB of free space). > >P.S.: I have no connection whatsoever with PKWARE Inc. or anyone else in >this business. (In fact, I didn't even pay my registration yet...) But now another question arises: What about compatibility????? I already have PKARC, and PKZIP seems to be better, but will it uncompress .ARC-Files?? ARC is still the standard! If PKZIP isn't able to read - if not write - .ARC-Files, this means I have to keep SEA's ARC (or the old PKARC) together with PKZIP in order to be able to read stuff from colleagues or the net! Perhaps the author of the above could say a word or two about this topic. Thanx! So long ... :-) Oliver -- TTTU MMMMM kluge%lan.informatik.tu-muenchen.dbp.de@relay.cs.net (CS-NET, ARPA) T U U M M Oliver Kluge, Parallel Computing Lab, \ unido.UUCP (UUCP) T U M M M Technical University Munich, Arcisstr. 21, 8000-Munich 2, W. Germany T UUU M M "Why stop now just when I'm hating it?" Marvin, the paranoid android
ejb@think.COM (Erik Bailey) (03/17/89)
In article <688@infovax.lan.informatik.tu-muenchen.dbp.de> kluge@lan.informatik.tu-muenchen.dbp.de (Oliver Kluge) writes: >In article <KPETERSEN.12477289400.BABYL@WSMR-SIMTEL20.ARMY.MIL> KOLB@HTIKUB5.BITNET writes: >> [deleted ] > >But now another question arises: What about compatibility????? >I already have PKARC, and PKZIP seems to be better, but will it >uncompress .ARC-Files?? ARC is still the standard! If PKZIP isn't >able to read - if not write - .ARC-Files, this means I have to keep >SEA's ARC (or the old PKARC) together with PKZIP in order to be able >to read stuff from colleagues or the net! >Perhaps the author of the above could say a word or two about this >topic. Thanx! > >Oliver Well, I'll address the above. No, PKZIP is *not* .ARC compatible. It cannot be. By the agreement signed by PKWARE and SEA, PKWARE had to stop producing *all* .ARC-compatible software by Dec. 31, 1989. So, therefore, PKZIP cannot write nor read .ARC files. Big deal! I actually have several archive programs: SEA's ARC 5.31, for extracting stubborn archives with CRC errors (PK;s doesn't handle them as well), PKARC 3.6, LU (a .LBR utility -- anyone remember THAT??), and PKZIP 0.90 (haven't gotten around to getting 0.92 yet). Which one do I use? PKZIP whenever I can, and PKARC to extract the stuff from the archives I download. Incidentally, quite a few .ZIP files are appearing on BBSs, and a few have converted EXCLUSIVELY to .ZIP files. I myself converted all my ARCs to ZIPs, and use ZIP to back my 20meg HD onto my old 10meg (since it'll do recursive directory parsing). Under -eb4 -ea4 is just barely fits. I *love* ZIP. It's far and away betetr than .ARC. I thought the whole SEA-PKWARE thing was rediculous. But this is a clear case of a better product. I think it will do to .ARC what .ARC did to .LBR/.LQR -- slowly phase it out. *ESPECIALLY* when the VMS, Unix, and Amiga versions are released. --Erik PS -- I'm a registered user of PKARC and PKZIP. Erik Bailey | CompuServe | 7 Oak Knoll | (ARPA/USENET courtesy of ejb@think.UUCP | PCMagNet | Arlington, MA 02174 | Thinking Machines Corp., ejb@think.com | 72241,105 | (617) 643-0732 | First St, Cambridge, MA) do headache -> take 1 aspirin od "This terminates one way or another" -Dijkstra
wfp5p@euclid.acc.Virginia.EDU (William F. Pemberton) (03/20/89)
In article <688@infovax.lan.informatik.tu-muenchen.dbp.de> kluge@lan.informatik.tu-muenchen.dbp.de (Oliver Kluge) writes: >But now another question arises: What about compatibility????? >I already have PKARC, and PKZIP seems to be better, but will it >uncompress .ARC-Files?? ARC is still the standard! If PKZIP isn't >able to read - if not write - .ARC-Files, this means I have to keep >SEA's ARC (or the old PKARC) together with PKZIP in order to be able >to read stuff from colleagues or the net! >Perhaps the author of the above could say a word or two about this >topic. Thanx! > NO! pkZip is not going to be able to deal with ARCS. This is the whole reason that we have Zip now. SEA has basically said (with the suit against PK) that they do not want anybody but themselves writing programs that do the same job as ARC. As I see it, if zip takes over as the "standard" then we will have to keep something like PkArc around for a while (since we will still run into and "old" arc file from time to time) but that isn't any big deal, it doesn't take up a load of space. I am not really favoring any one package, yet. I have been playing with zip a little bit, but the jury is still out for me. +----------------------------------------------------------------------------+ |Bill Pemberton flash@virginia.bitnet wfp5p@virginia.bitnet | |(804)296-FRYD flash@virginia.edu wfp5p@virginia.edu | |Academic Computing Center +-----------------------------------------------+ |University of Virginia | "I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, and sex, | |Charlottesville, Va 22904 | but they've always worked for me" - H.Thompson| +----------------------------+-----------------------------------------------+
marty1@hounx.ATT.COM (M.B.BRILLIANT) (03/20/89)
From article <544@babbage.acc.virginia.edu>, by wfp5p@euclid.acc.Virginia.EDU (William F. Pemberton): > .... SEA has basically said (with the suit against PK) that > they do not want anybody but themselves writing programs that do the same job > as ARC. As I see it, if zip takes over as the "standard" then we will have > to keep something like PkArc around for a while (since we will still run into > and "old" arc file from time to time) ..... It doesn't even look as though we are allowed to keep PKARC. Maybe just PKXARC, and then only if we use it only to read PKARC files, not SeaArc files. Can I use ARCE? I'm confused. Is NoGate's PAK legal? It's cheap, reasonably compatible (except that it can't read PK's comments), and is supposed to read and write all kinds of ARC and PAK files. I was going to send them a registration, but now you're raising doubts about their legitimacy. M. B. Brilliant Marty AT&T-BL HO 3D-520 (201) 949-1858 Holmdel, NJ 07733 att!homxc!marty Disclaimer: Opinions stated herein are mine unless and until my employer explicitly claims them; then I lose all rights to them.
kluge@lan.informatik.tu-muenchen.dbp.de (Oliver Kluge) (03/21/89)
In article <37583@think.UUCP> ejb@godot.think.com.UUCP (Erik Bailey) writes: >Well, I'll address the above. No, PKZIP is *not* .ARC compatible. >It cannot be. By the agreement signed by PKWARE and SEA, PKWARE had >to stop producing *all* .ARC-compatible software by Dec. 31, 1989. >So, therefore, PKZIP cannot write nor read .ARC files. > >Big deal! I actually have several archive programs: SEA's ARC 5.31, for >extracting stubborn archives with CRC errors (PK;s doesn't handle them >as well), PKARC 3.6, LU (a .LBR utility -- anyone remember THAT??), >and PKZIP 0.90 (haven't gotten around to getting 0.92 yet). Which one >do I use? PKZIP whenever I can, and PKARC to extract the stuff from the >archives I download. Incidentally, quite a few .ZIP files are appearing >on BBSs, and a few have converted EXCLUSIVELY to .ZIP files. I myself >converted all my ARCs to ZIPs, and use ZIP to back my 20meg HD onto >my old 10meg (since it'll do recursive directory parsing). Under >-eb4 -ea4 is just barely fits. Okay, so I will need the *last* version of PKARC that has been produced because P.K. won't ship any of them, am I right? Can someone *please* tell me what the very last version number was, and *please* >>> P O S T <<< that version to c.b.i.p so anyone wanting to switch to PKZIP gets the opportunity to UNARC with a really fast ARC-compatible program *and* to gain size reduction by PKZIP. Thanxa10^6 :-) Oliver -- TTTU MMMMM kluge%lan.informatik.tu-muenchen.dbp.de@relay.cs.net (CS-NET, ARPA) T U U M M Oliver Kluge, Parallel Computing Lab, \ unido.UUCP (UUCP) T U M M M Technical University Munich, Arcisstr. 21, 8000-Munich 2, W. Germany T UUU M M "Why stop now just when I'm hating it?" Marvin, the paranoid android
maa@nbires.nbi.com (Mark Armbrust) (03/22/89)
In article <1290@hounx.ATT.COM> marty1@hounx.ATT.COM (M.B.BRILLIANT) writes: > >It doesn't even look as though we are allowed to keep PKARC. Maybe >just PKXARC, and then only if we use it only to read PKARC files, not >SeaArc files. Can I use ARCE? I'm confused. > >Is NoGate's PAK legal? It's cheap, reasonably compatible (except that >it can't read PK's comments), and is supposed to read and write all >kinds of ARC and PAK files. I was going to send them a registration, >but now you're raising doubts about their legitimacy. My reading of the court documents that were posted months ago [I no longer have copies] was that nobody, including P.K., was disallowed from using PK[X]ARC. PKware was disallowed beginning this year to distribute any software that read/wrote .ARC format files. Anyone else can still distribute PK[X]ARC -- you won't get sued if someone downloads it from your BBS. SEA, last I heard, will license you for $1 to write/distribute programs that deal with .ARC format files with the provision that your tools will not create .ARC files that the current version of SEA ARC cannot deal with. Personally, I like ZOO -- it works on my PC and on the Unix box here at work. The Unix version of ARC I have doesn't like the Green Hills compiler -- I had to compile it with optimizer disabled and generate debug symbols, then strip the debug info after linking! Happy Hacking, Mark Armbrust maa@nbires.UUCP maa@nbires.nbi.com
rusty@cadnetix.COM (Rusty) (03/23/89)
In article <688@infovax.lan.informatik.tu-muenchen.dbp.de> kluge@lan.informatik.tu-muenchen.dbp.de (Oliver Kluge) writes: > >But now another question arises: What about compatibility????? >I already have PKARC, and PKZIP seems to be better, but will it >uncompress .ARC-Files?? No, but there are 2 programs, arc2zip and zip2arc. They convert from one format to the other. I have not tried them yet, but the bbs I usually call used arc2zip to convert all their arc files, so I assume it worked ok! (I may have the program names wrong. I have downloaded them but not unzipped them ('Unzipped', what a laugh!)) >ARC is still the standard! If PKZIP isn't >able to read - if not write - .ARC-Files, this means I have to keep >SEA's ARC... See above. ----- Rusty Carruth UUCP:{uunet,boulder}!cadnetix!rusty DOMAIN: rusty@cadnetix.com Cadnetix Corp. (303) 444-8075x241 \ 5775 Flatiron Pkwy. \ Boulder, Co 80301 Radio: N7IKQ 'home': P.O.B. 461 \ Lafayette, CO 80026