traymund@uiuc.edu (Tim Raymund) (03/11/91)
We've gotten a good offer from Harris on a NightHawk 4400, an
88100 based realtime unix machine. This offer competes with an
offer from DEC on a DECstation 5000.
After reviewing the spec sheets, I'm pretty favorably impressed by
Harris' offer.
There are some questions that I'm hoping someone can help with.
1. What's the SPEC rating (or MFLOPS) of the 4400 as offerred?
The 5000 does about 18.5 SPECmarks, the 3100 about 11.3. A SPECmark
is a measure of floating point performance. Don't be impressed by
MIPS - that's only integer stuff.
2. Are we getting:
SCSI interface?
3100 and 5000 use the SCSI. Currently its a good interface for
getting cheap peripherals.
Eithernet interface?
Thick or thin doesn't matter, but it must have it.
A good FORTRAN compiler?
We get VAX Fortran and the MIPS f77 from a software library.
A console/workstation?
DECstations come with 19" bw monitor, mouse and keyboard
8mm tape drive?
Nice for compatibility and data
? Disk, ? cpus, ? memory
3. Does their UNIX support NFS? Network File Serve: allows disks to
be shared across the network. Ultrix, the DEC version of
Unix, (obviously) can do it.
Does it include X11R4? X11 is a standard windowing system used
for the workstations. R4 is the latest release. The new Ultrix
doesn't have it, but it's very easy to add.
Does their Unix support disk striping? Disk striping can
significantly speed up i/o. The new Ultrix supports it.
4. What will it cost in maintenance: hardware and software? Currently
we have no regular hardware maint, though we probably pay a few
hundred per year for miscellaneous fix-ups, and we recently paid $2k for
those department vaxs. Software is $600/year for VAXstation 2000's,
$900/year for the VAXstation II, and $1200/year for the 3100 (I think).
Those prices will change by next year. We receive access to the complete
Ultrix op sys with no limit on the number of users, and various software
packages (windowing, graphics, compilers for most popular languages,
etc.)
Potentially, a 4 CPU version of the 4400 could be almost 10x the
speed of the 3100. That's quite a bit of raw computing power...
A single CPU version should be at least twice as fast.
By comparison, the 5000 is one and a half to two times faster.
DECstation 5000 we are considering: $12k
19" bw monitor, mouse, keyboard
R3000 MIPS risc processor, 16 Mb memory, 600 Mb disk
18.5 SPECmarks
Ultrix 4.0 (BSD 4.3) and MIPS f77 compiler
SCSI device (up to 7) and thin Eithernet
Prices could change soon as DEC is set to announce a new (faster)
version of the 5000.
Thanks for any info!
tim raymund
traymund@uiwpl.ece.uiuc.edu
--
Tim Raymund
Wave Propagation Lab, Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering,
University of Illinois, 1406 W. Green St., Urbana, IL 61801-2991 USA
Internet: t-raymund@uiuc.edu Phone: 217/333-2931 FAX: 217/244-5624
--
=========================== MODERATOR ==============================
Steve Stevenson {steve,fpst}@hubcap.clemson.edu
Department of Computer Science, comp.parallel
Clemson University, Clemson, SC 29634-1906 (803)656-5880.mabellrprimmer@lemond.webo.dg.com (Bob Primmer) (03/12/91)
[Please note that comp.unix is on bitnet, too. We have to hand feed the two systems. If you really want this on comp.unix, please post directly to their moderator.] Steve, please pass this reply on to Tim Raymond (traymund@uiuc.edu). It's in response to a posting he put in comp.unix through you. Thanks, Bob -------------------------------------------------------------------- In article <1991Mar11.132225.13679@hubcap.clemson.edu> you write: > > We've gotten a good offer from Harris on a NightHawk 4400, an > 88100 based realtime unix machine. This offer competes with an > offer from DEC on a DECstation 5000. Tim, while I am certainly biased, you might check out Data General's 88100 based offering (AViiON). There'll be a major anouncement in New York tomorrow that will be simulcast to San Francisco, Brussels, and Toronto that may be of interest -- depending on what you're looking for short- and long-term. I'll try and answer some of your questions for DG's AViiON product. I'm in engineering, not marketing, so I don't know what the deal is with price, et al, only the metal and s/w. > 1. What's the SPEC rating (or MFLOPS) of the 4400 as offerred? For the AV/310 uni 20MHZ - SPEC is 9.7 For the AV6200 uni 25MHZ - SPEC is 12.7 (25 Dhrystone MIPS/CPU) For the AV6220 dual 25MHZ - SPEC is 24.0 (ditto) See tomorrow's announce for latest (or ask me after tommorow). This is with two 88220 MM/cache chips/cpu with separate data/instruction ports and 4-way, set-associative 16KB caches. > 2. Are we getting: > SCSI interface? Yes. 322 MB 5.25" SCSI Winchester disk (1.5 MB/sec data xfer, 18ms mean seek). > Eithernet interface? Yes, IEEE 802.3. > A good FORTRAN compiler? I don't use Fortran, so I don't know what good is ... but there is a fortran compiler available. > A console/workstation? (color or bw) Workstation/mouse/kybd, or console. > 8mm tape drive? 150 MB QIC cartridge is default. Multiple configurations available based on what you're looking for and, I'm sure, price. Generally ... 10 VME slots 208 MB ERCC (1 Mbit DRAM) max mem 512 - 640 asyn connects Can't talk about max cpu's till tomorrow. > 3. Does their UNIX support NFS? Network File Serve: allows disks to Yes. DG/UX is BCS, SVID 2 and POSIX 1003.1 compliant. Current release (4.32) is based upon SVR3 with BSD 4.3 extensions (such as BSD signals). It also supports Sun RPC's and NFS, X11R3 (R4 coming soon), and OSF Motif. DG/UX is allows fully symmetric multiprocessing. > Does it include X11R4? X11 is a standard windowing system used X11R3 with Motif is presenly released. X11R4 to be released soon. Can't talk this about yet. > 4. What will it cost in maintenance: hardware and software? Currently Sorry, don't know anything about this stuff. > Potentially, a 4 CPU version of the 4400 could be almost 10x the > speed of the 3100. That's quite a bit of raw computing power... Wait until Wedesday's announcement. You'll be happy! Don't know if any of this is what you were looking for, Tim. If not, just send to /dev/null and that'll fix it. - Bob rprimmer@lemond.webo.dg.com Data General Software Engineering -- =========================== MODERATOR ============================== Steve Stevenson {steve,fpst}@hubcap.clemson.edu Department of Computer Science, comp.parallel Clemson University, Clemson, SC 29634-1906 (803)656-5880.mabell
turner@udecc.engr.udayton.edu (Staff- Bob S Turner) (03/13/91)
In article <1991Mar11.132225.13679@hubcap.clemson.edu> traymund@uiuc.edu (Tim Raymund) writes: > >We've gotten a good offer from Harris on a NightHawk 4400, an >88100 based realtime unix machine. This offer competes with an >offer from DEC on a DECstation 5000. I can't answer specifics about the 4400, but I can answer general question on Harris Equipment. (We are the happy owners of an HCX-9) >1. What's the SPEC rating (or MFLOPS) of the 4400 as offerred? >2. Are we getting: > SCSI interface? Harris supports SCSI and SMD on the VME bus so I would expect SCSI to be available. > Eithernet interface? I know all machines support TCP/IP and Ethernet. Bets are on a 15pin AUI > A good FORTRAN compiler? Harris has an excellant compiler - hf77 (suprise :-) it supports most VAX extensions and all the wonderful Harris H-series extensions > A console/workstation? > 8mm tape drive? Don't know about any of the above. >3. Does their UNIX support NFS? Network File Serve: allows disks to Yes no problem here. We use it on the HCX. > Does it include X11R4? X11 is a standard windowing system used I'm not sure. But it could be added easily. >4. What will it cost in maintenance: hardware and software? Currently Again depending on your configuration. >Potentially, a 4 CPU version of the 4400 could be almost 10x the [Opinion Mode on] You didn't mention the OS you were getting (there are three UNIX versions commercial, realtime or C2 secure) so I don't know the application. Harris is very strong right now in real-time systems for data collection and simulation. The Nighthawk's context switch speed is among the best in the industry. If you have a real-time application Harris is your best choice. Otherwise, its a more difficult decision to make. [Opinion mode off] Bob Turner Network Manager, School of Engineering 513-229-3171 turner@udecc.engr.udayton.edu Univ. of Dayton, Engineering Computing Center-KL211, Dayton OH 45469 "Its the end of the net as we know it..And I feel fine" -- ==================================================================== Bob Turner Network Manager, School of Engineering 513-229-3171 turner@udecc.engr.udayton.edu Univ. of Dayton, Engineering Computing Center-KL211, Dayton OH 45469 -- =========================== MODERATOR ============================== Steve Stevenson {steve,fpst}@hubcap.clemson.edu Department of Computer Science, comp.parallel Clemson University, Clemson, SC 29634-1906 (803)656-5880.mabell