mandel@vax.anes.tulane.edu (Jeff E Mandel MD MS) (05/18/91)
1) There seems to be no one who opposes comp.sources.hp48, so I see little reason to modify this. If a comp.binaries.hp48 is needed, this should be completely noncontroversial as well. 2) The line of demarcation that people want to draw is between orientation of users. I would suggest that the solution could be: comp.sys.handhelds.programmers (for programming any machine) comp.sys.handhelds.organizers (for using any machine to keep notes, phone #s) It is possible that an additional group would be useful: comp.sys.handhelds.connectivity (for connecting any machine to another device) I know this is a sea change from what I advocated in the past, but if this is what people want, I will see what the net.gods have to say (if any of you are reading this and want to inject your comments into the discussion, feel free). So, if you like this proposal, let me know. If there is a firestorm against it, I see little reason to abandon .HP48. Jeff E Mandel MD MS Asst. Professor of Anesthesiology Tulane University School of Medicine New Orleans, LA mandel@vax.anes.tulane.edu
rsholmes@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Rich Holmes) (05/20/91)
In article <7530@rex.cs.tulane.edu> mandel@vax.anes.tulane.edu writes: >comp.sys.handhelds.programmers (for programming any machine) >comp.sys.handhelds.organizers (for using any machine to keep notes, phone #s) > >It is possible that an additional group would be useful: > >comp.sys.handhelds.connectivity (for connecting any machine to another device) WHAT????? Are you seriously suggesting that issues relating to HP48 programming, HP48 alarms, and HP48-to-computer connections should be put (1) in separate groups and (2) respectively in the same groups with postings about all other calculator/palmtop programming, all other personal organizers, and all other handheld-to-computer connectivity? I'm appalled. You've gone from one newgroup in which (some) people are unhappy about too many HP48 posts, to three in which those same people will be unhappy, and probably all three will be of interest to most of us. >So, if you like this proposal, let me know. If there is a firestorm against it, >I see little reason to abandon .HP48. In other words, this is a straw man? "Either support this ludicrous idea, or support my original proposal"? Perhaps you should reread the discussion. What I see a lot of support for is NOT a split along usage lines for all handhelds, but a split between different kinds of handhelds -- one that recognizes that, with the probable exception of the HP95, the HP handhelds belong together. Please do go to the Net-Gods, but with a proposal like: c.s.calculators.hp c.s.calculators.misc c.s.palmtops ... or something along those lines. (As always, I really see no need for a split, but I'll reluctantly support a split along lines that make some kind of sense). -- - Rich Holmes rich@suhep.bitnet or rich@suhep.phy.syr.edu Syracuse U. Physics Dept. or if you must: rsholmes@rodan.acs.syr.edu The Kuwaitis have oil. The Kurds don't. End of story.
LEIF@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (05/20/91)
In article <7530@rex.cs.tulane.edu>, mandel@vax.anes.tulane.edu (Jeff E Mandel MD MS) says: > >1) There seems to be no one who opposes comp.sources.hp48, so I see little >reason to modify this. This seems to totally ignore the recent postings in support of a split: comp.sys.handhelds (or .calculators) comp.sys.palmtops If you are going to give us a choice of comp.sys.hp48 or nothing, then I for one, will be forced to vote against it, EVEN though I am TOTALLY in support of a RATIONAL split to solve the problem PERMNANANTLY! Why are you ignoring the support for the proposal mentioned above? Do the participating members of the comp.sys.handhelds group have ANY input into the final split decision other than to vote for or against whatever kind of split you independantly decide upon??? If you are not going to give us any better choice than comp.sys.hp48, or: >I would suggest that the solution could be: >comp.sys.handhelds.programmers (for programming any machine) >comp.sys.handhelds.organizers (for using any machine to keep notes, phone #s) Which I find to be a pathetic attempt to muddy the water and cloud the real issue, namely: Do we want to separate the different kinds of machines (ie palmtops and calculators, with option of narrowing within these two fields) or do we want to simply get the HP48 the H*LL out of the .Handhelds group without any consideration for what the end-users of the groups are interested in accomplishing, in terms of a long-term, logical solution? >I see little reason to abandon .HP48. > >Jeff E Mandel MD MS >Asst. Professor of Anesthesiology >Tulane University School of Medicine >New Orleans, LA >mandel@vax.anes.tulane.edu Please at least respond to this. Acknowlege the obvious support which has been demonstrated for a logical split along the lines of palmtops vs calculators, PLEASE!!! I want this group split; however, I will not be railroaded into voting for the "lesser of two evils". If we have no say in what kind of split will happen (only IF it WILL happen) then please explain WHY????? -Leif Johnson leif@slacvm.slac.stanford.edu
asmith@acorn.co.uk (Andy Smith) (05/20/91)
In article <7530@rex.cs.tulane.edu> mandel@vax.anes.tulane.edu (Jeff E Mandel MD MS) writes: >1) There seems to be no one who opposes comp.sources.hp48, so I see little >reason to modify this. Agreed. There should be a sources feed. >2) The line of demarcation that people want to draw is between orientation of >users. I would suggest that the solution could be: >comp.sys.handhelds.programmers (for programming any machine) >comp.sys.handhelds.organizers (for using any machine to keep notes, phone #s) >It is possible that an additional group would be useful: >comp.sys.handhelds.connectivity (for connecting any machine to another device) Jeff, What the??? Now your suggesting that we have to read three news groups instead of the current one. The idea I thought was to group the RPL users away from the MS-DOS users and non-HP calculator users. Most of those posting to this discussion are settling on :- comp.sys.palmtops comp.sys.calculators >I know this is a sea change from what I advocated in the past, but if this is >what people want, I will see what the net.gods have to say (if any of you are Are you just playing devils advocate? I agree that the net.gods should be approched, but with the majority idea, NOT with something that makes life worse. >So, if you like this proposal, let me know. If there is a firestorm against it, >I see little reason to abandon .HP48. Yes there will be a firestorm against it. I for one think its less than sensible, however I also do not agree with the form of your original idea, but your wording implies a choice of the two and no freedom to back the correct proposal?? >Jeff E Mandel MD MS Andy
taber@ultnix.enet.dec.com (Patrick St. Joseph Teahan Taber) (05/20/91)
In article <7530@rex.cs.tulane.edu>, mandel@vax.anes.tulane.edu (Jeff E Mandel MD MS) writes: |>2) The line of demarcation that people want to draw is between |>orientation of |>users. I would suggest that the solution could be: |> |>comp.sys.handhelds.programmers (for programming any machine) |>comp.sys.handhelds.organizers (for using any machine to keep notes, |>phone #s) |> |>It is possible that an additional group would be useful: |> |>comp.sys.handhelds.connectivity (for connecting any machine to another |>device) |> Over the past few days, I think what we've seen is a movement to support comp.sys.handhelds (calculators) comp.sys.palmtops (BOSS, OZ, HP95, etc.) Now at this juncture, I can't see why it wouldn't suit you to also support this. If you support it, then I believe you'll have consensus which is required before you move to a call for vote. (it's in the guidelines -- ask the net.gods.) This proposal has a lot of advantages -- the calculators stay together, the mailing lists don't break, comp.sys.handhelds already exists, so there's only a single name up for vote. When split-the-group fever first hit, the complaint was that the HP48 had to go because the only other split that would relieve you was "comp.sys.handhelds.not-hp". Now an alternate proposal accomodates you without having to disaccomodate the traditional c.s.h people. Looks like a win-win to me. If you think that organizers are not ".palmtops", you could probably add a ".organizers" group and still carry, even though you're going to make things more complex by having to vote several names (the binaries group should be unopposed, but it still has to be voted.) -- >>>==>PStJTT Patrick St. Joseph Teahan Taber, KC1TD "Nerd" is so demeaning, I prefer "fashion-impared."
IMS103@psuvm.psu.edu (Ian Matthew Smith) (05/22/91)
My $.02 cents... comp.sys.palmtops comp.sys.calculators Theses two newsgroups would be my personal choice. They may not be everyones, and thats where this idea of voting comes from. (Sigh, life would be so much easier if I always got my way. Well, for me at least ;-) Anyway, I don't really mind those few articles pertaining to non-hp calculators, but if the non-hp posters want us out, I would vote for a comp.sys.calculators.hp. Thats my addition to the noise. I'll try and post somthing more usefull later to make up for it. :) - Ian Smith <<ims103@psuvm.psu.edu>>