anich@puff.cs.wisc.edu (Steven Anich) (08/04/88)
Hi, has anyone out here ever used "VIP", the visual programming language for the Macintosh? If so, do you have any comments on it? steve anich anich@puff.WISC.EDU
newton@mtund.ATT.COM (Newton Lee) (08/04/88)
In article <1759@puff.cs.wisc.edu>, anich@puff.cs.wisc.edu (Steven Anich) writes: > has anyone out here ever used "VIP", the visual programming > language for the Macintosh? If so, do you have any > comments on it? It's an interesting package, may be of some use in teaching programming languages, but not practical for building real applications. Newton Lee AT&T Bell Laboratories
andrew@ems.Ems.MN.ORG (Andrew C. Esh) (08/08/88)
I have played around with VIP, and I like it. It's good for learning about the toolbox. The only complaint is that they have been giving an "in a couple of weeks" date for the release of the MPW C code generator to me for 4 months now. I am unable to use VIP for any serious work until I get the generator, so I can't really give you much more than "neat" since I've only played with it a bit. Ho Hum ... :-| - Andrew "MPW C" Esh -- Andrew C. Esh DOMAIN: andrew@ems.MN.ORG APPLELINK: D0492 EMS/McGraw-Hill UUCP: ihnp4!meccts!ems!andrew AT&T: (612) 829-8200
schear@ttidca.TTI.COM (Steve Schear) (08/09/88)
In article <1005@mtund.ATT.COM> newton@mtund.ATT.COM (Newton Lee) writes: >It's an interesting package, may be of some use in teaching programming >languages, but not practical for building real applications. > I have been developing an application using VIP 2.5 for several months now, and am quite pleased with the results. As I have not yet used the 'C' code generators and external 'C' procedure functions, perhaps my bliss is one of ignorance. I hope not. I would welcome more detailed comments, both pro and con, regarding the practicality of VIP for application implementation.
johnr@hpislx.HP.COM (John Repko) (08/11/88)
I've used VIP for about a year an a half now, and I've found it both a productive and useful interface to the Toolbox and other Mac internals. The early versions (2.0 and 2.2) were useful for prototyping Mac applications, and 2.5 has beeen enhanced enough (better window event support, etc) that one could very well create an entire Mac application using VIP in conjunction with a Think C or MWP translator. The development environment uses a MacPaint-like palette to provide point-and-click access to subroutine calls, organized (roughly) by Manager. VIP routines provide an object-oriented "feel" when used to create and manage the cursor, standard window types, dialog boxes, and the other standard parts of a Mac application. Because it is laid out along the lines of Inside Macintosh, VIP serves as a good intro to the machine. A VIP program is essentially a flowchart of VIP calls, with constructs provided for branching, if-then-else, and case statements. Programs can be structured with user-defined subroutines, complete with parameter passing and local variables. Navigation around a program is adequate -- about as good as anything you'll find in a quasi-hypertext style editor. As an interpreter VIP provides a quick turnaround in an Edit-Run cycle, and provides a reasonable debug environment for step-by-step evaluation of code, local and global variables. To produce compiled code a number of trans- lators are available. The translation step is fast, but produces calls to VIP supplied libraries rather than target-language source files. VIP does have weaknesses. It is still necessary (and not always simple) to augment VIP-generated programs with C/assembler code if you want to provide anything not strictly part of the Mac style guide. Navigation in the editor and (particularly) the debugger could be improved; the general interface style may not appeal to those familiar with more textual modes of program generation. The product has made considerable strides from 2.0 to 2.5, and does provide a good Mac programming interface and one of the better non-textual programming environments presently available. FWIW, I have no affiliation with Mainstay, I just like the product.