baskett%forest@SGI.COM (03/15/90)
We have two basic kinds of network connections that carry e-mail. One is the government sponsored Internet and one is the individually sponsored uucp net. At the moment we are not sure how to restrict people from using the Internet for a commercial purpose such as an e-mail Hot Line. So we don't have an e-mail Hot Line. Our use of the Internet is supposed to be for research and educational purposes. It is not hard to argue that info-iris falls in that usage category. The Hot Line, on the other hand, is a clear commercial offering from Silicon Graphics. One of these days, the networking issues will not be so difficult, we all hope. Forest Baskett Silicon Graphics
moraes@cs.toronto.edu (Mark Moraes) (03/15/90)
Would it run against the policies of the various Internet networks if one end of the email conversation was a research facility that considered it important that they get quick/convenient/well-informed answers to problems with their machines, so they could get on with the research that they're supposed to be doing?
rayan@cs.toronto.edu (Rayan Zachariassen) (03/15/90)
baskett%forest@SGI.COM writes: >At the moment we are not sure how to restrict >people from using the Internet for a commercial purpose such as an >e-mail Hot Line. So we don't have an e-mail Hot Line. Our use of the >Internet is supposed to be for research and educational purposes. To quote from the acceptable-use document from the Federation of American Research networks (FARnet): Traffic between mid-levels should be restricted to research or academic purposes, or to direct administrative support of such efforts. Organizations whose connection to the internet is sponsored by a FRICC agency can use the network in support of the sponsored activities. Traffic whose content is solely commercial is not acceptable. ... In other words, traffic in support of sponsored activities (that's R&D) is allowed. It doesn't matter what the endpoints of the traffic are, just that one of the parties is participating in the traffic to support a "sponsored activity" (which in many R&D labs is a euphemism for "breathing"). Although there may be gray areas, it seems generally accepted that anybody with an Internet connection has some (at times flimsy) reason for having one and as long as you don't do commercial EDI or non-focused activities (e.g. advertising) over the Internet that all is ok. How many SGI machines on the Internet are *not* used for some form of R&D (aka "sponsored activity")? This of course doesn't allow you to use the Internet as a third-party network, which means you still need to maintain UUCP (or other) connectivity to talk to non-Internet sites... but that's another matter. Bottom line is that what may look like a commercial activity to you looks like a we-needed-this-a-year-ago facility to many Research and Academic Internet member organizations. rayan
MOHRINGJ%ESVAX@dupont.COM (03/15/90)
I agree with Rayan Zachariassen's interpretation of the quoted text.
"Traffic between mid-levels should be restricted to
research or academic purposes, or to direct
administrative support of such efforts. Organizations
whose connection to the internet is sponsored by a
FRICC agency can use the network in support of the
sponsored activities. Traffic whose content is solely
commercial is not acceptable. ..."
Being familiar with the Specific (?) statements the government is known for, I
believe they used this entire dissertation to simply say;
"NO commercial Advertising!"
Whereas, a facility supporting the R&D community, even if it is a commercial
endeavor, is acceptable. In many cases, until a resolution is found to a
problem, research is slowed, if not halted. It would be our responsibility not
to use the proposed e-mail facility unless the above situation were in effect.
These opinions are my own and do not necessarily reflect those of my superiors
and/or subordinates.
Jim "Trouble" Mohringvjs@rhyolite.wpd.sgi.com (Vernon Schryver) (03/16/90)
In article <90Mar14.230345est.1442@smoke.cs.toronto.edu>, moraes@cs.toronto.edu (Mark Moraes) writes: > Would it run against the policies of the various Internet networks if > one end of the email conversation was a research facility that > considered it important that they get quick/convenient/well-informed > answers to problems with their machines, so they could get on with the > research that they're supposed to be doing? I have occassionally asked Powers That Be essentially this question. I have been answered "... that might be ok, but don't quote me. We are working on the rules, and will let you and everyone else know." Notice one minor hassle with the current structure of the Internet. What about the zillion purely commercial customers of UUNET? Imagine what might happen if one of them purchased an IRIS (well, let's have them all purchase lots of IRIS's), and decided to send the Hotline a Valentine's Day greeting (while we're hypothesising, let's assume the customer has no problems). The message would probably go via private UUCP to the east coast to uunet.uu.net, then onto JVCNet (?), onto NSFNet, eventually to BARRNet to sgi.sgi.com, and finally to some machine within SGI. Notice how two evil money making organizations have communicated about something unrelated to any interests of any Official Sponsoring Agencies. There are other possibilities. What if Sun Microsystems purchased an IRIS, and decided to email to the Hotline? Such mail would likely use guvn'mnt subsidized wires and routers. Mind you, this is all hypothetical, since we all know that all Internet email, netnews, FTP's, and so on are purely for Official U.S. Guvnmnt Purposes. Vernon Schryver Silicon Graphics vjs@sgi.com
andrew@alice.UUCP (Andrew Hume) (03/16/90)
forest's point is a good one but MIPS has an e-mail bug box. it is not a hotline as such, but a place to send bug reports to. i wonder if this evades the commercial restrictions.. if so, perhaps sgi could do the same.
mitch@rock.sgi.com (Tom Mitchell) (03/22/90)
A lot or people have made some very constructive comments on this topic. I have saved the last 18 and printed copies for Customer Support management here at SGI. Thanks, mitch Thomas P. Mitchell -- mitch@sgi.com "All things in moderation; including Grammarians."