[comp.protocols.tcp-ip.ibmpc] Q: can LM/x and pc/tcp share tcp/ip stack?

edmbv@fiol.UiB.NO (Bjorn Asle Valde) (02/04/91)

My understanding of this setup leaves much to be done, hope
this isn't too stupid...

Have installed: HP lan-manager/x on an sco unix 3.2.2 box. The example
ms-dos client is  using tcp/ip to talk to the server, works nice. Now
I need to have a few programs to talk to a unix box over ftp's pc/tcp
tcp/ip implementation. Using the "dispktpm.dos" (ndis to packet converter)
and the generical kernel (ethdrv.exe) I can get pc/tcp to work *OR* 
lan-manager but not both it seems. Depending on what get loaded first it
seems like either l-m or pc/tcp will die from packet starvation. (?)

Can two tcp/ip stacks share an NDIS interface or am I trying to do something
impossible? I feel like taking a bath in aspirin, any help would be much
appreciated. Email responses prefered.

PS: If it should turn out that this is indeed possible, then a copy of
"protocol.ini" and "lanman.ini" (and possibly config/autoexec) would
be helpful.

Regards, Bjorn Asle





--
Bjorn Asle Valde - Humble Programer
edmbv@fiol.uib.no X.400: S=Valde;OU=cc;O=uib;P=uninett;c=no
Present address: TBK Bergen a/s, Pb 62, N-5031 Laksevaag Norway.
Phone +47-5-948200 fax. 948375 

jbvb@FTP.COM ("James B. Van Bokkelen") (02/05/91)

    Can two tcp/ip stacks share an NDIS interface ...

You can't count on it.  NDIS 1.0.1 (which is what every driver I've seen
conforms to) doesn't guarantee that it can deliver a packet to more than
one protocol stack.  From your symptoms, it appears that your setup
isn't doing this.  A different NDIS driver might help (provided both we
and HP wrote our code right, we never tested two TCP/IPs side by side),
but it isn't guaranteed to work in all situations.

James B. VanBokkelen		26 Princess St., Wakefield, MA  01880
FTP Software Inc.		voice: (617) 246-0900  fax: (617) 246-0901

pmoore@hemel.bull.co.uk (Paul Moore) (02/05/91)

edmbv@fiol.UiB.NO (Bjorn Asle Valde) writes:

>My understanding of this setup leaves much to be done, hope
>this isn't too stupid...


>Regards, Bjorn Asle



I had been thinking along similar lines but in a different way.
Lan Manager is a NetbIos application. PC/TCP supply a NetbIos for their
kernel. It would seem simplest to throw away the HP NetBios over TCP
and use only FTPs stack. If you dont do this you will end up with 2 tcp
ip stacks in your PC - mucho memory cost.
(This is the idea of the much vaunted "Open Systems" - treat it like a Lego
set)

edmbv@fiol.UiB.NO (Bjorn Asle Valde) (02/06/91)

In article <1991Feb5.111900.14265@hemel.bull.co.uk> pmoore@hemel.bull.co.uk (Paul Moore) writes:

>I had been thinking along similar lines but in a different way.
>Lan Manager is a NetbIos application. PC/TCP supply a NetbIos for their
>kernel. It would seem simplest to throw away the HP NetBios over TCP
>and use only FTPs stack. If you dont do this you will end up with 2 tcp
>ip stacks in your PC - mucho memory cost.
>(This is the idea of the much vaunted "Open Systems" - treat it like a Lego
>set)

This reminds me of something my personal hero, Edmund Blackadder, once
spoke (yeah, bravo!) "I have a plan so cunning you could put a tail
on it and call it a weasel".  I doubt this will work, but will of course
investigate further. In '88 I visited MIT's media-lab and learned that
I only thought I knew what Lego is all about :-)

[The reason I'm sceptical is that I know HP has glued their l-m client
very thight to the transport stack. You can't for instance use, say,
Ungerman-Bass' tcp/ip stack]

Thanks net, Bjorn Asle
--
Bjorn Asle Valde - Humble Programer
edmbv@fiol.uib.no X.400: S=Valde;OU=cc;O=uib;P=uninett;c=no
Present address: TBK Bergen a/s, Pb 62, N-5031 Laksevaag Norway.
Phone +47-5-948200 fax. 948375 

bhansen@hpdmd48.boi.hp.com (Barry Hansen) (02/08/91)

> I had been thinking along similar lines but in a different way.
> Lan Manager is a NetbIos application. PC/TCP supply a NetbIos for their
> kernel. It would seem simplest to throw away the HP NetBios over TCP
> and use only FTPs stack. If you dont do this you will end up with 2 tcp
> ip stacks in your PC - mucho memory cost.


Maybe its just that I work for HP (and happen to be one of the developers
of HP's TCP/IP NetBIOS) but why not just get HP's ARPA 2.0 package?  It provides
the standard UNIX connectivity utilities and runs on the same TCP stack
as does HP's LAN Manager.

Barry Hansen

leo@unipalm.uucp (E.J. Leoni-Smith) (02/08/91)

edmbv@fiol.UiB.NO (Bjorn Asle Valde) writes:

>My understanding of this setup leaves much to be done, hope
>this isn't too stupid...

>Have installed: HP lan-manager/x on an sco unix 3.2.2 box. The example
>ms-dos client is  using tcp/ip to talk to the server, works nice. Now
>I need to have a few programs to talk to a unix box over ftp's pc/tcp
>tcp/ip implementation. Using the "dispktpm.dos" (ndis to packet converter)
>and the generical kernel (ethdrv.exe) I can get pc/tcp to work *OR* 
>lan-manager but not both it seems. Depending on what get loaded first it
>seems like either l-m or pc/tcp will die from packet starvation. (?)

>Can two tcp/ip stacks share an NDIS interface or am I trying to do something
>impossible? I feel like taking a bath in aspirin, any help would be much
>appreciated. Email responses prefered.

Defintely YES, BUT some ndis drivers (notably current WD) break in this
mode. 

>PS: If it should turn out that this is indeed possible, then a copy of
>"protocol.ini" and "lanman.ini" (and possibly config/autoexec) would
>be helpful.

>Regards, Bjorn Asle


All part of the Unipalm Technical support service - you are lucky that
England is covered in Snow today - so most of our real customers
are staying at home!

.................


Sample CONFIG.SYS

files=20 
buffers=25 
country=44,437,C:\DOS\country.sys 
device=c:\ftp\ifcust.sys 
device=c:\ftp\ipcust.sys 
device=c:\lanman\drivers\dlc\protman.sys /I:c:\lanman 
device=c:\ftp\dispktpm.dos 
device=c:\lanman\drivers\elnkii\elnkii.sys 
device=c:\lanman\drivers\netbeui\dosnetb.sys 
lastdrive = v 


Sample PROTOCOL.INI

;**************************************************************************
; %VER1.1d Protocol Manager Initialization File Template 
; The following are default sections for various adapters and protocols 
;**************************************************************************
[protocol manager] 
   DRIVERNAME = PROTMAN$ 
 
;************************ 
;**     ADAPTERS       ** 
;************************ 
; WESTERN DIGITAL CARD 
[WD8003XMAC] 
  DRIVERNAME = MACWD$ 
  IRQ = 5 
  RAMADDRESS = 0XD000 
  IOBASE = 0X280 
 
[ETHERLINKII] 
    DRIVERNAME = ELNKII$ 
    IOADDRESS = 0x300 
    INTERRUPT = 3 
    MAXTRANSMITS = 12 
      XMITBUFS = 1 
 
;************************ 
;**     PROTOCOLS      ** 
;************************ 
; NetBEUI ; works with DLC Protocol 
 
[NETBEUI] 
  DRIVERNAME = NETBEUI$ 
  BINDINGS = ETHERLINKII 
 
; FTP Packet driver 
 [PKTDRV] 
  DRIVERNAME = PKTDRV$ 
  BINDINGS = ETHERLINKII 
  INTVEC = 0x65 
  CHAINVEC = 0x66 

Sample AUTOEXEC.BAT

prompt $p$g 
path=c:\;c:\dos;c:\lanman;c:\ftp;c:\lanman\drivers\dlc;c:\lanman\netprog 
keyb uk,437,c:\dos\keyboard.sys 
netbind 
net start work 
net logon user1 password 
net use d: \\intl_server\users
ethdrv  
cd d:\user1 
d: 


This configuration was tested using a COMPAQ version of Lan Manager.

leo@unipalm.uucp (E.J. Leoni-Smith) (02/09/91)

leo@unipalm.uucp (E.J. Leoni-Smith) writes:

>edmbv@fiol.UiB.NO (Bjorn Asle Valde) writes:

>>My understanding of this setup leaves much to be done, hope
>>this isn't too stupid...

>>Have installed: HP lan-manager/x on an sco unix 3.2.2 box. The example
>>ms-dos client is  using tcp/ip to talk to the server, works nice. Now
>>I need to have a few programs to talk to a unix box over ftp's pc/tcp
>>tcp/ip implementation. Using the "dispktpm.dos" (ndis to packet converter)
>>and the generical kernel (ethdrv.exe) I can get pc/tcp to work *OR* 
>>lan-manager but not both it seems. Depending on what get loaded first it
>>seems like either l-m or pc/tcp will die from packet starvation. (?)

>>Can two tcp/ip stacks share an NDIS interface or am I trying to do something
>>impossible? I feel like taking a bath in aspirin, any help would be much
>>appreciated. Email responses prefered.

>Defintely YES, BUT some ndis drivers (notably current WD) break in this
>mode. 

>>PS: If it should turn out that this is indeed possible, then a copy of
>>"protocol.ini" and "lanman.ini" (and possibly config/autoexec) would
>>be helpful.

>>Regards, Bjorn Asle


>All part of the Unipalm Technical support service - you are lucky that
>England is covered in Snow today - so most of our real customers
>are staying at home!

>.................


>Sample CONFIG.SYS

>files=20 
>buffers=25 
>country=44,437,C:\DOS\country.sys 
>device=c:\ftp\ifcust.sys 
>device=c:\ftp\ipcust.sys 
>device=c:\lanman\drivers\dlc\protman.sys /I:c:\lanman 
>device=c:\ftp\dispktpm.dos 
>device=c:\lanman\drivers\elnkii\elnkii.sys 
>device=c:\lanman\drivers\netbeui\dosnetb.sys 
>lastdrive = v 


>Sample PROTOCOL.INI

>;**************************************************************************
>; %VER1.1d Protocol Manager Initialization File Template 
>; The following are default sections for various adapters and protocols 
>;**************************************************************************
>[protocol manager] 
>   DRIVERNAME = PROTMAN$ 
> 
>;************************ 
>;**     ADAPTERS       ** 
>;************************ 
>; WESTERN DIGITAL CARD 
>[WD8003XMAC] 
>  DRIVERNAME = MACWD$ 
>  IRQ = 5 
>  RAMADDRESS = 0XD000 
>  IOBASE = 0X280 
> 
>[ETHERLINKII] 
>    DRIVERNAME = ELNKII$ 
>    IOADDRESS = 0x300 
>    INTERRUPT = 3 
>    MAXTRANSMITS = 12 
>      XMITBUFS = 1 
> 
>;************************ 
>;**     PROTOCOLS      ** 
>;************************ 
>; NetBEUI ; works with DLC Protocol 
> 
>[NETBEUI] 
>  DRIVERNAME = NETBEUI$ 
>  BINDINGS = ETHERLINKII 
> 
>; FTP Packet driver 
> [PKTDRV] 
>  DRIVERNAME = PKTDRV$ 
>  BINDINGS = ETHERLINKII 
>  INTVEC = 0x65 
>  CHAINVEC = 0x66 

>Sample AUTOEXEC.BAT

>prompt $p$g 
>path=c:\;c:\dos;c:\lanman;c:\ftp;c:\lanman\drivers\dlc;c:\lanman\netprog 
>keyb uk,437,c:\dos\keyboard.sys 
>netbind 
>net start work 
>net logon user1 password 
>net use d: \\intl_server\users
>ethdrv  
>cd d:\user1 
>d: 


>This configuration was tested using a COMPAQ version of Lan Manager.
ARGGH I just realised you said LM/X! not straight Lan Manager.

All the above is of course irrelevant - sorry.