Tony C. Cheng <tcheng@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu> (05/30/91)
Does anyone have experiences on installing NCSA Telnet on the AT&T Lan Manager network? We recently get this network software upgrade from the AT&T and hope it work with NCSA Telnet packet drivers, but AT&T cannot give us specific information on the setup; they simply told us NCSAT should work along on the Lan Manager. :-< They did mention about the use of NETBIND.EXE, but none of the documentation I have contains specific usage of this program. I have complete packet driver set from Clarkson and NCSA Telnet 2.3b. I will really appreciate if anyone who has experiences on setting up NCSAT to work with Lan Manager drivers or vice versa can give me some help. Tony C. Cheng ............. Educ. Tech. Services Indiana University..
U47526@uicvm.uic.edu (David E. Thomas) (05/30/91)
In article <1991May29.220808.21386@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu>, Tony C. Cheng <tcheng@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu> says: > >Does anyone have experiences on installing NCSA Telnet on the AT&T >Lan Manager network? We recently get this network software upgrade >from the AT&T and hope it work with NCSA Telnet packet drivers, but >AT&T cannot give us specific information on the setup; they simply >told us NCSAT should work along on the Lan Manager. :-< > >They did mention about the use of NETBIND.EXE, but none of the >documentation I have contains specific usage of this program. > We do not have your specific configuration, but it's pretty close so it might be helpful to you. We run Lan Manager 3.3 concurrently with FTP Software's tcp/ip. It works fine but uses a great deal of memory. On 386's or SX's we can put most of the stuff in high memory so that is not a problem (up to 578K free after both Lan Manager and TCP/IP are loaded). On the other end of the scale: an 8086 with 640K memory has only about 367K free after loading the drivers. This is pretty limiting for typical DOS usage. We have tried the Maryland DOS-IP package (another public domain product) but have not been successful. We have been able to load all of the drivers (using the latest 'beta' NDIS driver), but after making Lan Manger virtual drive links the tcp/ip services hang the machine. We really would like to use this package because it is free and because it utilizes memory much more efficiently. (Most of the drivers can be loaded and unloaded as needed). We are hoping that future versions will fill the bill. The use of netbind is not that difficult. You simply call it just before the ATTSTART line in the autoexec file. You must have an entry for it in the protocol.ini file that specifies it's binding to the ATTCSMA driver. Our experience with AT&T is that they are either unable or unwilling to help with this dual protocol stack situation. They have tried to do a demo for us with their own SX machine using FTP software and have been unable to make it work (in spite of the fact that a rather big contract hinged on its success). Trial and error has been a much more productive avenue for us. Good Luck! David E. Thomas University of Illinois at Chicago
Tony C. Cheng <tcheng@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu> (05/31/91)
Several kind netters had sent me mails or posted comments concerning my question. Following is a mail from John at netcom.com which has the exact infomation I wanted to know. John, the mail I sent to netcom.com for you were all bounced back. I think you wouldn't mind my posting your mail here. I checked cica.cica.indiana.edu for dis_pkt.dos, but couldn't find anything like that. They might have purged it. I also looked into Clarkson's machine for that file, neither could I find it there. If there is one, it could be packed inside a certain file. Anyway, if you know any other place where I can find it, please send me mail again or post a note here. I really look forward to the implementation of NCSAT on our AT&T Lan Manager network. Thanks./_Tony ............. Educ. Tech. Services Indiana University ------------------------------------------------------ >You need to get the Packet Driver to NDIS driver adapter (dis_pkt.dos. It's >on your own machine over there (cica.cica.indiana.edu). You will use this >instead of the clarkson packet driver. What you want to do is have Lan Man- >ager and NDIS talking to the same NDIS MAC driver. You will have Lan Man >talking to the NDIS MAC driver and NCSA will be talking to dis_pkt.dos >which will then be talking to the NDIS MAC driver. > >If you get dis_pkt.dos from cica, it'll have a doc file with it that'll >explain how to configure dis_pkt and StarGROUP. When dis_pkt is installed and >running, it looks just like a packet driver to NCSA. > >If you need anymore help, let me know (I'm assuming that the dis_pkt doc >will get you there). > >BTW: Netbind is the NDIS program that "binds" the different protocol drivers >together into a single stack (in your case the NDIS MAC driver, StarGROUP's >OSI driver and dis_pkt.dos). It's run when you do a ATTSTART. The first thing >ATTSTART does is a netbind (if you look at LANMAN.INI in \lanman.dos, you'll >see the NETBIND command at the bottom of the file). > >-- > John Robert Breeden, > jbreeden@netcom.com, apple!netcom!jbreeden, ATTMAIL:!jbreeden > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > "The nice thing about standards is that you have so many to choose > from. If you don't like any of them, you just wait for next year's > model."
cmilono@netcom.COM (Carlo Milono) (05/31/91)
In article <1991May29.220808.21386@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu> tcheng@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu (Tony C. Cheng) writes: > >Does anyone have experiences on installing NCSA Telnet on the AT&T >Lan Manager network? We recently get this network software upgrade >from the AT&T and hope it work with NCSA Telnet packet drivers, but >AT&T cannot give us specific information on the setup; they simply >told us NCSAT should work along on the Lan Manager. :-< > >They did mention about the use of NETBIND.EXE, but none of the >documentation I have contains specific usage of this program. > >I have complete packet driver set from Clarkson and NCSA Telnet 2.3b. >I will really appreciate if anyone who has experiences on setting up NCSAT >to work with Lan Manager drivers or vice versa can give me some help. > > >Tony C. Cheng >............. >Educ. Tech. Services >Indiana University.. Yes, I am working at the University of San Francisco and recently got several Freeware packages (and a Windows3.0 shareware) that give your users Telnet and FTP. There are two basic approaches: 1) use the Clarkson Packet Driver without loading your LMS, and use a Packet-Driver-aware application (CUTCP, e.g.) 2) get the dis_pkt arrangement; this is from (I recall...) Utah University. This is an alternate packet driver that understands the use of NDIS. As such, you must enter some information in the "lanman.dos\drivers\yourdriver\protocol.ini" file. When you load your NOS, the packet driver is bound (hence NETBIND) along with ISO (in the case of StarGROUP). Now, any packet-driver aware application, like NCSA, will run. With WinQVNET, which is a WIN3.0 Telnet/FTP application, you will also need to put a 'shim' to mediate the protected mode of windows. Off the top of my head, I cannot recall which host on the Internet I got these packages from, but if you wish, I will post the exact hosts, directories, and filenames you will need. For raw performance, I prefer the CUTCP, as the windows-based version is a tiny bit sluggish; however, the CUTCP is really two executables and it is awkward to kick-off a telnet session, log off, fireup an FTP and back to telnet...with the windows version, it is a breeze. -- +--------------------------------------------------------------------------+ | Carlo Milono | | Personal: cmilono@netcom.com or apple!netcom!cmilono | | Hobbes: "Life in the Great Suburban Outback is certainly fraught with | | peril." | | Calvin: "If you'd seen it, you'd have been scared too." | +--------------------------------------------------------------------------+
jbvb@FTP.COM ("James B. Van Bokkelen") (05/31/91)
2) get the dis_pkt arrangement; this is from (I recall...) Utah
University.
DIS_PKT was written at (and is copyrighted by) FTP Software Inc. We
released v1.05 in source form as freeware last Fall (get it from vax.ftp.com,
in pub/packet.driver/pubdom/ndis). Since then, Joe Doupnik has released
two improved versions (through 1.07), which it sounds like you're using.
James B. VanBokkelen 26 Princess St., Wakefield, MA 01880
FTP Software Inc. voice: (617) 246-0900 fax: (617) 246-0901tcheng@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu (Tony C. Cheng) (05/31/91)
Many thanks to Rob. Yesterday I'd successfully implemented dis_pkt.dos in
LM's protocol manager, and NCSAT worked fine on the StarGROUP now.
I haven't have time to do further test yet, but for now we(at the ETS) are
really glad to know that it works.
Following is the message Rob sent to me, he had also mailed me dis_pkt.uue.
I've talked to the manager at CICA(of cica.cica.indiana.edu), if there's no
objection, I'll put dis_pkt.zip on cica, in case other folks might need it.
Cica's manager was surprised when he heard that someone said there is
something in their PD, but in fact there isn't. :-)
Thanks folks, for all your help.
_Tony
.............
Educ. Tech. Services
Indiana University
---------8<----------8<----------8<---------
Tony, we are using that setup here at UofL and it is working fine. I will
include the things you need below. You are close to being on the right track.
You need the NDIS packet driver (talks to the ATTCSMA driver instead of the
card). I have included the latest version of it below. If you have any
questions, don't hesitate to ask.
Rob Miracle
LAN consultant, University of Louisville
CONFIG.TEL (driver lines only)
------------------------------
hardware=packet # network adapter board (packet driver interface
)
ioaddr=60
CONFIG.SYS
----------
BREAK = ON
FILES = 40
BUFFERS = 20
LASTDRIVE=Z
SHELL=C:\COMMAND.COM c:\ /e:512 /p
device=c:\lanman.dos\drivers\protman.dos /i:c:\lanman.dos\drivers\stmcen20
device=c:\lanman.dos\drivers\attcsma\attcsma.dos
device=c:\lanman.dos\drivers\attload.dos /Y
device=c:\lanman.dos\drivers\attiso\attiso.dos
device=c:\ftp\dis_pkt.dos
AUTOEXEC.BAT
------------
@ECHO OFF
SET COMSPEC=C:\DOS\COMMAND.COM
PATH=C:\UTILITY;C:\KERMIT;C:\FTP;C:\TC\BIN;C:\DOS;C:\QPRO;F:\WP51;
SET TEMP=C:\TEMP
SET CONFIG.TEL=C:\FTP\CONFIG.TEL
PROMPT $P$G
:REM ***** AT&T StarGROUP(R) Software - Do Not Modify *****
SET ATTLANROOT=c:\lanman.dos
PATH=%ATTLANROOT%\netprog;%PATH%;\\NCC03.SERVE\U
ATTSTART
SHARE
PROTOCOL.INI
------------
; AT&T STARLAN 10 NAU Protocol.ini
[protocol manager]
drivername = PROTMAN$
[attiso]
drivername = ATTISO$
bindings = attcsma
nsess = 8
ncmds = 32
use_emm = N
[attcsma]
drivername = attcsma$
board_type = 1
irq = 2
ioaddr = 0x360
daram = 0xc800
[pktdrv]
drivername = pktdrv$
bindings = attcsma
intvec = 0x60
chainvec = 0x66jbreeden@netcom.COM (John Breeden) (05/31/91)
In article <1991May30.194544.26351@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu> tcheng@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu (Tony C. Cheng) writes: > >Several kind netters had sent me mails or posted comments concerning my >question. Following is a mail from John at netcom.com which has the >exact infomation I wanted to know. > >John, the mail I sent to netcom.com for you were all bounced back. I think >you wouldn't mind my posting your mail here. > >I checked cica.cica.indiana.edu for dis_pkt.dos, but couldn't find anything >like that. They might have purged it. I also looked into Clarkson's machine >for that file, neither could I find it there. If there is one, it could be >packed inside a certain file. > >Anyway, if you know any other place where I can find it, please send me >mail again or post a note here. I really look forward to the implementation >of NCSAT on our AT&T Lan Manager network. > Oops, wrong box! dispkt v1.06 is on netlab.usu.edu in anonymous:netwatch (it's a VAX). The file is called dispkt.zip. -- John Robert Breeden, jbreeden@netcom.com, apple!netcom!jbreeden, ATTMAIL:!jbreeden ------------------------------------------------------------------- "The nice thing about standards is that you have so many to choose from. If you don't like any of them, you just wait for next year's model."
jrd@cc.usu.edu (06/03/91)
In article <91150.113645U47526@uicvm.uic.edu>, David E. Thomas <U47526@uicvm.uic.edu> writes: > In article <1991May29.220808.21386@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu>, Tony C. Cheng > <tcheng@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu> says: >> >>Does anyone have experiences on installing NCSA Telnet on the AT&T >>Lan Manager network? We recently get this network software upgrade >>from the AT&T and hope it work with NCSA Telnet packet drivers, but >>AT&T cannot give us specific information on the setup; they simply >>told us NCSAT should work along on the Lan Manager. :-< (stuff removed...) > Our experience with AT&T is that they are either unable or unwilling > to help with this dual protocol stack situation. They have tried to > do a demo for us with their own SX machine using FTP software and > have been unable to make it work (in spite of the fact that a rather > big contract hinged on its success). Trial and error has been a > much more productive avenue for us. > > Good Luck! > > David E. Thomas > University of Illinois at Chicago ----------------------------------- Oh, I think that parts of AT&T are very interested in the dual protocol approach. That means it depends on the local AT&T office at this time. FTP Software Inc can work very nicely with NDIS and StarGROUP and NetWare etc, but one has to do the configuration part (config.sys and protman.ini) correctly. The current development v1.07 dis_pkt shim for Packet Driver support has instructions and two large examples of accomplishing this. If you need the Chicago AT&T office to get up to speed have them call the Salt Lake City office and ask for Jerry Cranford, Data Technical Specialist (801) 237-1191. The comments about not much memory remaining are correct, sigh. NDIS items are hardly small (the board driver for a WD8003E eats 28KB). I think the code is sized to the specification documents (ponderous at best). At this moment I have StarGROUP, FTP Inc's kernel, NetWare shell, Novell's TES and Kermit loaded and there are a few bytes (90KB) free. Joe D.