chuq@plaid.Sun.COM (Chuq Von Rospach) (01/09/88)
HYPER-HACKERS Digest Vol. 1 #9
January 8, 1988
Subjects:
Various (2)
What is HyperCard good for?
Input validation (test if input is numerical) (2)
-----------------------------------
From: Sunil Maulik <MAULIK@BIONET-20.ARPA>
Subject: Various
Date: Thu 24 Dec 87 11:43:40-PST
1. The success of Goodman's book...
>(Bantam has said, by the way, that 100,000 copies of that thing have
>been sold -- SOMEONE is using HyperCard!)
Why has it been so successful ? - Simple! Danny Goodman's book is everything
the Apple documentation is NOT. When I first got HyperCard, going through the
Apple documentation just left me confused. It was only after perusing the
Goodman book that I realized what HyperCard IS good for. (Rather than being a
"memory-hungry rolodex" it has been somewhat disparagingly called in some
sections of the Silicon Valley Press). I don't understand why Apple didn't
simply bundle the book with HyperCard and charge an extra 20 bucks.
2. HyperCard - The Scripts...
>telling how it works, providing tips, extensions, modifications. The book
>is divided into several categories, and each will have its own HyperStar
>"featured" author. All the scripts will undergo rigorous testing, editing,
A great idea, but calling featured authors "HyperStars" ?!?! - please....
3. What is HyperCard good for...
>The question of what is HyperCard good for reminded me of a demo I
>saw at a HyperCard expo that Apple sponsored here last month. One
>of the demos was a stack that was a front end for a commercial
>dial-up database. (I don't remember which one.) The point was
>to substitute clicking on buttons for entering command strings.
>The main card, as I remember, looked like a library card catalog,
>with each drawer representing one of the major subdivisions of the
>database. I suppose that this representation was recursive on the
>levels in the hierarchy.
>Has anyone else heard of any similar use of HyperCard as a front end?
I too think HyperCard would make an excellent front-end to many dial-up
operations (BIONET amongst them). The question is, as in the following
message, how does it work ?...
>I've not heard of it, but have plans to implement user-friendly front-ends
>to some of our more user-hostile software packages by using HyperCard. The
>problem is: How do I treat an incoming ASCII serial string thru the modem
>port as input to HyperCard? Can I create a HyperCard event on each RETURN?
>Will I need an external software interfacing program or can I use what is
>already in HyperCard???
My question exactly. I thought of having HyperCard launch a terminal emulator
program, but I think now it would be better to have an XCMD to trap the
incoming ASCII string and import it as text into HC.
I think HC will find its best uses in education. It is not the compleat
HyperText retreival program everyone claims it is, but it IS a giant first
leap. It will also serve as a useful test-bed for future products of this
nature. (Witness the amount of correspondence, scripts, and stacks from
this bboard alone).
That's it. Just thought I'd add my 2 bits worth.
-----------------------------------
From: Chuq Von Rospach <chuq@sun.com>
Subject: Re: Various
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 88 9:00 PST
> Why has it been so successful ? - Simple! Danny Goodman's book is
> everything the Apple documentation is NOT.
This, I believe is on purpose. Not to force people to buy Goodman's book to
make money, but from the philosophy of Atkinson and his feelings about
software. Atkinson planned from the start to make HyperCard a gimme -- a
piece of free software, either through Apple or through the other normal
channels like User Groups and Bulletin Boards. One factor to keep in mind
with this is that large electronic documentation sets aren't realistic in
this environment, and hypercard really, really needs a well written printed
manual. The only way to reconcile this is to make the software available for
downloading, and let the people who want it go buy the book at the
bookstore. Since they knew from the beginning that Goodman's book was going
to be the definitive reference, they didn't put lots of time and energy into
duplicating that information in the HyperCard manual they ship with,
especially when you realize that practically speaking, few Hypercard owners
are going to see the "official" manual, thanks to the way system software
gets passed around. The "official" manual is skimpy, but I'm not sure I
blame Apple for doing things the way they did it, especially since there IS
a good alternative source for the same information.
> A great idea, but calling featured authors "HyperStars" ?!?! - please....
Just as a side comment, one of the things that killed the Atari 800 machine
was Atari's insistence that in-house software writers were anonymous. At the
same time, third party firms like Activision were plastering the authors
name and picture on their stuff. Needless, most of Atari's best programmers
went to Activision, and the stuff Atari shipped was, um, garbage. Software
sales for Atari died off, which hit the company on the bottom line.
Atari's attitude was that programmers were employees. Activision's was that
they were artists. Guess who's closer to right? it may sound silly, but
if you don't keep your hackers happy, someone else will.
>Has anyone else heard of any similar use of HyperCard as a front end?
You should look at CompuServe's Navigator. It isn't writting in HyperCard,
but it could be. Wonderful way to spend money, and MUCH nicer than dealing
with CompuServe directly. These things will be standard fare on all
timesharing services in a couple of years, if the timesharing services are
interested in surviving.
> My question exactly. I thought of having HyperCard launch a terminal
> emulator program, but I think now it would be better to have an XCMD
> to trap the incoming ASCII string and import it as text into HC.
Better, do what Navigator does and replace the emulator.
-----------------------------------
From: David Bogartz <DSBOGARTZ@AMHERST.bitnet>
Subject: What is HyperCard good for?
Date: Sat, 26 Dec 87 12:03 EDT
It seems to me that when you ask what is HyperCard good for, the qualifier
"that couldn't be done better with other software" leaves out an important
consideration. HyperCard lets you get up and running fast. This is often
more important than a lot of other characteristics, such as performance,
elegance of code, or efficiency. Admittedly, you may be setting
yourself up for a fall by trying to create a database system in HyperCard,
because it'll work fine for the first few records but quickly deteriorate.
That doesn't mean that small database applications shouldn't be done with
HyperCard.
Douglas Adams' words about HyperCard in a recent issue of MacUser bear
repeating (well, paraphrasing, actually): HyperCard is like a human being.
Human beings aren't the fastest animals on the planet, or the animals
that build most efficiently, or the strongest animals, or really the best
at anything (except possibly the most intelligent). But they are fairly
good at all of these things, and they integrate them together well. And
so it is with HyperCard.
David Bogartz
dsbogartz@amherst.bitnet
-----------------------------------
From: Jakob Nielsen Tech Univ of Denmark <DATJN@NEUVM1.bitnet>
Subject: Input validation (test if input is numerical)
Date: Tue, 05 Jan 88 02:37:54 DNT
What is a good way to test if the contents of a field is an integer ?
I want to do input validation to protect my users from getting
strange error messages later in a HyperTalk program.
One alternative would be to trap HyperCard's error messages
(how does one do that) - perhaps after having multiplied the
field with one just to see whether it is in fact a number.
-----------------------------------
From: Chuq Von Rospach <chuq@sun.com>
Subject: Re: Input Validation
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 88 9:00 PST
There is a message you can trap on called CloseField. during data entry,
then, you can add a script to the field, card, or stack that does
something like:
on CloseField
if (field < 0 || field > 23) then
answer "field not within range" with "OK"
field = emtpy
endif
end CloseField
This has a problem in that it doesn't force them to correct the answer,
although you can then trap for empty fields on a closeCard and and force
them to fix the card before allowing them to leave.
chuq
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End of HYPER-HACKERS Digest