perf@efd.lth.se (Per Foreby) (11/15/90)
We have 20 VAXstn 2000 which are never used because our Sun's are much faster. Our DEC salesman came up with an idea: Buy som new DECstation 2100's, put 24 Mb in each of them, and use the old 2000's as X-terminals. In this way, by purchasing 20 DECstation 2100, we could get 40 fast workstations. Comments? Has anyone tried this? -- Per Foreby Email: perf@efd.lth.se System manager at EFD, Lund Institute of Technology (Lund University) Snail: E-huset, LTH, Box 118, S-221 00 LUND, Sweden. Phone: +46 46 107492
sysmgr@KING.ENG.UMD.EDU (Doug Mohney) (11/16/90)
In article <PERF.90Nov15165838@osiris.efd.lth.se>, perf@efd.lth.se (Per Foreby) writes: >We have 20 VAXstn 2000 which are never used because our Sun's are much >faster. Our DEC salesman came up with an idea: Buy som new DECstation >2100's, put 24 Mb in each of them, and use the old 2000's as >X-terminals. Euh, is that 2100? I'd edge for the 3100s, just on a matter of principle OR look at DECstation 5000s or 5100s as well. Actually, you could just as easily use your VAXstation 2000s as X-terminals *now* with your Suns (thereby dragging them to their knees ;-). >In this way, by purchasing 20 DECstation 2100, we could get 40 fast >workstations. It seems to work OK; the Setup which is being run by the EE people have 3 Sparcstation 1+ machines distributing a load 'twixt roughly 12-14 VAXstation 2000s, but the VAXstation 2K isn't all that hot on mean time between failures.
hamm@mbcl.rutgers.edu (11/17/90)
In article <PERF.90Nov15165838@osiris.efd.lth.se>, perf@efd.lth.se (Per Foreby) writes: > We have 20 VAXstn 2000 which are never used because our Sun's are much > faster. Our DEC salesman came up with an idea: Buy som new DECstation > 2100's, put 24 Mb in each of them, and use the old 2000's as > X-terminals. > > In this way, by purchasing 20 DECstation 2100, we could get 40 fast > workstations. > > Comments? Has anyone tried this? > -- The VAXstation 2000's will work fine as X-terminals *provided* you put enough memory in them. I'd suggest an absolute minimum of 12MB, and preferably 16. We've tried with 6MB (running DECwindows with only the server stuff running on the 2000), and it works, but painfully. Logging in is especially fun -- plenty of time for a cup of coffee, including brewing time. With more memory, they work fine. But you have to consider the cost of adding memory vs. invoking DEC's trade-in deals on DECstations. Greg - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Gregory H. Hamm || Phone: (201)932-4864 Director, Molecular Biology Computing Lab || FAX: (201)932-5735 Waksman Institute/CABM || BITNET: hamm@biovax P.O. Box 759, Rutgers University || Internet: hamm@mbcl.rutgers.edu Piscataway, NJ 08855 * USA || - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
lidl@eng.umd.edu (Kurt J. Lidl) (11/20/90)
>In article <PERF.90Nov15165838@osiris.efd.lth.se>, perf@efd.lth.se (Per Foreby) writes: >> We have 20 VAXstn 2000 which are never used because our Sun's are much >> faster. Our DEC salesman came up with an idea: Buy som new DECstation >> 2100's, put 24 Mb in each of them, and use the old 2000's as >> X-terminals. >> >> In this way, by purchasing 20 DECstation 2100, we could get 40 fast >> workstations. >> >> Comments? Has anyone tried this? > >The VAXstation 2000's will work fine as X-terminals *provided* you put >enough memory in them. I'd suggest an absolute minimum of 12MB, and >preferably 16. We've tried with 6MB (running DECwindows with only >the server stuff running on the 2000), and it works, but painfully. >Logging in is especially fun -- plenty of time for a cup of coffee, >including brewing time. > >With more memory, they work fine. But you have to consider the cost >of adding memory vs. invoking DEC's trade-in deals on DECstations. This is not our experience at all. A 6 megabyte, diskless, monochrome VaxStation 2000 makes a just dandy X-terminal. In fact, I am typing this article on one of these X-Terminals right now :-) We run 19 of them off of one DecStation 3100, which functions as the NFS server for them and as their MOP boot loader. We have 3 SparcStation 1+'s that are the compute servers for the cluster of machines. We get awefully good performance on these machines. Then again, we don't run much of anything on the Vaxen, except for the X11R4 server (the MIT one -- we did not like some of the "features" of the DecWindows server). The Dec3100 primarily does NFS traffic to the X-Terminals to feed them their font files, which are all in one partition on the machine. I suppose the try gross thing about the setup (in a certain manner of thinking) is that the machines all share the same root partition and same 6 meg swap file... The MOP packet that is sent on bootup says the swap space is 6 megs -- the same as the amount of ram in the machines. Thus, they never swap or page. Thus, they can all share the same swap space. The root partition they write to, but primarily to the X11 socket and the device drivers. There is no file creation in /tmp, so all the machines can stay happy. It takes about 15 seconds from the time I hit return on the keyboard (for the XDM display) to the point where my X setup is totally up and running. I can't get on that fast on the *console* of the Sparcs that serve as the compute servers for the lab. I'd be happy to show you how to setup your machines like this -- I would get one 2100 or 3100 -- all it has to do is boot the Vaxen and then you can use the compute engine of your choosing for running the client programs. We have compiled the X11R4 MIT server with GCC, with optimization, and it goes pretty quick. I think that we out-perform the DecWindows server in one or two areas, are reasonably close in a lot of areas, and only are significanyl slower than the DEC server in a few areas (this is via timings from the "xgc" program. I will be happy to send the results of our tests (simple though they are) to people who want them. The entire setup code we wrote could use a little cleanup, but it works. We have been toying with the idea of spending some real development time to bring the concept of a VaxStation 2000 as X-Terminal to a new height. One that involves no Ultrix, just a packet filter on the Sparcs and some kernel hacking. You'll be hearing from us if this comes to fruition... -Kurt -- /* Kurt J. Lidl (lidl@eng.umd.edu) | Unix is the answer, but only if you */ /* UUCP: uunet!eng.umd.edu!lidl | phrase the question very carefully. */
roger@mdtv.uucp (11/20/90)
In article <PERF.90Nov15165838@osiris.efd.lth.se>, perf@efd.lth.se (Per Foreby) writes: > We have 20 VAXstn 2000 which are never used because our Sun's are much > faster. Our DEC salesman came up with an idea: Buy som new DECstation > 2100's, put 24 Mb in each of them, and use the old 2000's as > X-terminals. > > In this way, by purchasing 20 DECstation 2100, we could get 40 fast > workstations. > > Comments? Has anyone tried this? > -- > Per Foreby Email: perf@efd.lth.se > System manager at EFD, Lund Institute of Technology (Lund University) > Snail: E-huset, LTH, Box 118, S-221 00 LUND, Sweden. Phone: +46 46 107492 Why not just use the Suns as X clients? Also, your VS 2000s are most likely 4 plane machines. Make sure your X applications can handle 4 plane visuals gracefully. Ours don't. :-( Roger Corron | Voice: +1 508 640 0940 Fax: +1 508 640 0836 Matra Datavision, Inc.| 2 Highwood Drive | UUCP: {decvax,wang,uunet!samsung}!mdtv!r_corron Tewksbury, MA. 01876 |