[net.micro] Amiga vs Mac

eric@topaz.RUTGERS.EDU (Eric Lavitsky) (08/12/85)

In article <26700024@inmet.UUCP>, bhyde@inmet.UUCP writes:
> 
>  I for one am very happy not to have any discussion of the
>  Amiga in this news group...  "The Amiga?  That's the machine
>  that one ups the MacIntosh right, more memory, more sound, more
>  color, even has less software than the Mac did when it was introduced."
>  ben hyde, cambridge

Eh?, you'd better get your facts straight. The Amiga will have 20+ 
packages available upon release - I've seen many of them. How many
did the Mac have? 2...3? All I can remember are MacPaint and MacWrite -
care to refresh my memory as to the other 20?

Eric
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david@RAND-UNIX.ARPA (David Shlapak) (08/12/85)

>Eh?, you'd better get your facts straight. The Amiga will have 20+
>packages available upon release - I've seen many of them. How many

People "see" software for months before it's ever publicly available...
Folks will "get their facts straight" when there are any facts about the
Amiga...as far as I'm concerned, anything that isn't on the shelves is
little more than wishware.

						--- das

jimb@amdcad.UUCP (Jim Budler) (08/15/85)

In article <3241@topaz.RUTGERS.EDU> eric@topaz.RUTGERS.EDU (Eric Lavitsky) writes:
>In article <26700024@inmet.UUCP>, bhyde@inmet.UUCP writes:
>> 
>>  color, even has less software than the Mac did when it was introduced."
>>  ben hyde, cambridge
>
>Eh?, you'd better get your facts straight. The Amiga will have 20+ 
>packages available upon release - I've seen many of them. How many
>did the Mac have? 2...3? All I can remember are MacPaint and MacWrite -
>care to refresh my memory as to the other 20?
>

I have to agree with both of them. I saw over 20 packages for the Mac
prior to announcement day.  I saw 3 released within a month of 
announcement day.

There is a long way between packages seen before release and packages people 
will put their name on./

-- 
 Jim Budler
 Advanced Micro Devices, Inc.
 (408) 749-5806
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rick@sara70.UUCP (Rick Jansen) (08/16/85)

 
[Crunch]
 
>Anything that is not on the shelves is little more than wishware.
 
I disagree. Perhaps many people have no idea at all how much work
is involved in getting an application "on the shelves". After the
application has been designed (yes, sometimes this still happens)
and written, it will take many MONTHS more to get the thing documented
(user guide) and manufactured. So, at the moment something is shown
it may already be finished and is certainly NOT wishware any more.
 
Rick Jansen
{seismo,decvax,philabs}!mcvax!sara70!rick
 

cdshaw@watmum.UUCP (Chris Shaw) (08/17/85)

In article <3241> eric@topaz.RUTGERS.EDU (Eric Lavitsky) writes:
>In article <26700024@inmet.UUCP>, bhyde@inmet.UUCP writes:
>> 
>>  "The Amiga?  That's the machine that one ups the MacIntosh right
>>  ben hyde, cambridge
>
>Eh?, you'd better get your facts straight. The Amiga will have 20+ 
>packages available upon release - I've seen many of them. How many
>did the Mac have? 2...3? All I can remember are MacPaint and MacWrite -
>care to refresh my memory as to the other 20?
>
>Eric

This is a bogus comparison. At its official release date, nobody had seen a Mac
except for a few developers. (I think). 

At the Amiga's release, thousands of people will have seen it, touched it, etc.
The "real release" in September is a marketing ploy designed to get the Amiga
all the advance publicity one could want. The fact that Byte had an article
in August indicates (given publishing deadlines and a lack of a "last minute"
air to Byte's reporting) that the machine could just have easily been released
in May or June.

Of course, that would mean that the public would discover bugs galore
in the software, and Commodore would have to promise up a storm about forth-
coming software. 

I'm not saying that this is all a bad thing, this ploy of Commodore's.
In fact it's quite intelligent. I just wish that the public at large (or at 
Usenet in this case) would not fall into the trap of making nonsense 
comparisons. Face it, Apple won this race in February 1984. No matter how you 
slice it, the Mac has a humongous head start, and a huge installed user base.
No nonsense about number-of-software-packages-at-release is going to change
the fact that the Mac has (at least) an order of magnitude more packages now
than either the ST or Amiga.

And no, I don't own a Mac.

Chris Shaw    watmath!watmum!cdshaw  or  cdshaw@watmath
University of Waterloo
In doubt?  Eat hot high-speed death -- the experts' choice in gastric vileness !

hall@ittral.UUCP (Doug Hall) (08/17/85)

I think there's a difference between the software supposedly available
for the Amiga and the software that was supposedly available for the
Mac. Before the Mac came out, there were a lot of people saying,
"We're working on such-and-such" or "it'll be available shortly." From
what I've read, a lot of folks have stuff ready for the Amiga NOW, not
just beta test, but waiting to ship as soon as Commodore does. I
suppose some might feel safe in saying that, since they know they have
some time before Amiga ships, but I'll wager that there'll be more
available for the Amiga when it ships then there was for the Mac.

I hope the Amiga is a success, because I keep looking for the machine
that the Mac never was. I was one of the first Mac software
developers, back when you "had to have a Lisa" to do Mac development.
The more I used the Mac, the more I longed for a machine with some kind 
of open bus, and a way to throw away all the icons and menu bars and
other such garbage. (Ok, so you can get rid of the junk if you really
want, but the first problem requires major surgery.) At any rate,
I want to use my machine the way *I* want to use it, not the way
Apple or Commodore or anyone else wants me to. I finally decided that
the Mac was the computer for the rest of them, and obviously it's done
very well without my help, thank you.

Now, back to the Amiga vs. ST business. Does the ST really have an
external bus? I mean like Address/Data and all that good stuff? Or
does it depend entirely upon the DMA channels for this? I know the
Amiga has everything but the kitchen sink coming out the side, and I'd
rather have that than just a DMA connector. Anybody know? Also, is
anybody besides me interested in getting OS9/68K running on the Amiga?
Somebody's bound to have thought of it by now.

Doug Hall
ITT Telecom, Raleigh NC
decvax!ittatc!ittral!hall

henry@utzoo.UUCP (Henry Spencer) (08/21/85)

> ... After the
> application has been designed (yes, sometimes this still happens)
> and written, it will take many MONTHS more to get the thing documented
> (user guide) and manufactured. So, at the moment something is shown
> it may already be finished and is certainly NOT wishware any more.

As far as the customer is concerned, "many MONTHS more" means "wishware".
Nobody really cares what wonderful things exist within a software company;
it's products out the door that matter.
-- 
				Henry Spencer @ U of Toronto Zoology
				{allegra,ihnp4,linus,decvax}!utzoo!henry

pritch@osu-eddie.UUCP (Norman Pritchett) (08/28/85)

> Now, back to the Amiga vs. ST business. Does the ST really have an
> external bus? I mean like Address/Data and all that good stuff? Or
> does it depend entirely upon the DMA channels for this? I know the
> Amiga has everything but the kitchen sink coming out the side, and I'd
> rather have that than just a DMA connector. Anybody know? Also, is
> anybody besides me interested in getting OS9/68K running on the Amiga?
> Somebody's bound to have thought of it by now.
> 
> Doug Hall
> ITT Telecom, Raleigh NC
> decvax!ittatc!ittral!hall

I'm interested in knowing if anybody has the intention of putting os9 on the
Amiga too (I personally wouldn't mind trying a crack at it myself).  I was
just reading about AMDs new disk controller chip set and started getting
some neat ideas for disk-sharing between several os9 machines.

The chip is the Am9580 hard disk controller.  The name is misleading because
it can actually control a mixture of four hard AND floppy disk drives.
Instructions to the controller are stored in the host's memory in
linked-list control blocks which are DMA'd by the 9580.  The controller can
handle a 32-bit linear address space (but lets face it, how many systems
have 4Gbytes of real memory?) so what if you use the top couple of bits in
the address to select a host? ...

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