ge@kunivv1.sci.kun.nl (Ge' Weijers) (12/06/89)
I never see any discussion about editors other than (clones/versions of) vi, emacs and the like. Doesn't anyone do any research on the subject? Or is conservatism on the part of the user community (if it was good enough for the 70's its good enough for the 90's). Not that I use anything different, but in 1981 I saw the Rand Editor on Unix edition 6, and I've seen nothing else that is really different (except when your hobby is programming emacs to do all kinds of tricks). What about structured text, folding editors (never seen one) and the like. Ge' Weijers Ge' Weijers Internet/UUCP: ge@cs.kun.nl Faculty of Mathematics and Computer Science, (uunet.uu.net!cs.kun.nl!ge) University of Nijmegen, Toernooiveld 1 6525 ED Nijmegen, the Netherlands tel. +3180612483 (UTC-2)
horlache@sun1.ruf.uni-freiburg.de (Ullrich Horlacher) (12/07/89)
ge@kunivv1.sci.kun.nl (Ge' Weijers) writes: >I never see any discussion about editors other than (clones/versions of) >vi, emacs and the like. Doesn't anyone do any research on the subject? I use (since 3 weeks) the LSEDIT on VMS, and I'm *very* happy with it. LSEDIT is EDT, EVE AND TPU-compatible and is language sensitive (so far: PASCAL, FORTRAN, ADA, COBOL, BLISS PL/I, ..any forgotten?) >to do all kinds of tricks). What about structured text, folding editors >(never seen one) and the like. What is a folding editor? #---------------------------------------------------------------------# # this mail came from Framstag! (sometimes known as Ulli Horlacher) # # framstag@dtupev5a.bitnet ullrich.horlacher@ruf.uni-freiburg.dbp.de # # "Murphy was an optimist" # #---------------------------------------------------------------------#
achowe@tiger.waterloo.edu (anthony howe) (12/07/89)
>I never see any discussion about editors other than (clones/versions of) >vi, emacs and the like. Doesn't anyone do any research on the subject? >Or is conservatism on the part of the user community (if it was good enough >for the 70's its good enough for the 90's). Not that I use anything different, >but in 1981 I saw the Rand Editor on Unix edition 6, and I've seen nothing >else that is really different (except when your hobby is programming emacs >to do all kinds of tricks). What about structured text, folding editors >(never seen one) and the like. Todd Berkley (trb@stag.uucp) had one nice editor in development that supported folds and could be switched between vi-like and emac-ish modes. He was even trying to develop relations between lines of text and files much like a basic database. I did manage to get the source to version 0.9e which can be used on Atari ST, IBM PC (eeech), and unix boxes. Todd has dropped off the net for the last four months and I haven't tried him by snail mail yet. This editor is fairly recent (only 6 months old) but noone talks about anything else in this group much. I too I'm working on a personal editor that trys to cross some features of vi-xedit/kedit-wordperfect into an editor I like. Just the basics so far as this project is just a fun thing. What I like in an editor is simple things, small, and bug free. Then when I'm ready for fancy stuff like macros, scripts, multi-screens, and hand-stands I'll add them in. Another reason to grow-your-own is for work reasons. Every time I go to a new place to work they want me to use this or that editor while I use brand Y. Trying to find a version of an editor for PC, an Atari, and UNIX that works the same in all environments is not easy or cheap. Better to have your own that you can take with you. It would be nice to here about other Personal Editors that one does not normally here about. Fresh ideas are nice every so often. >Ge' Weijers Internet/UUCP: ge@cs.kun.nl -ant achowe@tiger.waterloo.edu | "It is hard to make the world go away _ -|-|_ _ | when it has decided to notice you." (_\ |\| | | | (_) |\| \/ | - Spock's World ___/ | disclaimer...
ge@kunivv1.sci.kun.nl (Ge' Weijers) (12/08/89)
horlache@sun1.ruf.uni-freiburg.de (Ullrich Horlacher) writes: >What is a folding editor? An editor that can 'hide' the body of a program part (procedure module) you are not interested in at the moment. You only see the procedure/module header. The editor needs to know a bit about the language to do this. Ge' Weijers Ge' Weijers Internet/UUCP: ge@cs.kun.nl Faculty of Mathematics and Computer Science, (uunet.uu.net!cs.kun.nl!ge) University of Nijmegen, Toernooiveld 1 6525 ED Nijmegen, the Netherlands tel. +3180612483 (UTC-2)
achowe@tiger.waterloo.edu (anthony howe) (12/09/89)
> >>What is a folding editor? > >An editor that can 'hide' the body of a program part (procedure module) you >are not interested in at the moment. You only see the procedure/module header. >The editor needs to know a bit about the language to do this. Todd's FOLDED is a general text editor that handles folds based on indent level. He does have a logical fold command for C braces {, }. A folded editor does not have to be language specific to do folds. I'm sure with an afternoon Todds's editor could be modified to recognise PASCAL's begin and end statements in order to create a new command for logical PASCAL folds. - ant achowe@tiger.waterloo.edu | "It is hard to make the world go away _ -|-|_ _ | when it has decided to notice you." (_\ |\| | | | (_) |\| \/ | - Spock's World ___/ | disclaimer...
peter@ficc.uu.net (Peter da Silva) (12/09/89)
In article <567@kunivv1.sci.kun.nl> ge@kunivv1.sci.kun.nl (Ge' Weijers) writes: > An editor that can 'hide' the body of a program part (procedure module) you > are not interested in at the moment. You only see the procedure/module header. > The editor needs to know a bit about the language to do this. Not necessarily. You can hide the folding information in a comment: /* +@+frobozz() * ... */ frobozz() { ... } /* +@+ */ Then this would be displayed as a single line marked "frobozz()" in some contrasting color (or whatever). I'd much rather do this than have a language directed editor. My experience with them in the past has given me a bad taste in the mouth. Besides, this'd give you the ability to fold other stuff. (waits for 40 people to say they have Emacs macros for this already) -- `-_-' Peter da Silva. +1 713 274 5180. <peter@ficc.uu.net>. 'U` Also <peter@ficc.lonestar.org> or <peter@sugar.lonestar.org>. "If you want PL/I, you know where to find it." -- Dennis
ken@argus.UUCP (Kenneth Ng) (12/11/89)
In article <567@kunivv1.sci.kun.nl>, ge@kunivv1.sci.kun.nl (Ge' Weijers) writes: : horlache@sun1.ruf.uni-freiburg.de (Ullrich Horlacher) writes: : >What is a folding editor? : An editor that can 'hide' the body of a program part (procedure module) you : are not interested in at the moment. You only see the procedure/module header. : The editor needs to know a bit about the language to do this. Hm, is that like the xedit (VM/CMS) 'exclude' command? Sometimes I want to compare two sections of code that have another section inbetween them. I just tell xedit not to show me from line A to line B. Another funky use of it is I tell it to show me all lines with 'alpha' and not 'beta', kind of like a funky grep. -- Kenneth Ng: Post office: NJIT - CCCC, Newark New Jersey 07102 uucp !andromeda!argus!ken *** NOT ken@bellcore.uucp *** bitnet(prefered) ken@orion.bitnet
leech@homer.cs.unc.edu (Jonathan Leech) (12/12/89)
In article <1384@argus.UUCP> ken@argus.UUCP (Kenneth Ng) writes: >I just tell xedit not to show me from line A to line B. Another funky use >of it is I tell it to show me all lines with 'alpha' and not 'beta', kind >of like a funky grep. Yes! The ALL command is wonderful. I added it to the editor I maintain (a distant relative of the RAND editor and INed) in 1985 after seeing it in XEDIT. I use it all the time now :-) Any editor without this ability is seriously lacking; I find ALL is particularly useful in conjunction with a powerful set of rectangle-oriented operations. -- Jon Leech (leech@cs.unc.edu) __@/ "A compact set can be controlled by a finite police force no matter how dumb." H. Weyl ca. 1938
ge@kunivv1.sci.kun.nl (Ge' Weijers) (12/12/89)
ken@argus.UUCP (Kenneth Ng) writes: [Stuff about folding editors deleted] >Hm, is that like the xedit (VM/CMS) 'exclude' command? Sometimes I want >to compare two sections of code that have another section inbetween them. >I just tell xedit not to show me from line A to line B. Another funky use >of it is I tell it to show me all lines with 'alpha' and not 'beta', kind >of like a funky grep. Something like that. If xedit were smart enough to find the end of a procedure/ module if I point at the beginning, AND it would give some indication what it was hiding (the procedure header, for instance), AND it could save this along with the text it would be a folding editor. A lot of macro-hacking would probably do it. Ge' Ge' Weijers Internet/UUCP: ge@cs.kun.nl Faculty of Mathematics and Computer Science, (uunet.uu.net!cs.kun.nl!ge) University of Nijmegen, Toernooiveld 1 6525 ED Nijmegen, the Netherlands tel. +3180612483 (UTC-2)
ken@argus.UUCP (Kenneth Ng) (12/19/89)
In article <580@kunivv1.sci.kun.nl>, ge@kunivv1.sci.kun.nl (Ge' Weijers) writes: : ken@argus.UUCP (Kenneth Ng) writes: : [Stuff about folding editors deleted] : >Hm, is that like the xedit (VM/CMS) 'exclude' command? [edit] : Something like that. If xedit were smart enough to find the end of a procedure/ : module if I point at the beginning, AND it would give some indication what it : was hiding (the procedure header, for instance), AND it could save this along : with the text it would be a folding editor. A lot of macro-hacking would probably : do it. Hm, the programming standards here dictate a documentation block of what I generally term useless junk which I don't need to see when I'm coming on from home at 1200 baud (yes I'm deprived). When my xedit session fires up, it checks if its a C source, if so it hides the documentation block for me automantically. I can see that its hidden because of the jump in the line numbers, or I can do a 'shadow on' to see exactly where the lines are being hidden and how many are hidden. If I just issue 'file', the entire contents are saved. If I issue 'put' only the display contents are saved to file. How hard is it? The code fragment follows: 'extract/filetype' if filetype == 'C' then do 'top' 'locate/$documenter' 'exclude /$documenter' end I don't consider that a lot of macro hacking. Sometimes the Great Satan (IBM) does come up with a good idea. Kenneth Ng: Post office: NJIT - CCCC, Newark New Jersey 07102 uucp rutgers!andromeda!galaxy!argus!ken bitnet(prefered) ken@orion.bitnet -- Kenneth Ng: Post office: NJIT - CCCC, Newark New Jersey 07102 uucp !andromeda!argus!ken *** NOT ken@bellcore.uucp *** bitnet(prefered) ken@orion.bitnet