karl@ddsw1.MCS.COM (Karl Denninger) (06/29/89)
In article <1444@laura.UUCP> jf@laura.UUCP (Jan-Hinrich Fessel) writes: >In article <263@icdi10.UUCP> fr@icdi10.UUCP (Fred Rump from home) writes: >>Also unido controls things tightly to feed anyone over there at a profit. > >Wrong. We don't make profit. In fact, our laws in gemany do not allow >universities to make profit. The money we raise is used for maintenance >of our equipment and for paying (small) wages to the students running the >backbone, and last not least for paying our share of transmission-costs >to the european backbone mcvax. Up to this point everything is fine.... but that doesn't cover $47,000+ a year! >We have to spend money for running the backbone and for getting a >computer on which we can do serious work, because our university >is not willing to pay or contribute system-time anymore, and noone >is donating us anything. AHA! Here's the rub, and the part that people are up in arms about. Your university has seen fit to take from all the Usenet people in Germany so it can have a "computer to do serious work on". Now, may I ask, just why should the users of Usenet pay for YOUR private computer system? Apparently, the consensus is that they should not, given the large and heated debate going on right now over what your "non profit" enterprise charges for feeding news! Why don't you buy your own computer, with your own money, to do your serious work -- and use the unido funds ONLY FOR USENET FEEDS AND DIRECTLY RELATED COSTS. The cost of a connection would probably drop by 75%+ -- and the complaints would stop! Alternately, stop blacklisting those who tell you to stuff your fees and go elsewhere for their feed. That's what free markets are all about. If you want to claim that you are simply covering your expenses in making the net available, then publish a full accounting of your costs and revenues for the last year. Of course this wouldn't be a good idea if the numbers don't back up your claims - like if they show that the shiny new system you do your "serious work" on - and keep to yourself -- was paid for by all those German sites unido fees! ;-) >We like to have as much users as possible to minimize the costs for everyone. ....and you will insure it by practicing blacklisting and other anti-social tactics..... (I'm not impressed) >>I have a friend with a Telebit who is trying to set up a direct call to me to >>receive a few groups and then pass them around. But woe be to him if he's >>found out. Yep, be glad you live here. >No problem in germany too, as long as 1 is paying and the rest does >not want to appear explicitly in the maps. But what if they DO want to appear in the maps? They should be able to do so, at least under a "uucp" name. What if I haul off and form another domain, and allow anyone who wants to in Germany to join it -- and route the mail through us to someone who's willing to poll here in the US? That would put a little bit of water on your unido fire, no? Perhaps we in the USA need to do exactly that, and teach you a little economics at the same time. >Maybe noone is following the discussion: read dfk@cwi's article... We ARE following the discussion, and the more we hear from your side of the pond the more obvious it is that you're doing what amounts to robbing those who get their news from you, with the barrel of a "usenet gun" pointed at their heads. While that wouldn't even be a cause for protest in a FREE MARKET, you are ALSO trying to prevent said free market from being a reality -- by blacklisting and otherwise harassing those sites which tell you to stuff your charges and go elsewhere. My offer holds -- any European site which wants to get news from us can do so for the price of the phone call across the Big Pond. Send email for connection information. If enough people want to poll I'll even go find a way to get a domain set up for it. -- Karl Denninger (karl@ddsw1.MCS.COM, <well-connected>!ddsw1!karl) Public Access Data Line: [+1 312 566-8911], Voice: [+1 312 566-8910] Macro Computer Solutions, Inc. "Quality Solutions at a Fair Price"