[comp.windows.misc] Simple mouse/menu access

jesup@cbmvax.UUCP (Randell Jesup) (08/22/88)

In article <5613@ihlpf.ATT.COM> warren@ihlpf.ATT.COM (Montgomery) writes:
>  My appliction would like to use the mouse for
>pointing and menues, and take explicit control of a scrollbar if
>provided, but would otherwise like to treat the screen like a
>terminal.  Most windowing systems seem to offer me the choice of
>running my application under a terminal emulator (e.g. xterm,
>shelltool) that provides no access to the mouse and no control of
>the scrollbar, or running directly on the windowing system, which
>requires that I explicitly paint the screen using calls to the
>windowing library instead of escape sequences and usually requires
>that my application be re-structured to be event driven, which isn't
>very natural for it.  What I'd really like is:

	This has been thought of before, in the Amiga OS.  The console
device (that is attached to windows optionally) is essentially an ANSI
3.64 terminal emulator.  It also has additional escape sequences that allow
you to turn on things such as mouse buttons reporting, mouse position, 
window resizing, etc.  While not every thing can be done through this,
it allows most of what you're looking for.

>Changes in the mouse buttons reported via escape sequences in the
>same input stream as the keyboard.  Mouse position either reported
>with the button events or available via a function call.

	Available.

>Some way of presenting menues, either by specifying in advance that
>a certain button is for menues, giving a menu, and having the
>selection reported in the input stream, or by having some function
>that puts up a menu and returns a selection invokable after a mouse
>push.

	Menu numbers are returned when a menu is selected.  Intuition
(the windowing system) calls for setting/clearing menustrips can be used
with this.

>Explicit control over any scrollbars, either through an escape
>sequence that controls where the bar is displayed or through a
>function call that does it.  Mouse pushes in the scroll bar would be
>reported in the same way as other mouse pushes, perhaps with
>different encoding.

	Scrollbars are not currently directly part of the user interface.
Proportional gadgets (with x and/or y freedom, and either automatic knobs
(% of width/height) or custom images are part of the OS, and can be reported
via the console.device.  Also requesters that pop up will send set/clear
messages, and disks inserted/removed will send messages (though it doesn't
identify which disk at this time).  There is also a timer entry, I think you
can get 1/10 sec messages there.  All messages are timestamped in secs and
microsecs, and include modifier key/button states.
	
>The closest thing I have seen to this is the windowing system on the
>Unix PC, which can be set up to report mouse events the way I'd like
>and provides the ability to put up a menu, but I have yet to see
>comparable things for X, News, or Sunview.  Any suggestions?

-- 
Randell Jesup, Commodore Engineering {uunet|rutgers|allegra}!cbmvax!jesup

sau@wind.bellcore.com (Stephen A Uhler) (08/24/88)

In article <5613@ihlpf.ATT.COM> warren@ihlpf.ATT.COM (Montgomery) writes:
>I face a problem when porting an application into a new windowing
>system that strikes me as common, but few windowing systems provide
>a good solution for.  My appliction would like to use the mouse for
>pointing and menues, and take explicit control of a scrollbar if
>provided, but would otherwise like to treat the screen like a
>terminal. [text deleted]  What I'd really like is: [text deleted]

The MGR windowing system.  It permits application programs to
specify arbitrary strings to be sent to the application in response
to mouse hits and menu selections, on the same data stream as
keyboard input.

Instead of reqiring a special program to do terminal emulation,
terminal emulation is availiable in every window and may be restricted
to an arbitrary sub-rectangle within the window.  Thus you can have
scroll bars, banner lines (etc.) of your favorite size and still
take advantage of the built in terminal emulation.

Existing non-window applications can readily take advantage of
pop-up menus and mouse based positioning, simply by instructing MGR
what application keyboard commands to simulate in response to mouse
or menu selections.

You can get MGR via anonymous ftp from bellcore.com (or send mail
to mgr@bellcore.com if you can't).

Stephen Uhler
sau@bellcore.com

gvr@jumbo.dec.com (Guido van Rossum) (09/02/88)

MGR's author forgot to tell us what systems MGR runs on.
To save you an ftp trip to bellcore, it runs on Sun 2 and 3 monochrome
and color monitors only.

--Guido van Rossum

PS: what are all the boring MS-Windows questions doing in this group?
Isn't it time for comp.windows.ms?

brent@well.UUCP (Brent Southard) (09/02/88)

In article <13319@jumbo.dec.com> gvr@jumbo.UUCP (Guido van Rossum) writes:
>PS: what are all the boring MS-Windows questions doing in this group?
>Isn't it time for comp.windows.ms?

Unfortunately, Guido, not all of us are priviliged enough to have Unix
workstations on our desks.  While I'm looking forward to doing X or Open
Look programming in the future, I'm doing what I can with MS Windows for the
present.  I think it is as valid a windowing system to discuss here as any
other.  If someone *would* like to start a Windows newsgroup however, I
think it would be a good idea...  Any takers?

	brent
-- 
Brent Southard                    |  Everybody's trying to be a friend of mine,
Usenet:  ...well!brent            |  Even a dog can shake hands. - W. Zevon
   CIS:  76657,415                |  We fell into love, love's a very deep hole.
 GEnie:  b.southard               |                      - Loudon Wainwright III

dgordon@teknowledge-vaxc.ARPA (Dan Gordon) (09/07/88)

In article <7008@well.UUCP> brent@well.UUCP (Brent Southard) writes:
>Look programming in the future, I'm doing what I can with MS Windows for the
>present.  I think it is as valid a windowing system to discuss here as any
>other.  If someone *would* like to start a Windows newsgroup however, I
>think it would be a good idea...  Any takers?
>

I'm up for an MSW newsgroup.  We might get an interesting technical forum
for those of us working in MSW, AND we could keep Guido from sinking into
ennui.

Dan Gordon

blair@enint.Wichita.NCR.COM (Brian Lair) (09/07/88)

In article <24789@teknowledge-vaxc.ARPA>, dgordon@teknowledge-vaxc.ARPA (Dan Gordon) writes:
> In article <7008@well.UUCP> brent@well.UUCP (Brent Southard) writes:
>>Any takers?
> 
> I'm up for an MSW newsgroup.
Hear! Hear!  Perhaps comp.windows.ms?

Until there's such a newsgroup, what is considered the best electronic
forum for MS Windows discussions and q&a?
-- 
Brian R. Lair            NCR Corporation, E&M Wichita, Advanced Development
 Brian.Lair@Wichita.NCR.COM
 {ece-csc,hubcap,gould,rtech}!ncrcae!ncrwic!Brian.Lair
 {sdcsvax,cbatt,dcdwest,nosc.ARPA,ihnp4}!ncr-sd!ncrwic!Brian.Lair

mcdonald@uxe.cso.uiuc.edu (09/08/88)

>Until there's such a newsgroup, what is considered the best electronic
>forum for MS Windows discussions and q&a?
-
On this network, comp.windows.misc. There is a very active,
knowledgeable, and expensive group on Bix; they seem to be VERY
commercial people.

Doug McDonald