wynkoop@esquire.UUCP (Brett Wynkoop) (12/29/89)
Greeting-
I just got a new product announcement and price list from microware.
680x0 versions of OS9000 are priced through the sky! What are they going
to do drop motorola support in a year or two?
OS9000/80386 Dev Pak..................................$995.00
OS9000/680x0 Dev Pak.................................$2500.00
Yes you read right 2.5 times as much. I wonder why? The 680x0 port was
probably the easy one to do. Looks IMHO that Microware wants to stop
supporting the motorola line.
-Brett
uucp.................cmcl2!esquire!wynkoop
domain...............wynkoop@esquire.dpw.com
CI$..................72057,3720
Land Line............212-266-0741
Air Wave.............WA3YRE/2 (7.075 Mhz, 7.255 Mhz, 14.313 Mhz, 14.230 Mhz)sampson@attctc.Dallas.TX.US (Steve Sampson) (12/29/89)
In article <1697@esquire.UUCP>, wynkoop@esquire.UUCP (Brett Wynkoop) writes: > > OS9000/80386 Dev Pak..................................$995.00 > OS9000/680x0 Dev Pak.................................$2500.00 > These prices are obscene. I can get Unix for way less than that, I hope that includes a good (better than past) C compiler and Lex/Yacc/Tools!
djh9381@ultb.isc.rit.edu (D.J. Halko) (01/02/90)
I am really suprised at the price difference between OS9000 on the intel based computers and the Motorola based systems. I realize why the price is around $999 or so for the Intel Based computers, but rather steamed myself about the $2500 price tag that I just read about. I have been selling Intel based computers now for close to 3 years and would never consider buying one (especially since I have owned a Motorola based computer for close to 5 years and I am in the market for a new Motorola based OS9 based computer.) With that pricetag, I am afraid that OSK will be the only choice that I could consider. Microware has done it again, I am afraid. Whenever they seem to come out with a good thing, they price it for industry and not for the others who have been supporting them outside of the industry. If they were to make an update for OS68K giving it all the new capabilities of OS9000, then I could almost understand the pricing. If not, then they are merely making an attempt at supporting 2 different OS's (thus effectively separating the Motorola and Intel communities... which I am not all that angry about personally, just a little upset that they are dividing the computer community again - making a rift very much like the MS-Dos & everyone else who runs a different computer rift.) The last time that Microware tried to support 2 different OS's, the previous OS was dropped from production and support. This situation I have described was the discontinuation of 6809 based OS-9 (levels one and levels two.) This message is more of an outcry of outrage, disappointment, and fear for the future of my investments. If it weren't for Microware, I would have purchased an MS-Dos based computer years ago. If the current path remains unchanged, I may not purchase another Microware OS again... not when the life expectancy on an OS is determined by the price of the OS, and that is the case in a consumer driven supply and demand market. I can only hope that the prices quoted on the news network was a typo on the author's part of on Microware's part. David J. Halko djh9381@ritvax.bitnet
wynkoop@esquire.UUCP (Brett Wynkoop) (01/02/90)
In article <1843@ultb.isc.rit.edu> djh9381@ultb.isc.rit.edu (D.J. Halko) writes: > supply and demand market. I can only hope that the prices quoted > on the news network was a typo on the author's part of on Microware's > part. > > David J. Halko > djh9381@ritvax.bitnet Greeting- No error on my part. I posted the info because I was shocked. -Brett
joseph_cheek@i-core.UUCP (Joseph Cheek) (01/03/90)
In article <1697@esquire.UUCP>, wynkoop@esquire.UUCP (Brett Wynkoop) writes: >Greeting- > I just got a new product announcement and price list from microware. > >680x0 versions of OS9000 are priced through the sky! What are they going >to do drop motorola support in a year or two? > > [...] Looks line IMHO that microware wants to stop >supporting the motorola line. Why would microware want to stop supporting the Motorola line? We all know that Motorola microprocessors are better, faster, and more powerful...
bdw@rwing.UUCP (Brian Wright) (01/03/90)
In article <1843@ultb.isc.rit.edu>, djh9381@ultb.isc.rit.edu (D.J. Halko) writes: > > With that pricetag, I am afraid that OSK will be the only choice > that I could consider. Microware has done it again, I am afraid. > Whenever they seem to come out with a good thing, they price it > for industry and not for the others who have been supporting them > outside of the industry. If they were to make an update for OS68K > > This message is more of an outcry of outrage, disappointment, and > fear for the future of my investments. If it weren't for Microware, > I would have purchased an MS-Dos based computer years ago. If the > current path remains unchanged, I may not purchase another Microware > OS again... not when the life expectancy on an OS is determined by > > David J. Halko > djh9381@ritvax.bitnet Well, David, that's how coroporate America works, I'm afraid. Microware can stand to profit for from the '386 crowd than those who own home computers with a 6809/680x0 crowd. ILook at it from a business standpoint: Probably more people own 386 boxes than 68K boxes at home, or for small businesses. So, more money could be earned from sales of OS-9000 than for OS-K. Hence the high pricing. Let's see if we can convince the users of 68K boxes to upgrade to 386 boxes if they want to save money, they're probably thinking. If this is the case like you claim, then I'll never again own another O <oops!> OS by Microware again. I say that Microware can eventually make MicroSoft a bit nervous it were to aggressively market versions of OS-9 for the Amiga, MacIntosh, Atari ST, and the Color Computer 3. Now, with the latter, the CoCo 3 release of OS-9 Leve II offers features not currently found on any machine in any price range, to my knowledge. So, here's the way to start. I've been using OS-9 Level II on the CoCo 3 for over three years now, and have been spoiled by the windowing feature on this implentation. If Tandy drops the CoCo 3, and if Microware ceases all support for OS-9/6809, then less software will be developed, and I'll be forced to change to another system. -- Brian D. Wright - bdw@rwing.UUCP ..!uw-beaver!uw-entropy!dataio!pilchuck!rwing!bdw ---------------------------------------------------------------------
wynkoop@esquire.UUCP (Brett Wynkoop) (01/04/90)
In article <1022@rwing.UUCP> bdw@rwing.UUCP (Brian Wright) writes: >. If Tandy drops the CoCo 3, and if Microware ceases >all support for OS-9/6809, then less software will be developed, and I'll >be forced to change to another system. > >-- >Brian D. Wright - bdw@rwing.UUCP >..!uw-beaver!uw-entropy!dataio!pilchuck!rwing!bdw Greeting- To the best of my knowldge microware dropped 6809 support this past summer. It is hard to get in touch with anyone at Microware that even remembers what a 6809 is except maybe James Jones since he owns one. I asked a sales person if os9000 worked like level1 or level2 and he had no idea what I was talking about. -Brett uucp.................cmcl2!esquire!wynkoop domain...............wynkoop@esquire.dpw.com CI$..................72057,3720 Land Line............212-266-0741 Air Wave.............WA3YRE/2 (7.075 Mhz, 7.255 Mhz, 14.313 Mhz, 14.230 Mhz)
pubtendr@xroads.UUCP (Steve Roberson) (01/04/90)
Please excuse my ignorance, but what is this new product called OS9000 and what is so special about it? How does it differ from OSK and OS9? Time for a plug from Microware I guess..... -- \ / C r o s s r o a d s C o m m u n i c a t i o n s /\ (602) 941-2005 300|1200 Baud 24 hrs/day / \ hplabs!hp-sdd!crash!xroads!pubtendr
neals@tekigm2.MEN.TEK.COM (Neal Sedell) (01/05/90)
>> [...] Looks line IMHO that microware wants to stop >>supporting the Motorola line. > > Why would microware want to stop supporting the Motorola line? We all know > that Motorola microprocessors are better, faster, and more powerful... And I wonder what Motorola thinks about Microware jumping ship since <gross generalization follows> uWare owes its very existence to Motorola????? That may explain why it's NOT called OS-9. A few years ago the difference in prices between Mot and Int was justified, but now that the 386 is out.... -- # Neal Sedell (206) 253-5280 W e # aka neals@tekigm2.MEN.TEK.COM M a k e # Tektronix, Inc., Delivery C1-936 D i g i t i z e r s # PO Box 3500, Vancouver, WA 98668 (and Fast Data Caches)
bills@mcrware.UUCP (Bill Shepard) (01/06/90)
OS-9000 is the next generation of OS-9. Being a superset of OS-9 it maintains the same general architecture and is mostly source-level compatible. The main difference is that OS-9 is written in 68K assembly code, OS-9000 is written 95% in C, 5% in processor-specific assembly code. This will allow us to recompile OS-9000 to other platforms (68020/030 and 80386 currently, other popular RISC and CISC chips as the market dictates) with much less effort. When comparing prices of OS-9000/68020(30) and OS-9000/80386, please be aware that there is only a difference in the prices of our Development Paks (pre-configured for a specific machine). OS-9000 for a Compaq (or compatible) 386-based machine is $995. OS-9000 for a Motorola 147 is from $2250 to $2500, and for a Motorola 133 is $1750. The price for licensing OS-9000 does not depend on the microprocessor. The price of the OS-9000 Development Pak is generally related to the cost of the machine it runs on - a 386 AT is much less expensive than a Motorola 133 or 147 VME-based system, and the pricing of our OS-9000 Development Paks reflects that. Please don't take pricing as any sort of a statement of politics concerning Motorola and Intel. Bill Sheppard Technical Sales Representative Microware Systems Corporation
wynkoop@esquire.UUCP (Brett Wynkoop) (01/09/90)
In article <1446@mcrware.UUCP> bills@mcrware.UUCP (Bill Shepard) writes: >When comparing prices of OS-9000/68020(30) and OS-9000/80386, please be aware >that there is only a difference in the prices of our Development Paks >(pre-configured for a specific machine). OS-9000 for a Compaq (or compatible) >386-based machine is $995. OS-9000 for a Motorola 147 is from $2250 to $2500, >and for a Motorola 133 is $1750. The price for licensing OS-9000 does not >depend on the microprocessor. The price of the OS-9000 Development Pak is >generally related to the cost of the machine it runs on - a 386 AT is much >less expensive than a Motorola 133 or 147 VME-based system, and the pricing >of our OS-9000 Development Paks reflects that. Please don't take pricing as >any sort of a statement of politics concerning Motorola and Intel. > >Bill Sheppard >Technical Sales Representative >Microware Systems Corporation Greeting- Does this mean I can expect a $200 version of os9000 dev pak for the atari st. After all it costs less than a 386 box? Ok, maybe a $300 dev pak for the St, or amiga, or..... I think you see my point. I can with OS9 develop software on any of these to run on any 680x0 machine. I do not think it is a good policy, but then Microware never has had a marketing stratagy. Maybe that is why the folks from the north west have most of the micro os market. Sure would be nice to see a good OS competativly priced. Microware is getting there with OS9000 at 995 for dev pak, but they should relase a personel version for about $150. Just take the C compiler/debugger out and sell it to the masses. With proper marketing and a windowing package the unwashed masses would eat it up. -Brett uucp.................cmcl2!esquire!wynkoop domain...............wynkoop@esquire.dpw.com CI$..................72057,3720 Land Line............212-266-0741 Air Wave.............WA3YRE/2 (7.075 Mhz, 7.255 Mhz, 14.313 Mhz, 14.230 Mhz)
knudsen@cbnewsd.ATT.COM (michael.j.knudsen) (01/10/90)
I've heard that Microware's managers are washouts from Tandy Towers.
Or did I get that backwards?
--
Mike Knudsen knudsen@ihlpl.att.com (312)-713-5134
"Round and round the while() loop goes;
Whether it stops," Turing says, "no one knows."
Your SELF may not be all you've got, but it's the last thing you'll lose.knudsen@cbnewsd.ATT.COM (michael.j.knudsen) (01/11/90)
Somebody* shot off their dumb lip and said: *me?! See apology at end.
> I've heard that Microware's managers are washouts from Tandy Towers.
No way. Microware has three big management advantages over Tandy:
(1) Microware is still a small company (correct me if wrong).
They can react and make decisions quickly, and change their minds just
as fast if need be.
(2) Microware supposedly has someone in charge and knows it.
Tandy, according to folks who have dealt with them on Coco issues,
is not only too large in numbers of managers, but also there is no
one person or even a well-defined committee who can make and stick by
a decisions, such as "what to do about the Coco."
When some Tandy manager states some "fact" at a RainbowFest, he's
probably telling the truth as he sees it, as far as he knows, but
honestly nobody knows because there's no concensus.
(3) Microware sells ONE product (OS-9 in its various versions),
not a whole store full.
Uware (Microware) should be able to manage circles around Tandy.
[But if we old Coconuts sense Tandy-like behavior from Uware, we
understandably get nervous, having been there many times before.]
Uware seems to be branching out from industrial markets into office
markets with its '386 version of OS-9000. That is, going after
MSDOS and OS/2 on their own turf. With aggressive marketing
(huh?) and lower prices on a Personal version, they just might
bring it off, to our undending delight.
Uware deserves credit for breaking out of the industrial mold.
For us Coco (and ST, Amiga, KMA) people, the question is whether
Uware will support the "home" or "hobby" or "small business('286)"
markets. I can understand Uware's reluctance to get involved in
these markets, but the payoffs in future business/industrial users
could be tremendous. Also these users are more tolerant as Beta
testers when bugs turn up -- we make lots of noise but no lawsuits.
And the hardware is other company's worries, not Uware's -- neat.
Suggestion: Uware should spin off a separate subsidiary to take
a shot at the "small" market, so the existing management needn't
worry about its details. Or perhaps find some outsiders willing
to form such an outfit (Darling & Associates, anyone?).
[Tandy did some of the job well for a while, but seems to have lost
interest -- you don't need OS9 to play Nitwitendo.]
*Anyway I'm sorry I shot off my lip on this forum -- must have
thought I was on the Coco List. We Coconuts have been yo-yo'ed
around for a long time, and we love OS9 too much to see it fading
out of the picture except for big, wealthy, specialized users.
I hope Uware knows what a valuable set of "free advertisers"
they created with Tandy's help. Even if we are a mite unruly at times.
--
Mike Knudsen knudsen@ihlpl.att.com (708)-713-5134
"Round and round the while() loop goes;
Whether it stops," Turing says, "no one knows."
The Air Is Free -- or $50 with a PADI card.bills@mcrware.UUCP (Bill Sheppard) (01/11/90)
In article <1707@esquire.UUCP> wynkoop@esquire.UUCP (Brett Wynkoop) writes: >In article <1446@mcrware.UUCP> bills@mcrware.UUCP (Bill Shepard) writes: >>When comparing prices of OS-9000/68020(30) and OS-9000/80386, please be aware >>that there is only a difference in the prices of our Development Paks >>(pre-configured for a specific machine). OS-9000 for a Compaq (or compatible) >>386-based machine is $995. OS-9000 for a Motorola 147 is from $2250 to $2500, >>and for a Motorola 133 is $1750. ... A point I forgot to mention is that OS-9000 for the Motorola 147 includes the Internet Support Package for full TCP/IP implementation, which is a $650 package purchased separately. Bill Sheppard Technical Sales Representative Microware Systems Corporation
bdw@rwing.UUCP (Brian Wright) (01/11/90)
In article <12551@cbnewsd.ATT.COM>, knudsen@cbnewsd.ATT.COM (michael.j.knudsen) writes: > I've heard that Microware's managers are washouts from Tandy Towers. > Or did I get that backwards? Mike, I feel the same way about management at The Boeing Co. sometimes. :-) Perhaps corporate managers can be classified as a different life form! :-) -- Brian D. Wright - bdw@rwing.UUCP ..!uw-beaver!uw-entropy!dataio!pilchuck!rwing!bdw ---------------------------------------------------------------------
knudsen@cbnewsd.ATT.COM (michael.j.knudsen) (01/12/90)
Does Microware yet have any pricing or availability info on OS-9000
with no Dev Pak, editors, etc -- i.e., just for running purchased
applications? Historically Uware has charged a lot less for such
"personal" OS9. Once the developers start putting out the products
of their full-blown systems, this is where the mass market will be.
--
Mike Knudsen knudsen@ihlpl.att.com (708)-713-5134
"Round and round the while() loop goes;
Whether it stops," Turing says, "no one knows."
The Air Is Free -- or $50 with a PADI card.wynkoop@esquire.UUCP (Brett Wynkoop) (01/13/90)
In article <1469@mcrware.UUCP> bills@mcrware.UUCP (Bill Sheppard) writes: >In article <1707@esquire.UUCP> wynkoop@esquire.UUCP (Brett Wynkoop) writes: >>In article <1446@mcrware.UUCP> bills@mcrware.UUCP (Bill Shepard) writes: >>>When comparing prices of OS-9000/68020(30) and OS-9000/80386, please be aware >>>that there is only a difference in the prices of our Development Paks >>>(pre-configured for a specific machine). OS-9000 for a Compaq (or compatible) >>>386-based machine is $995. OS-9000 for a Motorola 147 is from $2250 to $2500, >>>and for a Motorola 133 is $1750. ... > >A point I forgot to mention is that OS-9000 for the Motorola 147 includes the >Internet Support Package for full TCP/IP implementation, which is a $650 >package purchased separately. Greeting- Ok lets do some simple math and see how much a it would cost if Microware left out this wonderful bonus. OS9000 68020............$2500.00 minus - TCP/IP.................. 650.00 ================================== OS9000 68020 w/o TCPIP $1850.00 Where I went to school 1850 != 995. So it still looks like,IMHO, get out the grease if you are a Motorola user. I say again if it is linked to the platform price when will we see OS9000 for some of the 680x0 based PCs at a realistic price? If large software companys could maintain one source code for programs weather they ran on the Mac, Amiga, Atari, PT68k, 147 Delta 3200, or an IBM clone developers and users would flock to OS9000, because all the same stuff would work no matter what machine you were on (of course using the proper binarys for the cpu). Of course the folks in Iowa know this, they just do not appear to know what to do with it. If done correctly this procuct could start edging MS-DOS and OS/2 out. Get window drivers and devices in this package too. I know at least one person who would write the stuff for you if you made the right offer. The above is not intended as a flame, but rather as one users suggestions for improvement of the entire line. It may not seem like it, but I like OS9/9000. -Brett uucp.................cmcl2!esquire!wynkoop domain...............wynkoop@esquire.dpw.com CI$..................72057,3720 Land Line............212-266-0741 Air Wave.............WA3YRE/2 (7.075 Mhz, 7.255 Mhz, 14.313 Mhz, 14.230 Mhz)
wynkoop@esquire.UUCP (Brett Wynkoop) (01/13/90)
In article <12579@cbnewsd.ATT.COM> knudsen@cbnewsd.ATT.COM (michael.j.knudsen) writes: > > >I hope Uware knows what a valuable set of "free advertisers" >they created with Tandy's help. Even if we are a mite unruly at times. I agree totaly. Using OS9 on my coco I have convinced a few large operations to look into using OSK for development of multiplexors, and other hardware with resident intelegence. >-- >Mike Knudsen knudsen@ihlpl.att.com (708)-713-5134 >"Round and round the while() loop goes; > Whether it stops," Turing says, "no one knows." >The Air Is Free -- or $50 with a PADI card. -Brett uucp.................cmcl2!esquire!wynkoop domain...............wynkoop@esquire.dpw.com CI$..................72057,3720 Land Line............212-266-0741 Air Wave.............WA3YRE/2 (7.075 Mhz, 7.255 Mhz, 14.313 Mhz, 14.230 Mhz)