morgan@JESSICA.STANFORD.EDU (11/11/88)
Jos van Wezel writes: > >................. > >For the last year I've used a floppy-only Mac+ with access via > >PhoneNET to a 3Com 3Server file server, which allowed me to have my 2 > >Mbyte System folder, 10 Mbytes of other files, and access to 20Mbytes > >of shared applications. It wasn't as nice as the Ethernet-attached > > ................ > > I must be very naive, but never heard of booting the Mac off the Pnet. > Is it possible to use a Mac without a floppydrive, and at the same > time have a 2M System? Yes, the Mac boots off a floppy which contains a minimal System and the file service client software, then when the server volumes are mounted, it runs a tiny application that switches control to the large System on one of the server volumes. All hands-free, and it even works under MultiFinder. Again, it's not especially fast over PhoneNet/LocalTalk, but it's usable. I'm not sure if this same capability is available with AppleShare or Tops. Anyone know? - RL "Bob" Morgan Networking Systems Stanford
wnn@DSUNX1.DSRD.ORNL.GOV (W. N. Naegeli) (11/12/88)
Using Tops, you can use a system on a Tops server. You have to boot from a floppy that has Tops software installed and then switch to the system on the server. I don't know of a utility that does this automatically but you can do it manually. The constraints are that you must not launch the Multi Finder before switching systems, because you can't switch once MultiFinder is running. Also, if you want to use INITs and certain CDEVs, these must be on your boot diskette, since switching systems won't load INITs and CDEVs present in the server's system folder. To make things even more complicated, some INIT files, such as Suitcase must remain on line because they contain not only the INIT code itself but also resources that do not get loaded into memory but are accessed on the disk during operation. Thus you may need to have a copy of those INITs in the Server's system folder as well. If you want to save CDEV settings after switching systems, the CDEVs also need to be in the server's system folder. Some settings take only effect after re- booting. Thus, when changing such settings, you must either do it before switching systems or you must copy the CDEV whose bootup settings you have changed from the server to your boot diskette before rebooting your local Mac. All of this may be quite inconvenient and it is slow if you are on a LocalTalk or PhoneNet connection. If you are on EtherTalk its almost as fast as a slow hard disk. Setting a pretty big RAM cache is paritcularly beneficial on LocalTalk since it can drastically reduce network traffic and delays. I don't think this will work on AppleShare, because AppleShare keeps the server's system in what it calls the Server folder intead of the System folder and it hides the Server folder from clients, so you cant get at the system file to switch launch. Now, you could have a System and a Finder in another AppleSre folder, but that would violate the rule that there must be only one System and Finder on a disk. We've had problems with AppleShare probably because someone had inadvertently put a second System and Finder on it. If your AppleShare server has two hard disks, however, this might work fine. I have not tried it.
morgan@JESSICA.STANFORD.EDU (11/15/88)
wnn@dsunx1.dsrd.ornl.gov (W. N. Naegeli) writes: > [Very good material about CDEVs and INITs on the startup floppy > versus the server volume.] > Setting a pretty big RAM cache is particularly beneficial on LocalTalk > since it can drastically reduce network traffic and delays. 3Com's 3+Mac appears to disable the use of RAM-caching on the file server volumes, I assume because data on the file server volume might be changed at any time by other users, so the cached data might be obsolete. Even a volume which is read-only to me isn't cached, because it might not be read-only to others. I figured it was just part of the price for server access. Do other file services (Tops, AppleShare) permit a client Mac to cache file server data? - RL "Bob" Morgan Networking Systems Stanford
chris@eecs.nwu.edu (Chris Krohn) (11/16/88)
On an AppleShare system, the local start-up disk (floppy or fixed) remains the system disk. It is not possible to have the mac boot and then switch to using another set of system files on a server. It doesn't matter what you are using as cabling--AppleShare doesn't have this capability. Chris Krohn CHRIS@NUACC.ACNS.NWU.EDU
dyson@Apple.COM (Patrick Dyson) (11/18/88)
>part of the price for server access. Do other file services (Tops, >AppleShare) permit a client Mac to cache file server data? > AppleShare makes a cache of all of the remaining memory after it's allocations and the foreground app's. This is a server side cache. The workstation code caches some directory information, but not a lot else as it is not allowed to use the file system cache and doesn't want to use that system heap space. ---------- The opinions expressed are my own, I just get to play at Apple. Pat Dyson
psych@watdcsu.waterloo.edu (R.Crispin - Psychology) (11/18/88)
I have been away so I missed the original posting and probably much of the follow up stuff. Here we have used both Macjanet and MacServe as our networking software. We use floppies to boot from. On the server each machine has volume that contains a System Folder that is usually 1 to 1.5 meg. After loging on the user opens the System Folder on the server volume and holds option and command (cloverleaf) and double clicks the finder. This causes the system on the server volume to become the default volume. The diskette can then be "trashed" and the user can put their own floppies in the drive. This works well although it can be slow when a lot of users are trying to access the server at the same time. I have no experience with AppleShare but I would think a similar approach could be taken. Richard Crispin Dept. of Psychology Bitnet: psych@watdcs University of Waterloo Unix : psych@watdcsu.UWaterloo.ca Waterloo, Ont. Canada N2L 3G1 (519)885-1211 ext 2879