louis@aerospace.aero.org (Louis M. McDonald) (02/02/90)
I know this may have been discussed in one form or another, but I would like to bring it up again. Many MacMail to SMTP interfaces have been through Quickmail or some other product. I would be interested in hearing about efforts (maybe there is only one or none) to make real UNIX mail and real SENDMAIL work on a Macintosh network. My point of view is that not everyone wants/can afford these commercial systems. It would be nice if /usr/ucb/mail was rehosted to the Macintosh (with a mac like interface) and sendmail so that real RULES could be used. I know this may be easier said than done, but I thought I would bring it up. -- Louis McDonald Internet: louis@aerospace.aero.org The Aerospace Corporation 213-336-8914
amanda@mermaid.intercon.com (Amanda Walker) (02/03/90)
In article <65967@aerospace.AERO.ORG>, louis@aerospace.aero.org (Louis M. McDonald) writes: > Many MacMail to SMTP interfaces have been through Quickmail or some > other product. I would be interested in hearing about efforts (maybe > there is only one or none) to make real UNIX mail and real SENDMAIL > work on a Macintosh network. The closest I know of are some efforts (by our company among others) that allow a Mac to be a parasite of a UNIX mail host. In short, you get real live Internet mail on you Mac, but it depends on a smart host (usually running sendmail or MMDF) to actually do the routing. Mail retrieval is usually done with POP, since doing SMTP all the way to a Mac has some problems (Macs tend to be turned off a lot more than your average mail hub, for example :-)). If one were to do a full internet mail package on a Mac, one would probably pick something a little easier to configure than sendmail, too... :-). -- Amanda Walker InterCon Systems Corporation "Many of the truths we cling to depend greatly upon our own point of view." --Obi-Wan Kenobi in "Return of the Jedi"
randy@trident.arc.nasa.gov (Randy Moore) (02/05/90)
We have just finished a package that talks to Unix machines using the POP protocol for sending/receiving E-mail. The Package was developed for NASA and is free to anyone, providing no portion of the package is resold. If you would like more information send me E-Mail. R- ===================================================================== Randy Moore Sterling Software Internet: randy@trident.arc.nasa.gov
urlichs@smurf.ira.uka.de (Matthias Urlichs) (02/06/90)
Comp.protocols.appletalk, from demarsee@ICARUS.CNS.SYR.EDU (Darryl E. Marsee):
< >My point of view is that not everyone wants/can afford these
< >commercial systems. It would be nice if /usr/ucb/mail was rehosted
< >to the Macintosh (with a mac like interface) and sendmail so that
< >real RULES could be used. I know this may be easier said than done,
< >but I thought I would bring it up.
<
< I'd like to put my vote in for Stanford's MacMH program, which
< uses a Unix system as a revised POP server. We use it campus-wide
< here, and it works great.
<
< Advantages: [ many [omitted ]]
< Disadvantages: Requires Macs to connect to IP network (either directly
< or through a Kinetics/Gatorbox gateway)
Major disadvantage:
MacIP and MacMH don't yet work with Apple's MacTCP.
(At least last time I asked them, they didn't.)
NB: With some trickery, you don't have to have an account for each user.
(Some of this is included with the MMDF MTA.)
Right now, we try to use HyperCard to interface our Macs to the Unix boxes.
Advantage: Flexibility. For instance, the latest version of MacMH we have (I
think it's 2.0) didn't allow for user-specific headers, didn't
create a Date: header (which is a problem with mmdf's SMTP
implementation, since it does not add this header), and a bunch of
other problems.
Major disadvantage: Reliability. HyperTCP still seems somewhat flakey.
Getting updates distributed is also a bit of a hassle, although I am
giong to get this organized...
<
Disclaimer: People here are also using HyperCard to read News and to FTP
stuff.asher@UHURA.CC.ROCHESTER.EDU (Samuel Asher) (02/06/90)
Count me in for a copy, or tell me how I can FTP it. Thanks, Sam Asher University of Rochester
lefty@obelix.twg.com ("David N. Schlesinger") (02/07/90)
In <1482@smurf.ira.uka.de>, Matthias states: >> Major disadvantage: >> MacIP and MacMH don't yet work with Apple's MacTCP. >> (At least last time I asked them, they didn't.) I'm currently using version 4.0b2 of MacMH; it works just fine with MacTCP. Best regards, Lefty ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- The opinions stated reflect only those of the the author... David N. Schlesinger InterNet: Lefty@TWG.com Phone: 415/962-7219 "A Smith & Wesson beats four of a kind."
demarsee@GAMERA.CNS.SYR.EDU (Darryl E. Marsee) (02/07/90)
>Major disadvantage: >MacIP and MacMH don't yet work with Apple's MacTCP. Not true. I've been using version 4.0, which works with MacTCP, since last September. You might want to contact them again. Their address is macip@jessica.stanford.edu. >NB: With some trickery, you don't have to have an account for each user. True, but since we already have procedures in place to allocate accounts on our academic Unix system, it is administratively easier for us to just give a user an account instead of having to take care of a separate database of mail-only users. >Right now, we try to use HyperCard to interface our Macs to the Unix boxes. >Advantage: Flexibility. For instance, the latest version of MacMH we have (I >think it's 2.0) didn't allow for user-specific headers, didn't >create a Date: header (which is a problem with mmdf's SMTP >implementation, since it does not add this header), and a bunch of >other problems. As far as the version of MacMH, see above. While there is no date header created by MacMH, it IS added by sendmail, so it's no problem if you use sendmail instead of MMDF. Also, since (1) MacMH supplies the headers needed to get the mail through, and (2) I have yet to have a user complain to me that he/she can't add headers, not having the ability to add them hasn't been much of a problem here. As for "a bunch of other problems", haven't seen them myself, nor heard of them from our users. >Major disadvantage: Reliability. HyperTCP still seems somewhat flakey. >Getting updates distributed is also a bit of a hassle, although I am >giong to get this organized... >Disclaimer: People here are also using HyperCard to read News and to FTP >stuff. MacMH has been as stable as a rock for us. Disclaimers: I too use HyperCard to read News; works fine. For FTP/Telnet I use Stanford's MacIP; also works fine. As far as I'm concerned, there is no "best" or "worst"; use whatever meets the needs for your particular situation; I just wanted to point out another available option.
morgan@JESSICA.STANFORD.EDU (02/08/90)
> >Major disadvantage: > >MacIP and MacMH don't yet work with Apple's MacTCP. > > Not true. I've been using version 4.0, which works with MacTCP, > since last September. You might want to contact them again. > Their address is macip@jessica.stanford.edu. OK, OK, (speaking loudly to be heard over the roar of incoming requests), here's the story on SU-Mac/IP 4.0. First, we are NOT yet distributing it generally, but we're very close. (In my lap sits a draft of the user's manual, festooned with post-its and red ink.) Current timeline is end of February. (As a side-note, there's nothing like actually putting out a software product to make one sympathetic of all the problems that real vendors must have.) SU-Mac/IP 4.0 does indeed run over Apple's MacTCP, which will be distributed with it. The package includes its traditional components, "Mac/IP" which is a Telnet/FTP/Finger/Whois client, and "Mac/MH" which is a POP-3/SMTP client for incoming and outgoing mail respectively. A new feature is "SU-lpr", a desk accessory that sends text files to Unix lpd servers. Mac/IP has been extended quite a bit with some nice ease-of-use features, while Mac/MH is virtually unchanged other than the new transport. SU-Mac/IP will continue to be licensed only to degree-granting institutions of higher education. I believe that when 4.0 is ready we intend to contact current licensees about upgrade procedures. For more info, please do contact macip@jessica.stanford.edu (not me, and not "networking@jessica"), but don't expect info about 4.0 for another couple of weeks. - RL "Bob" Morgan Networking Systems Stanford
randy@TRIDENT.ARC.NASA.GOV (Randy Moore) (02/08/90)
SUBJECT: The MacPOP and PC POP Electronic Mail Packages
The MacPOP Electronic Mail Package.
===================================
The MacPOP Electronic Mail Package allows a user to read and send mail
from the Unix account without ever leaving the comfort of their
Macintosh environment. The package consists of the MacPOP application,
PopAlert (an INIT/CDEV that throws up a notification anytime you receive
new mail), and Launch MacPOP DA (this lets you place MacPOP anywhere on
your hard drive and launch it from the apple menu).
In addition to the abilities to send and receive mail messages, the
application provides:
- a user configurable address book
- the ability to send and receive text, BinHex, and UUEncode
enclosures along with your message
- the ability to save messages so that your favorite word
processor will be opened when you launch the message from the
Finder
The MacPOP Mail Package was developed at NASA Ames Research Center and
is available free of charge to all individuals/ organizations desiring
to use it. However, It may not be sold or bundled with any commercial
product.
Please Note: MacPOP also uses MacTCP, a commercial product distributed
by Apple Computer. This must be acquired separately from Apple.
The PC POP Electronic Mail Package.
===================================
PC POP is an IBM (or compatible) personal computer electronic mail
client program that allows its users to send and receive electronic mail
to and from their UNIX account(s) without leaving the MS-DOS
environment.
Currently version 2.1 of PC POP operates using the Excelan ethernet
board. A version 2.1 NCSA supporting 3Com, Western Digital, Slip8250,
MICOM-Interln, IBMToken and NOVELLE boards will be released in a month
or two. Earlier versions exist for the 3Com board (3C501) and the TOPS
flashcards.
The features and functionality of PC POP came from the Berkeley Mailer,
version 5.2. Some PC POP features are:
- user interface modeled after the DECSYSTEM-2060's TOPS-20
- Mail address aliasing.
- Inclusion of ASCII files.
- Inclusion and Extraction of UUENCODE/UUDECODE, BINHEX/HEXBIN,
TEXT enclosures.
- Invoking a PC editor/word processor on the body of a new
message.
- Message Alert to inform the user when new mail has arrived.
- The ability to finger (look up) other users.
- The ability to fork (sort of) other MS-DOS programs in PC POP.
AVAILABILITY
==============
The MacPOP and PC POP client program and the POP server are available
free of change from NASA. However, you may *NOT* sell or reuse any part
of the package for commercial purposes. To acquire the POP Electronic
Mail Package, you must submit a written request to:
Dr. Dale R Lumb
Division Chief Code ED
NASA Ames Research Center
Mail Stop 233-17
Moffett Field, CA 94035
with a carbon copy to:
John Yin
Group Leader
NASA Ames Research Center
Mail Stop 233-18
Moffett Field, CA 94035
Technical Information:
=============================
MacPOP and PC POP are implemented using an enhanced POP2 (Post Office)
Protocol (RFC 937) and the Simple Mail Transfer Protocol (RFC 922). The
POP server can be compiled and installed on Ultrix, 4.3BSD, SunOS 4.0.3
and Apple's A/UX. The client/server command protocol is carried out
using TCP/IP.
Sources for the enhanced server are also available upon request.
========================================================================
Randy Moore & Bill Schweickert
Internet: binky@trident.arc.nasa.gov
Sterling Federal Systems
Data Systems Development Group
NASA Ames Research Center
Mail Stop 233-18
Moffett Field, CA 94035
========================================================================