dorner@pequod.cso.uiuc.edu (Steve Dorner) (07/06/90)
Has anyone had problems with K-Star, MacTCP, and Dynamic IP addresses?
We have one site trying to use this combination with very little success.
The macintoshes usually cannot talk to anything with IP, not even
a machine on their local network accessed through its IP number.
Just to make life more interesting, they occasionally (say, 1 reboot
out of 10) work just fine. I have been unable to detect any rhyme or
reason to when they do or do not work.
These same Macintoshes have no problems whatsoever with the non-mactcp
versions of NCSA Telnet and tn3270.
Here are the specifics:
Kbox at 128.174.91.64, configured for 5 static and 50 dynamic addresses.
MacTCP:
Dynamic addressing (node id from 1-254 [why does MacTCP want to know?])
Gateway address 128.174.91.1 (a proteon ip router)
Class B addressing, 16 net bits, 8 subnet bits, 8 node bits
Does this ring any bells for anybody? I'm baffled.
Maybe I should tell them to get Gatorboxes instead...
--
Steve Dorner, U of Illinois Computing Services Office
Internet: s-dorner@uiuc.edu UUCP: {convex,uunet}!uiucuxc!dornerDon.Gilbert@IUBio.Bio.Indiana.Edu (Don Gilbert) (07/07/90)
In article <1990Jul6.155348.18646@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu> dorner@pequod.cso.uiuc.edu (Steve Dorner) writes: > Has anyone had problems with K-Star, MacTCP, and Dynamic IP addresses? > > We have one site trying to use this combination with very little success. > The macintoshes usually cannot talk to anything with IP, not even > a machine on their local network accessed through its IP number. > > Just to make life more interesting, they occasionally (say, 1 reboot > out of 10) work just fine. I have been unable to detect any rhyme or > reason to when they do or do not work. > > These same Macintoshes have no problems whatsoever with the non-mactcp > versions of NCSA Telnet and tn3270. Problems at the site I manage sound similar, but not the same: Our macs plug in thru phone wiring to MaxTalk cards for Access/1 from Ungermann-Bass, each of which has 16 lines which each mimics a Kinetics Fastpath, I believe. As above, Telnet without MacTCP works fine. I installed about 50 macs with MacTCP (patched version 1.0) using Dynamic IP addresses. All MacTCP programs worked when I first installed them a few weeks back. Now I find that every so often, all MacTCP programs on some of these Macs will fail for at least a few hours. They will sometimes recover and start working, sometimes not. When I try MacTCP 1.0.1, they same problem occurs. The macs will aquire a dynamic IP address from the MaxTalk card (which I can see with Interpoll), but programs all fail, regardless of whether name or number is used to address a host. When I try Static IP addressing, MacTCP programs all work. -- Don Don.Gilbert@iubio.bio.indiana.edu biology dept., indiana univ., bloomington, in 47405, usa
dorner@pequod.cso.uiuc.edu (Steve Dorner) (07/07/90)
I wrote:
>Has anyone had problems with K-Star, MacTCP, and Dynamic IP addresses?
Two people have already pointed me at the problem.
To use dynamic ip addresses with MacTCP, you must choose "Server" in
the AdminTCP CDEV.
What everybody else calls "dynamic addressing", that is the handing out
of IP addresses by an appletalk-ip gateway, MacTCP calls "Server" addressing.
Silly me; I had assumed "Server" meant RARP.
My only guess as to what "dynamic" means to MacTCP is that it should
examine the entrails of a goat to find the ip address; we evidently
forgot to provide a goat.
For those of you who are fond of black humor, here are the relevant
portions of the MacTCP admin guide:
o You have selected the Server button in the Administrator dialog box so
that the IP address is obtained automatically from a Server. The IP
Address box appears on the MacTCP Control Panel with the address
already set.
o You have selected the Dynamically button in the Administrator dialog
box so that the node portion of the IP address is assigned dynamically
from the indicated range. The IP Address box appears on the MacTCP
Control Panel with the address already set.
--
Steve Dorner, U of Illinois Computing Services Office
Internet: s-dorner@uiuc.edu UUCP: {convex,uunet}!uiucuxc!dornerveizades@apple.com (John Veizades) (07/07/90)
Read the manual. Dynamic addressing in the control panel is not the same as dynamic addressing on KStar. Just set your control panel to acquire your IP address from the server (the server radio button). John Veizades...
wcc@cup.portal.com (wcc - usa) (07/07/90)
> Has anyone had problems with K-Star, MacTCP, and Dynamic IP addresses? > We have one site trying to use this combination with very little success. > The macintoshes usually cannot talk to anything with IP, not even > a machine on their local network accessed through its IP number. > > Just to make life more interesting, they occasionally (say, 1 reboot > out of 10) work just fine. I have been unable to detect any rhyme or > reason to when they do or do not work. There is a very simple procedure that you can follow to fix these problems. I have used it lots of times. 1. Use peek to grab all packets off the wire for those sessions that work and those that don't. 2. Print all the packets out (there'll be lots of them). 3. Crack the packets with the help of a copy of "Inside AppleTalk" in one hand and the KIP sources in the other (these define the MacIP protocol that is the thing that is failing). Note that reading source code in order to crack a protocol isn't easy but it is challenging. I mean it. This is not a ":-)" posting. This is how you do it. > Maybe I should tell them to get Gatorboxes instead... They'd do the same thing. So would MultiGates (though don't let that stop you from buying them :-). Now the fix... > MacTCP: > Dynamic addressing (node id from 1-254 [why does MacTCP want to know?]) > Does this ring any bells for anybody? I'm baffled. "BING!" You want "Server" addressing, not "Dynamic". You've just suffered a Jargon collision. Apple doesn't use "dynamic" to mean what you think it is (and they're bigger). As far as I can guess (the books are 8000 miles away) "Dynamic" means "Pick a random IP address in this range and then ARP for it. If no-one answers it's yours". I think you're meant to set the Macs up to do this on Ethernet in a range of IP addresses the Mac's then can fight for (shock horrors!!). On LocalTalk it will probably work if you fluke an IP address in the STATIC range on the FastPath. If you set the range to the STATIC range it would probably work all the time. The kbox is acting as a MacIP "Server" for the Macs. Hence the term. Note the above debugging technique would have shown this instantly without any cracking as the bad IP addresses are shown up in ASCII in the right-hand column. You would have seen a string like: "192.9.200.1 IPADDRESS" with different IP addresses being attempted. Tom Evans wcc@cup.portal.com Webster Computer Corporation Suite J, 2109 O'Toole Ave. San Jose, California 95131-1303 Ph (408) 954-8054 FAX (408) 954-1832 Head Office tom@wcc.oz.au, multigate@wcc.oz.au 1270 Ferntree Gully Rd. Scoresby, Victoria, Australia Ph 61 3 764-1100 FAX 61 3 764-1179
powsner@csb1.nlm.nih.gov (Seth M Powsner) (07/07/90)
It may be that MacTCP "Dynamic" IP Address assignment means that MacTCP will
try to generate an IP Address in the appropriate (?) range based on the
AppleTalk node address of the machine and then check (NBP?) with other
nodes to see if the IP Addr is already taken. Vaguely remember hearing about
that capability. Don't know anyone who uses it. Maybe it would be more
useful in an environment where you weren't using TCP/IP encapsulated in
AppleTalk. In any case, when I was Beta-testing MacX I had trouble with the
term "Dynamic" for MacTCP <> "Dynamic" for FastPath and folks at Apple
seemed to be aware of this. Maybe they couldn't revise the manuals so...
Seth M Powsner powsner.medinf@yccatsmtp.ycc.yale.edu
powsner@yalemed.bitnet