mazu@roselin (Marc Mazuhelli) (05/24/91)
Hi there NetLand,
I am considering buying a Webster Multiport Gateway for our network.
We already have a GatorBox with GatorShare and GatorPrint (which we
would keep), but we are gradually switching to CAP.
Before I decide, I would like to know a few things:
1) will the AFP servers simulated by GatorShare be made available to
the LocalTalk Macs hooked-up to one of the 4 LocalTalk ports of the
MultiPort Gateway? (I don't see why not, but who knows? - I know it
adds a lot of network traffic, but it would be just until we switch to
CAP and AUFS)
2) I know it can be configured using an HyperCard stack; is it easy to
set up and configure (compared to a GatorBox which I already know)
3) I think it downloads its code from a Mac or a Unix box (like the old
GatorBox); it that reliable? Does it always come back on line
*without user intervention* after a power failure?
4) Since one box will handle 4 LocalTalk segments, if the box breaks
down, it affects a lot of people (and I will be in trouble, since I
will be the one they come yelling to...); so is the box as reliable as
Webster tells me it is (both hardware and software)
5) 2 EtherRoutes would provide support for 4 LocalTalk ports at a lower
cost and potentialy more reliability (1 failure affects only half the
people) but with less LaserWriter security (which we need) and without
a few other things like async appletalk; is the higher price of the
Webster box worth it? With its DMA design, would 1 Webster box be as
fast as two EtherRoutes?
6) Is async appletalk really usable? (probably not a 2400bps, but what
about 9600?)
7) Support by Cayman is pretty good; how does Webster's support
compare? I know they distribute their software updates by anon ftp
and provide support via e-mail but I would like to know if they really
answer our questions with real solutions and in a timely manner.
I didn't think I would have so many questions... Don't fell like you
have to answer to all of them; if you have info on only one or two
points, I would like to hear from you.
You can answer via private e-mail, I will post a summary of the answers
I get in a week or two.
Thank you very much for your help. We can't afford to make a mistake
with this purchase...
--
{ Marc Mazuhelli | professeur }
{ internet: mazu@dmi.USherb.CA | Departement de math-info. }
{ <this space intentionaly ... | Universite de Sherbrooke }
{ ... left blank> | Sherbrooke, Quebec, Canada }moyman@ECN.PURDUE.EDU (Mike Moya) (05/24/91)
> >Hi there NetLand, > >I am considering buying a Webster Multiport Gateway for our network. >>We already have a GatorBox with GatorShare and GatorPrint (which we >would keep), but we are gradually switching to CAP. > >Before I decide, I would like to know a few things: > >1) will the AFP servers simulated by GatorShare be made available to >the LocalTalk Macs hooked-up to one of the 4 LocalTalk ports of the >MultiPort Gateway? (I don't see why not, but who knows? - I know it >adds a lot of network traffic, but it would be just until we switch to >CAP and AUFS) Both boxes do this without a problem.... >2) I know it can be configured using an HyperCard stack; is it easy to >set up and configure (compared to a GatorBox which I already know) Set-up is such a personal experience, I can only give you my opinion here. The stack is easy to follow but I found it very cumbersome (I hated it actually). The GatroBox is trivial to set-up in my opinion. This was the bad part of using the Multiport. >3) I think it downloads its code from a Mac or a Unix box (like the old >GatorBox); it that reliable? Does it always come back on line >*without user intervention* after a power failure? The MultiPort also can use a UNIX host to do do this (you can also use a mac). > >4) Since one box will handle 4 LocalTalk segments, if the box breaks >down, it affects a lot of people (and I will be in trouble, since I >will be the one they come yelling to...); so is the box as reliable as >Webster tells me it is (both hardware and software) The box I had never crashed... > >5) 2 EtherRoutes would provide support for 4 LocalTalk ports at a lower >cost and potentialy more reliability (1 failure affects only half the >people) but with less LaserWriter security (which we need) and without >a few other things like async appletalk; is the higher price of the >Webster box worth it? With its DMA design, would 1 Webster box be as >fast as two EtherRoutes? >6) Is async appletalk really usable? (probably not a 2400bps, but what >about 9600?) I don't use EtherTalk so I can't help you here... > >7) Support by Cayman is pretty good; how does Webster's support >compare? I know they distribute their software updates by anon ftp >and provide support via e-mail but I would like to know if they really >answer our questions with real solutions and in a timely manner. I felt their support staff was comparable (and you get those cool Aussie accents...). Overall, I was impressed with the MultiPort. Setting up the box was brutal, I actually had to read the manual. Since it's a (large) stack you also need Hypercard and a Home stack, at this point you can't fit it all on a boot floppy. You also have to have a serial line connection to the MultiPort for set-up. In order to boot the box, you need a Mac with a hard drive and within 6 feet to attach the serial connection (not real practical for those of use with many boxes floating around riser closets and your portable doesn't have a hard drive). The MultiPort uses atalkad so it will fit right in to your FastPath network, GatorBoxes can use atalkad as well. The performance of the box through the Ethernet was very good (Aufs), it's a BIG win here. I did benchmarks comparing the GatorBox running their latest (1.6), the MultiPort running the latest Megan (the number escapes me, 2.3 I think) and a FastPath 4 (8.1.1) doing a 3.5 Meg, 110 file/folder Aufs copy (to the Mac) with 1, 2, 3 and 4 macs at the same time. E-mail me if you are interested in the results... --moya --Mike Moya --Macintosh Systems and Networking --Engineering Computer Network, Purdue University --moyman@ecn.purdue.edu
steve@rastaban.anu.oz.au (Steven Ball) (05/28/91)
I administered a MultiPort long ago (over 12 months ago), so things have no doubt improved since then. Our campus has well over a dozen of these boxes, and overall they work extremely well. Anyway, enough of the disclaimers! I'll just delete the questions I can't answer. Here goes... mazu@roselin (Marc Mazuhelli) writes: >2) I know it can be configured using an HyperCard stack; is it easy to >set up and configure (compared to a GatorBox which I already know) Setting up a single MultiPort wasn't *too* bad (wasn't too good either). Setting up several MultiPorts connected via a backbone ethernet was a real pain. >3) I think it downloads its code from a Mac or a Unix box (like the old >GatorBox); it that reliable? Does it always come back on line >*without user intervention* after a power failure? Yes, Yes. >4) Since one box will handle 4 LocalTalk segments, if the box breaks >down, it affects a lot of people (and I will be in trouble, since I >will be the one they come yelling to...); so is the box as reliable as >Webster tells me it is (both hardware and software) Hardware-wise the box is very reliable. Software-wise, well, ours kept crashing... but remember that was many months ago and a new version of megan was installed just before I left so my comments may no longer be a true reflection of the current story. >5) 2 EtherRoutes would provide support for 4 LocalTalk ports at a lower >cost and potentialy more reliability (1 failure affects only half the >people) but with less LaserWriter security (which we need) and without >a few other things like async appletalk; is the higher price of the >Webster box worth it? With its DMA design, would 1 Webster box be as >fast as two EtherRoutes? The box has very good performance. It probably is worth it, but of course it's a trade-off. >7) Support by Cayman is pretty good; how does Webster's support >compare? I know they distribute their software updates by anon ftp >and provide support via e-mail but I would like to know if they really >answer our questions with real solutions and in a timely manner. I have no experience of Cayman's support. I found Webster's and kre's (the guru who actually wrote megan) support excellent and invaluable. Webster offer e-mail, telephone and fax support; kre is reachable via e-mail. >Thank you very much for your help. We can't afford to make a mistake >with this purchase... Who can? >-- >{ Marc Mazuhelli | professeur } >{ internet: mazu@dmi.USherb.CA | Departement de math-info. } >{ <this space intentionaly ... | Universite de Sherbrooke } >{ ... left blank> | Sherbrooke, Quebec, Canada } -- Steven Ball, Department of Computer Science, ANU E-mail: steve@anucsd.anu.edu.au Ph. (06) 2495146 Snail-mail: GPO Box 4, CANBERRA CITY ACT 2600, AUSTRALIA He's not the messiah, he's a very naughty boy!
steve@rastaban.anu.oz.au (Steven Ball) (05/28/91)
G'Day mate! (Spoken with cool aussie accent) moyman@ECN.PURDUE.EDU (Mike Moya) writes: >> >>7) Support by Cayman is pretty good; how does Webster's support >>... >I felt their support staff was comparable (and you get those cool Aussie >accents...). They should bottle it and sell it! No worries! Steve (cool aussie) Ball. -- Steven Ball, Department of Computer Science, ANU E-mail: steve@anucsd.anu.edu.au Ph. (06) 2495146 Snail-mail: GPO Box 4, CANBERRA CITY ACT 2600, AUSTRALIA He's not the messiah, he's a very naughty boy!
pnm@goanna.cs.rmit.oz.au (Paul BIG-EARS Menon) (05/28/91)
Marc, I couldn't reach you by mail, so I'm posting to news... In article <1991May24.124056.12175@DMI.USherb.CA>, mazu@roselin (Marc Mazuhelli) writes: > Hi there NetLand, > > I am considering buying a Webster Multiport Gateway for our network. > > We already have a GatorBox with GatorShare and GatorPrint (which we > would keep), but we are gradually switching to CAP. > > Before I decide, I would like to know a few things: We currently have 3 in our dept. I evaluated the MultiPort Gateway some time ago (early '90), putting it through some really exhausting benchmarks. It was then known as the MultiGate (and still is to some :-)). The MultiPort limits were determined. Melbourne Uni and Webster modified the SW almost immediately. From then on, the MultiPort, in my opinion, works well within its limits under student lab loads (read - ANYWHERE). What happens in our student labs? Everyone hops onto the file server(s) at almost the same time, creating worst case conditions for about 15 minutes (we have Encores as CAP file servers - they'll pump out AFP packets before you ask for them). If the MultiPort can put up with that, it can put up with anything. > > 1) will the AFP servers simulated by GatorShare be made available to > the LocalTalk Macs hooked-up to one of the 4 LocalTalk ports of the > MultiPort Gateway? (I don't see why not, but who knows? - I know it > adds a lot of network traffic, but it would be just until we switch to > CAP and AUFS) Can't answer that, we don't have those drinks at RMIT. I assume it can, the MultiPort seems to handle most Applish protocols. > > 2) I know it can be configured using an HyperCard stack; is it easy to > set up and configure (compared to a GatorBox which I already know) Can't tell you about the comparison, but I used to enjoy keying the config DIRECTLY into the gateway. Since Ethertalk Phasor II, I'm stuck with Hypercard. The config could (and should) have a friendlier user interface, or the choice of direct config. It was so much fun. I just liked the low level, direct control. This is from someone who enjoys Smalltalk - yich! > 3) I think it downloads its code from a Mac or a Unix box (like the old > GatorBox); it that reliable? Does it always come back on line > *without user intervention* after a power failure? Not sure here, we don't get that many power failures (avg once a year). I know you can configure it to search for a config (boot) host on power up. Right now I have that part disabled. I like to know explicitly when there has been a prob. Sure this can cause probs, but like I said, once a year? > 4) Since one box will handle 4 LocalTalk segments, if the box breaks > down, it affects a lot of people (and I will be in trouble, since I > will be the one they come yelling to...); so is the box as reliable as > Webster tells me it is (both hardware and software) You bet. At one stage last year I took note of how many days it had been running, how's 95 days without a restart or reboot? The only time it does get rebooted is for a SW upgrade. Once you have gotten over the painful configuration session (making wise choices), you can literally forget about it's existence. It purrs along without a fuss. I only wish some of our other equipment could behave like this. I've frequently found no real need to rush into upgrading the SW, there has never been an 'emergency upgrade'. You can take your time. That reminds me, now System 7 is in, one of these days I'll have to type 'make' for CAP 6.0 on our Encore 4.3 machine (so stressful). What I'm not looking forward to is the port to our System V Encore, it's a monster (well, it was the last time !) > 5) 2 EtherRoutes would provide support for 4 LocalTalk ports at a lower > cost and potentialy more reliability (1 failure affects only half the > people) but with less LaserWriter security (which we need) and without > a few other things like async appletalk; is the higher price of the > Webster box worth it? With its DMA design, would 1 Webster box be as > fast as two EtherRoutes? Dunno, all I can say is, the DMA makes a difference. The HW and SW have been squeezed to the max by Melbourne Uni & Webster. > > 6) Is async appletalk really usable? (probably not a 2400bps, but what > about 9600?) I played with it on a 2400 modem line from home. Don't expect miracles, hyperspace doesn't exist. I've tried a 9600 local (serial) line, it's workable, but again don't expect the moon. What do you want for 9600 bps? > > 7) Support by Cayman is pretty good; how does Webster's support > compare? I know they distribute their software updates by anon ftp > and provide support via e-mail but I would like to know if they really > answer our questions with real solutions and in a timely manner. You join a mailing list. Melbourne Uni & Webster aren't the only ones who'll respond to your queries, you get advice and experiences from anyone on the list who wishes to post. And they DO listen. They do respond - quickly. The mailing list is a good idea, Australian mobs can get pretty rowdy when something's wrong - good incentive for a fix :-). if you're on the internet - you can ftp directly for upgrades (and more). I say all this as a satisfied Webster customer. Good Luck, Paul Menon, Dept of Computer Science, Royal Melbourne Institute of Technology, 124 Latrobe Street, Melbourne 3001, Victoria, Australia. pnm@goanna.cs.rmit.oz.au PH: +61 3 660 3209
jwk@Scripps.EDU (John Kupec) (05/30/91)
In article <1991May24.124056.12175@DMI.USherb.CA> mazu@roselin (Marc Mazuhelli) writes: >Hi there NetLand, > >I am considering buying a Webster Multiport Gateway for our network. > [questions I can't answer deleted] I was going to answer by email but thought this may be of general interest to the group: I'm in the same boat exactly. I haven't found anyone that recommends the EtherRoute (nobody uses it?) but have heard a lot of good things about the Webster box. Are you aware that Webster is offering a 40% discount (to a "select group of companies", whatever that means) until the end of June? I think a Webster @ $2997 is a great deal. Also, Cayman is unloading the original GatorBox (bundled with GatorShare) for ~$1500. However, I am strongly considering buying two Websters at the discount price. One will provide the services I need now and the second will be a "future expansion"/backup machine. jwk -- John Kupec, Agouron Pharmaceuticals, Inc., La Jolla, CA jwk@scripps.edu or uunet!agouron!kupec