amy@suphys.physics.su.OZ.AU (Shaun Amy) (06/27/91)
Hi folks, I am posting the query below for a friend at another institution. If you can shed some light on the matter then please send e-mail directly to lnewton@atnf.csiro.au. Thanks, Shaun. ---------- Is it possible to use telnet and ftp through Apple's Appletalk Internet router? be able to use either telnet or ftp on a network with Apple's Internet router acting as a bridge. We have a thin ethernet spine onto which is attached a GatorBox running v1.6 of the Gatorshare software. Our Appletalk routing through this GatorBox is set to Appletalk phase 2. Attached to this GatorBox we had a large mac network of over 25 devices which we decided to split because it was too large. The option we took was to use Apple's Internet router running on a non-dedicated Mac IIci to break the 2 appletalk networks and act as a bridge. So now we have 2 zones on the appletalk side of the GatorBox. The intermediate zone - i.e. the one in between the GatorBox and Apple's Internet Router - is fine and all facilities are available. However on the other side of the Internet Router from the GatorBox while all devices on the network are visible and Appleshare file serving all works fine - we can neither use NCSA Telnet or the VersaTerm Pro telnet tool to telnet to our mainframes via Appletalk. On attempting to telnet the response is that the connection was not able to be made - the local host or gateway was not responding. Can anyone help? Lyn Newton. Australia Telescope National Facility, CSIRO Australia. e-mail: lnewton@atnf.csiro.au -- +--------------------------------------------------------------------------+ | Shaun W. Amy. | Internet: shaun@astrop.physics.su.OZ.AU | | VMS & Unix Systems Manager, | amy@suphys.physics.su.OZ.AU | | Department of Astrophysics, | | | School of Physics, | | | University of Sydney. | | | N.S.W. 2006. | Fax: +61 2 660 2903 | | Australia. | Telephone: +61 2 692 2727 | +--------------------------------------------------------------------------+
bcarter@claven.idbsu.edu (Bruce Carter) (06/27/91)
Greetings, I couldn't get our mailer to go to either of the addresses listed in the original post, so here are my comments. In your posting you write: >Is it possible to use telnet and ftp through Apple's Appletalk Internet >router? >be able to use either telnet or ftp on a network with Apple's Internet router >acting as a bridge. We have a thin ethernet spine onto which is attached a >GatorBox running v1.6 of the Gatorshare software. Our Appletalk routing through >this GatorBox is set to Appletalk phase 2. Attached to this GatorBox we had a >large mac network of over 25 devices which we decided to split because it was >too large. The option we took was to use Apple's Internet router running on a >non-dedicated Mac IIci to break the 2 appletalk networks and act as a bridge. > >So now we have 2 zones on the appletalk side of the GatorBox. The intermediate >zone - i.e. the one in between the GatorBox and Apple's Internet Router - is >fine and all facilities are available. However on the other side of the Internet >Router from the GatorBox while all devices on the network are visible and >Appleshare file serving all works fine - we can neither use NCSA Telnet or the >VersaTerm Pro telnet tool to telnet to our mainframes via Appletalk. On >attempting to telnet the response is that the connection was not able to be >made - the local host or gateway was not responding. Can anyone help? We are doing this now with what sounds like the exact same configuration. You have to set the GatorBox and MacTCP for server allocation of IP addresses. It does not and will not work with static IP addresses across the Apple Internet Router. The zone that is directly attached to the GatorBox will work, of course, with either option. For example, in my configuration, I have 12 static addresses and 20 dynamic addresses allocated. The 12 static addresses are assigned to devices in the zone directly attached to the GatorBox. The 20 dynamics are shared between the two other zones that are connected by Apple Internet Routers. If you have a device in the bridged zone that requires a static IP address, then you are, in technical terms, screwed. You'll have to move the device over to the directly connected zone. <-> Bruce Carter, Courseware Development Coordinator bcarter@claven.idbsu.edu Boise State University, Boise, ID 83725 duscarte@idbsu.bitnet (This message contains personal opinions only) (208)385-1250@phone
kre@cs.mu.oz.au (Robert Elz) (06/28/91)
malcolm@pandanus.ntu.edu.au (Malcolm Caldwell) writes: >>Internet Routers. If you have a device in the bridged zone that requires a >>static IP address, then you are, in technical terms, screwed. You'll have to >>move the device over to the directly connected zone. >But why is this the case? What is the technical reason. It relates to the ability of the IP/Appletalk gateway to locate the Appletalk address that relates to your mac with the static address. If the mac was to request its address from the gateway, then the gateway would remember the appletalk address from that request, and all would be OK. However, if the address is static, and a packet arrives address to your mac, then te gateway has to find its appletalk address somehow. The way it does that is via an NBP lookup - but that is directed to just one zone. All will be OK if both sides of the AIR are in the same zone, as the lookup will reach your mac, but if they're not, your mac will never see the lookup, therefore never reply, and so the gateway will have no idea where to send the packet. Some gateways will remember your appletalk address if you send them a packet before one is sent to you, but that's at best an unreliable way to work. There is work in progress to define a new packet that the IP layer on any mac with a static address can send to an IP gateway when it (the mac IP layer) starts, to inform the gateway of the IP address <-> appletalk address mapping, which will (should) cure these problems - at least for as long as the gateway stays up, if it crashes then when it reboots it will have lost the info, but the mac won't know to resend the magic packet. kre
malcolm@pandanus.ntu.edu.au (Malcolm Caldwell) (06/28/91)
>Internet Routers. If you have a device in the bridged zone that requires a >static IP address, then you are, in technical terms, screwed. You'll have to >move the device over to the directly connected zone. But why is this the case? What is the technical reason. We wanted to do this type of thing, and it would be a pity if we couldn't use static addresses. -- Malcolm Caldwell malcolm@pandanus.ntu.edu.au Technical Officer Computer Science Northern Territory University, Darwin Australia