steve@sdcrdcf.UUCP (Steve Holtsberg) (08/25/85)
If there is anyone out there who knows something about the lyrics to American Pie, I was wondering who the jester is?
wjh@bonnie.UUCP (Bill Hery) (08/27/85)
> If there is anyone out there who knows something about the lyrics > to American Pie, I was wondering who the jester is? Bob Dylan. '...on the sidelines in a cast...' refers to the result of his injuries in a motorcycle accident.
cds@duke.UUCP (Craig D. Singer) (08/28/85)
In article <2283@sdcrdcf.UUCP> steve@sdcrdcf.UUCP (Steve Holtsberg) writes: >If there is anyone out there who knows something about the lyrics >to American Pie, I was wondering who the jester is? I believe McLean was referring to Bob Dylan.
davida@umd5.UUCP (08/28/85)
*** FOR ALL YOU CHEW, THIS LINE'S FOR YOU *** > If there is anyone out there who knows something about the lyrics > to American Pie, I was wondering who the jester is? The jester refers to Bob Dylan, and 'the jester on the sidelines in a cast' refers to his accident (motorcycle?). Refer back about 300 articles (hah) to find more on this topic. -- David Arnold University of Maryland usenet: ...!seismo!rglvax!cvl!umd5!davida ARPA: davida@umd5.ARPA
gjerawlins@watdaisy.UUCP (Gregory J.E. Rawlins) (08/30/85)
In article <726@umd5.UUCP> davida@umd5.UUCP writes: >[.......] >The jester refers to Bob Dylan, and 'the jester on the sidelines in >a cast' refers to his accident (motorcycle?). Refer back about 300 >articles (hah) to find more on this topic. >-- >David Arnold >University of Maryland Hello All. I expect this subject has been beaten to death many times before on net.music so could some kind soul please mail me the "explanations" of all the odd things in the lyrics of "American Pie"? Also anything else on the other strange songs on that album would be much appreciated.(for example, i understand that "Vincent" is about Vincent Van Gogh, is this true?). (signed) Clued-Out-But-Eager-To-Know Thanx muchly. greg. -- Gregory J.E. Rawlins, CS Dept., U.Waterloo, Waterloo,Ontario N2L3G1,Canada CSNET:gjerawlins%watdaisy@waterloo.csnet +1 519 884 3852 ARPA :gjerawlins%watdaisy%waterloo.csnet@csnet-relay.arpa UUCP :{allegra|clyde|linus|utzoo|inhp4|decvax}!watmath!watdaisy!gjerawlins
danb@tesla.UUCP (Dan Blumenthal) (09/02/85)
In article <726@umd5.UUCP> davida@umd5.UUCP writes: > >The jester refers to Bob Dylan, and 'the jester on the sidelines in >a cast' refers to his accident (motorcycle?). Refer back about 300 >articles (hah) to find more on this topic. > >-- >David Arnold Can someone please explain most/all the references in the lyrics of American Pie or tell me HOW to refer back to old articles? Danka. Dan B ARPA - danb@tesla.ARPA UUCP - {decvax,vax135,allegra}!cornell!tesla!danb "Use more honey - find out what she knows" - Dr. Emilio Lizardo
rcook@uiucuxc.Uiuc.ARPA (09/05/85)
These are the old messages that i saved relating to American Pie.
these messages were not written by me, only compiled from the net.
I apologize to the authors of these notes for not including their
names, as I had to make the file as short as possible and editted
out the names and .sig files a long time ago.
I hope this helps. Any questions can be directed to me through the
path at the end of this note.
When "the worst song ever" was a topic in net.music,
I was going to nominate "Bye, Bye, Miss American Pie."
Firstly, the song was simply called American Pie.
But, WHY????????? It is a classic of modern music! McLean's lyrics are
marvelous! What could be wrong with it??????
----------------------------------------------------------------
Well it is all a matter of taste, and many people enjoy
songs I do not. Fact is that "American Pie" was very high in the
charts for a long time in the late 60's. I remember riding to
to high school with a person who lived near me (not a friend
exactly, he was sort of a redneck). That song played over and over.
Its lyrics may be profound, but, to me, its melody is like a
TV commercial. And all this stuff about how his lyrics
contained references to various media people of the time,
somehow does not strike me as weighty stuff.
But, since it was high in the charts, obviously, many people
liked it. So, I apologize for criticizing it. I found out long
ago that instead of criticizing popular taste, i.e. "A.M. radio sucks",
I have a guitar, a stereo and hundreds of records and tapes of music
I really like. That way I can listen to music I like and I have
nothing to complain about.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Well it is all a matter of taste, and many people enjoy
songs I do not. Fact is that "American Pie" was very high in the
charts for a long time in the late 60's.
------------------------------------------------------------------
Really? I believe the copyright for the song is 1971. Btw, in three
different versions of the sheet music I've seen it's been Lennin, Lennon,
and Lenin reading a book of Marx.
(WARNING: The rest of this note is very long.)
And now, here are selections from The Great "American Pie" Discussion of 1983
(not to be confused with The Great Wombat Debate of 1984):
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Here are the lyrics to American Pie as I heard them off the album
I also included some ideas as to some of the meanings to the lines:
AMERICAN PIE
by Don McLean (* the song is a tribute to Buddy
Holly and how American rock music has
degraded after his death *)
Long Long time ago
I can still remember
how that music used to make me smile
And I knew if I had my chance
That I could make those people dance
And maybe they'ed be happy for a while
But February made me shiver (* he died in Feb in a plane crash
With every paper I'd deliver during a snowstorm *)
Bad news on the doorstep
I couldn't take one more step
I cann't remember if I cried
When I read about his widowed bride
But something touched me deep inside
The day the music died
So
Refrain:
Bye bye Miss American Pie
Drove my Chevy to the levee but the levee was dry
Them good ole boys were drinkin wiskey and rye
Singing "This'll be the day that I die,
This'll be the day that I die."
(* one of Holly's biggest songs "That'll be the Day" had a line
in it "That'll be the day, that I die" *)
Did you write the book of love (* A 50's song "Who Wrote the Book
And do you have faith in God above Love" *)
If the Bible tells you so
Do you believe in rock 'n roll
Can music save your mortal soul
And can you teach me how to dance real slow
Well I know you're in love with him
'Cause I saw you dance'n in the gym
You both kicked off your shoes
And I dig those rythmic blues
I was a lonely teenage bronc'n buck (* the 50's were a good time
With a pink carnation and a pickup truck until Holly, "the Music",
But I knew that I was out of luck died *)
The day the music died
I started singing
Refrain
Now for ten years we've been on our own
and moss grows fat out of Rolling Stone
But that's not how it used to be
When the jester sang for the King and Queen (* jester - Dylan
In a coat he borrowed from James Dean king - Elvis *)
(* In the movie James Dean has a red jacket that he lends
to someone who gets killed. Does the jacket symbolize
imminent doom?? *)
In a voice that came from you and me
(* Dylan started from the streets and his lyrics show it *)
Oh and while the King was looking down
The jester stole his thorny crown (* Dylan rising - Elvis falling *)
The courtroom was adjourned
No verdict was returned
And while Lennon read a book on Marx
(* John Lennon getting into radical politics *)
The court kept practice in the park
[The above line is actually "A quartet practiced in the park" - Wombat]
And we sang dirges in the dark
The day the music died
We were singing
Refrain
Helter Skelter in a summer swelter (* Beatles Song *)
The birds flew with a fallout shelter
Eight miles high and falling fast
(* the Byrds sang a song called "Eight Miles High" *)
And landed foul on the grass
The players tried for a forward pass
With the jester on the sidelines in a cast
(* Dylan didn't perform for a year or so after a bad motercycle accident *)
Now the halftime air was sweet perfume
While the Sargeants played a marching tune (* Beatles' Sgt. Pepper *)
We all got up to dance
Oh but we never got the chance
'Cause the players tried to take the field
The marching band refused to yeild
Do you recall what was the deal
The day the music died
We started singing
(* this could be refering to the Beach Boys trying to take the Beatles' place
as the best group in the world. In '66 or so the B.Bs put out their most
ambitious (and best) album only to have Sgt. P's L.H. Band come out almost
simultaneously, destroying the B.Bs album in sales *)
Refrain
Oh and there we were all in one place (* Woodstock *)
A generation lost in space
With no time left to start again
So come on Jack be nimble Jack be quick (* Mick Jagger and the Stones *)
Jack Flash sat on a candlestick (* Jumpin Jack Flash - Stones
'Cause fire is the devil's only friend falling???? *)
Oh and as I watched him on the stage
My hands were clenched in fists of rage
No angel born in hell
Could break that satan spell (* the Altomont incident *)
And as the flames climbed high into the night
To light the sacraficial rite
I saw satan laughing with delight
The day the music died
He was singing
Refrain
I met a girl who sang the blues (* Janis Joplin *)
And I asked her for some happy news
But she just smiled and turned away (* she od'ed and died *)
I went down to the sacred store
Where I'd heard the music years before
But the man there said the music wouldn't play
(* a reference to the long gone practice of sampling records
in the store *)
And in the streets the children screamed
The lovers cried and the poets dreamed
And not a word was spoken
The church bells All were broken
And the three men I admire most
The Father Son and Holy Ghost
They caught the last train for the coast
The day the music died
And they were singing
Refrain (2x)
----------
Different things I have heard over the years:
The only regular job McLean ever held was as a paper boy (appears to be true)
The 'widowed bride' = Mrs. Holly or Jackie K. O. (Holly died in Feb., making
Jackie second choice)
Book of Love = 50's song
Rest of the verse seems to be the whole 50's-60's high school thing (one
thing McLean has admitted writing about was coming-of-age in that period)
'Moss grows fat on a rolling stone' = Bob Dylan slowing down
The jester = Bob Dylan
The king = Elvis Presley
Quartet practicing in the park = I've heard Beatles, but it seems more likely
to me that this is a reference to the Weavers, since this comes after
Lenin reads a book on Marx -- the Weavers were blacklisted during the
McCarthy era, and McLean was a big Weavers fan
'The birds flew off ... eight miles high' = the Byrds, and their "Eight
Miles High" album
'The half-time air was sweet perfume' = drugs, man
'The sergeants played a marching tune' = Beatles, and Sgt. Pepper's Lonely
Hearts Club Band
Next to last verse (Jack, be nimble ..., No angel born in hell) refers to
the Stones's Altamont concert where the Hell's Angels working security
killed spectators
The 'girl who sang the blues... but she just smiled and turned away' =
Janis Joplin, and her death
'The Father, Son, and Holy Ghost' = Holly, "The Big Bopper", and the
third man in the plane crash or JFK, Martin Luther King, Bobby Kennedy(?)
or the religious guys themselves (McLean went to Catholic schools and
his religious beliefs come out in some of his other songs)
'They caught the last train for the coast' = California religions ?
Last verse = death of the America he imagined as a child
I don't know much about the history of the period (I was 10 when
Woodstock happened, with a low consciousness of what was going on
in the musical world) -- most of this is stuff I've read or been told.
I'm interested in what other people have heard on the subject.
----------
I don't know much about Buddy Holly, but wasn't he from
Texas? If he was, then the phrase "good ol' boys" in:
Good ol' boys were drinkin
Whiskey and rye.
makes a little more sense.
----------
As Father, Son, and Holy Ghost seem to be, apparently, meta-phors
for aspects of Deity, which is 'within you and without you' then it would
not necessarily need to be the case that theses figures would stand for
(meta- ) anything else than what they are metaphors For. No?
----------
One more reference:
Jack Flash sat on a Candlestick
is obviously about the Stones' Candlestick Park concert.
----------
"When you are about to die, a wombat is better than no company at all."
Roger Zelazny, *Doorways in the Sand*
Rob Cook
UUCP: {ihnp4,pur-ee}!uiucdcs!uiucuxc!rcook
'Life is just a cocktail party on the street'
-Mick Jagger-