craig@CWH.CAM.NIST.GOV (Craig Hunt) (02/07/90)
One of our network users, who is doing extensive work with a commercial firm, asked how that firm could have access to the Internet. Does anyone know who is offering a service to connect commercial users into Internet services. I suggested UUNET and CSNET. I also thought perhaps Merit. Suggestions, contacts, addresses would all be appreciated.
Gene.Hastings@BOOLE.ECE.CMU.EDU (02/07/90)
Merit (nsfnet-info@merit.edu) and the NNSC (NSFNET Network Service Center, nnsc@nnsc.nsf.net) can both supply information on regional "mid-level" networks whom your associates might subscribe to. They would need to know the location of the prospective client. Gene
schoff@PSI.COM ("Martin Lee Schoffstall") (02/07/90)
PSI is providing networking services (NYSERNet, CAPNet) throughout the NorthEast and MidAtlantic states and internationally. Contact info@psi.com. Marty ---------------- One of our network users, who is doing extensive work with a commercial firm, asked how that firm could have access to the Internet. Does anyone know who is offering a service to connect commercial users into Internet services. I suggested UUNET and CSNET. I also thought perhaps Merit. Suggestions, contacts, addresses would all be appreciated.
steve@cise.nsf.gov (Stephen Wolff) (02/07/90)
CSNET has merged with BITNET; the result is called CREN. There are conditionss under which the firm might be eligible for a connection to SURANET; contact Jack Hahn 301 454 5434 or hahn@umdc.umd.edu. In addition to UUNET/AlterNet (Rick Adams, <rick@ns.uu.net>), they should consider PSI; contact Marty Schoffstall <schoff@psi.com> in Reston, VA. -s
root@sbcs.sunysb.edu (Systems Staff) (02/09/90)
In article <9002071448.AA20057@nisc.nyser.net> schoff@PSI.COM ("Martin Lee Schoffstall") writes: >PSI is providing networking services (NYSERNet, CAPNet) throughout >the NorthEast and MidAtlantic states and internationally. Contact >info@psi.com. > >Marty >---------------- What does PSI charge per year for a SLIP link that provides full Internet access? Rick Spanbauer Ameristar Technology
sean@dranet.dra.com (02/10/90)
In article <9002062137.AA14927@cwh.cam.nist.gov>, craig@CWH.CAM.NIST.GOV (Craig Hunt) writes: > One of our network users, who is doing extensive work with a commercial > firm, asked how that firm could have access to the Internet. Does > anyone know who is offering a service to connect commercial users into > Internet services. I suggested UUNET and CSNET. I also thought > perhaps Merit. Suggestions, contacts, addresses would all be > appreciated. I've been trying to get a definitive answer to this question for six months. Finding the physical connection is easy; finding someone with the authority to say yes, who will say yes is hard. A related problem is finding out the limits for which a commercial firm could use the Internet (the answers vary from nothing, to anything), and getting it in writing (that's amusing). Since I'm still looking for the definitive answer, don't take this too seriously... sometimes I like to take out my frustrations by typing. Although things are improving, I finally got a response from the NSF NSC this week. The physical connection is fairly easy. 1. Find a network that is already on the Internet A few good sources for this information include a. Internet Resource Guide NSF Network Service Center (nnsc@nnsc.nsf.net) b. SERVICE@SRI-NIC.ARPA (SERVICE@NIC.DDN.MIL) Subject: HELP c. The Matrix : Computer Networks and Conferencing Systems Worldwide John S. Quarterman Digital Press, ISBN 1-55558-033-5 (less than a year old, and already some information is out of date) 2. Find out a contact person, ask them if they'll let you (goto step 1) This is were money comes up. The general rules are If you are asking for a connection to them, you pay If they are asking for a connection to you, they pay If both parties are asking for a connection, split the cost and don't charge each other 3. Get an IP network address, domain, and other adminstrivia a. either from the network you are connecting (eg. you become a subnet, or maybe a single host depending on your needs) b. or from HOSTMASTER@NIC.DDN.MIL (which will require coordination with/from the Internet core gateways) 4. Order some equipment, put in a phone line, etc 5. Hook it up, and you're on the Internet (yeah, right....:-) Ok, you're connected, but are you allowed to connect??? A starting point for most "network policies" 1. Acceptability of traffic over a particular network line is determined by the entities owning/paying for the line. 2. Interference with the use or operation of the network is viewed as not acceptable. 3. Malicious, unethical (based on accepted community standards), or illegal activities are viewed as not acceptable. Note the Commercial/Non-profit split isn't a universal concept in Internet policies, though it is a frequent one. Since no single entity owns the Internet, determining the exact policies tends to be difficult. "The Policy" of the Internet is actually a set of interlocking agreements among several hundred entities. And not all of these agreements are in writing. The Internet is really an inter-network (yep, that's what the books say). It is tempting to think of the Internet as a homogenous network, but it isn't. A group of commercial companies could set up network with a gateway to the rest of the Internet, and on that network exchange invoices with few, if any, problems. What is viewed as the "acceptable use policies," comes from the principle that who pays calls the shots. For example, commercial use of the part of the Internet paid for by NSF isn't allowed, except for things that NSF says are OK. In reality the number of networks you actually need to worry about is much smaller. Generally you need to only get a line of approval between you and one of the national backbones (about 2-4 authorizations). you<->local connection<->mid-level network<->national backbone The most likely connection will be through a mid-level network. Most of the mid-level networks have connections only within a geographic region, but a few have connections worldwide. There are also overlaps between the mid-level networks. Shop around for the best combination of price, policy, and added features (some have 24-hour support, very high bandwidth, or other special resources). They can vary greatly. It is almost like choosing a long distance telephone company. There are several long haul IP backbone networks. Some allow no third party traffic, while others exists to connect the various mid-level networks. Also some mid-level networks have additional connections between themselves besides the national backbones. After you choose a mid-level network, they can help with authorizations for the national backbones. -- Sean Donelan, Data Research Associates, Inc, St. Louis, MO Domain: sean@dranet.dra.com, Voice: (Work) +1 314-432-1100 Affiliation given for purposes of identification, not representation
dls@mentor.cc.purdue.edu (David L Stevens) (02/10/90)
You might check out Cypress. It's a low-cost long haul network developed here at Purdue with a gateway to the Internet. The person to contact for information is Scott Ballew (smb@cs.purdue.edu). -- +-DLS (dls@mentor.cc.purdue.edu)
kwe@buit13.bu.edu (Kent England) (02/14/90)
In article <9002062137.AA14927@cwh.cam.nist.gov> craig@CWH.CAM.NIST.GOV (Craig Hunt) writes: >One of our network users, who is doing extensive work with a commercial >firm, asked how that firm could have access to the Internet. Does >anyone know who is offering a service to connect commercial users into >Internet services. I suggested UUNET and CSNET. I also thought >perhaps Merit. Suggestions, contacts, addresses would all be >appreciated. While we are all getting our plugs in; I should point out that under many circumstances it is entirely appropriate for a commercial concern to connect to a so-called "mid-level" network. The choice of connecting a commercial or educational institution to the Internet via a commercial service provider or via a not-for-profit so-called "regional" or "mid-level" service provider depends on what services are being sought. In all cases, there are appropriate use guidelines to consider when sending traffic across a subsidized portion of the Internet, particularly the NSFnet backbone. Permission to use the NSFnet backbone comes from the NSF DNCRI headed by Steve Wolff. These considerations apply to traffic from commercial service providers as well as subsidized and unsubsidized "mid-level" networks. The reasons I can think of to use a commercial service provider versus your friendly neighborhood mid-level is: a) you have some traffic that does not fit your mid-level network's appropriate use guidelines and a commercial concern offers you a way to move that traffic to where it needs to go. Some not-for-profit mid-level networks allow any kind of traffic within their networks. NYSERnet is the first, to my knowledge, to announce unrestricted use of NYSERnet by members. I predict there will be others. However, there are no non-subsidized paths among the mid-level networks today. b) you think that the commercial service provider offers better service according to some metric than your mid-level network for access to the Internet. If what you really want is access to the Internet and not some private or commercial internet, then a commercial service provider is equivalent to a mid-level service provider (for moving datagrams) since you are bound by the appropriate use guidelines in either case. Just because you get your connection from a profit making outfit does not entitle you to pass any traffic you wish across the NSFnet backbone, BITnet, or any mid-level network you please. So, you choose service according to the criterion of who does the best job connecting you to the Internet and who offers you the mix of services you want and are willing to pay for. I hope this makes the relationship of the mid-level networks to the commercial service providers a little clearer. I should note that Uunet is not-for-profit, so perhaps we should refer to subsidized and unsubsidized service providers, rather than the commercial versus non-commercial labels. Or perhaps we should talk about national versus "quasi-regional"? Nah. Competitive versus uncompetitive? Maybe. :-) Now for my equal time plug; anyone who is interested in a connection in the Northeast neighborhood should contact John Rugo, the business manager for NEARnet, the New England Academic and Research Network. NEARnet is a not-for-profit network service provider. jrugo@nic.near.net (617) 873-2935 John can tell you exactly what you get and how much it costs and he can give it to you in writing. I understand there may be other not-for-profit or even commercial service providers thinking about the New England area. Lots of choice for you. Perhaps that is the meaning of "commercialization" of the Internet. Choice for the users who pay the bills. Sounds good to me. Kent England, one of the Boston University NEARnet reps
steve@cise.nsf.gov (Stephen Wolff) (02/16/90)
> Perhaps that is the meaning of "commercialization" of the Internet. > Choice for the users who pay the bills. Sounds good to me. Yeah; that's what I mean. Sounds good to me, too. -s