wim@ecn.UUCP (Wim Rijnsburger) (12/20/88)
Hello, We are developping a NeWS class to build tools to display and manipulate structured information (text-documents, graphic's, etc) in an uniform way. At the moment we use SUN workstations, but we want to use these tools on HP workstations in the future. Does anyone know if NeWS is available on HP and how we can get it? Thanks in advance, Wim. --------------------------------------------------------------------- Wim Rijnsburger e-mail: mcvax!ecn!wim Netherlands Energy Research Foundation, ECN ecn!wim@mcvax.cwi.nl P.O. Box 1, 1755 ZG Petten(NH), Holland phone : +31 2246 4336
mlandau@bbn.com (Matt Landau) (12/20/88)
In comp.windows.news (<8812191027.AA19821@ecn.uucp>), wim@ecn.UUCP (Wim Rijnsburger) writes: >At the moment we use SUN workstations, but we want to use [NeWS] >on HP workstations in the future. Does anyone know if NeWS is available >on HP and how we can get it? I've not heard of anyone porting NeWS to HP's, but this does bring up the larger question of "How can the interested NeWS-using community get NeWS on non-Sun hardware?" Basically, there seem to be 3 possibilities: (1) Sun ports and sells NeWS for other machines. This doesn't seem very likely, for lots of reasons. (2) Independent companies port NeWS to other hardware. There are a couple of examples of this already, including NeWS for the Parallax display hardware, NeWS for the Mac II, and NeWS for OS/2, but it's not clear that such companies will ever be able to supplant vendor-supplied window systems on other machines. (3) Other vendors license and provide NeWS technology, probably via their own supported, optimized ports of the merged server (whenever it becomes available). The third of these is clearly the most desirable from the user community's point of view -- only when vendors start shipping and supporting NeWS technology will it ever have a chance of becoming universal. Unfortunately, the politics of the workstation, OS, and window system worlds seems to make it unlikely that competing vendors will license and distribute NeWS or the merge on their own. Economic incentives, however, might help to convince them :-) What this suggests to me is that if you're in the position of buying and using workstations, and you also want (or need) to use NeWS, *make sure your vendor knows it*. There was a certain initial resistance on the part of some vendors to adopting NFS, but when customers started to demand it [you know, like telling your local salesman "We're not interested in purchasing any more of your machines until they support NFS"], things started to happen. Now you can take almost any collection of bizarre machines, from PC's to IBM mainframes, plug them all in on the same network, and have them share files relatively well. Unfortunately, I tend to think it's going to take similar pressure to make NeWS window system technology as widespread as NFS is now. So the general answer to "How can we get NeWS on hardware X?" is DEMAND IT!
bob@dinosaur.cis.ohio-state.edu (Bob Sutterfield) (12/20/88)
In article <12404@jade.BBN.COM> mlandau@bbn.com (Matt Landau) writes: >In comp.windows.news (<8812191027.AA19821@ecn.uucp>), wim@ecn.UUCP (Wim Rijnsburger) writes: >>At the moment we use SUN workstations, but we want to use [NeWS] on >>HP workstations in the future. Does anyone know if NeWS is available >>on HP and how we can get it? > >I've not heard of anyone porting NeWS to HP's, Chris Maio of Columbia is reported to have done it. Since I don't deal much with our HPs, I don't know the exact terms, but it probably requires at least a Sun NeWS source license. >...but this does bring up the larger question of "How can the >interested NeWS-using community get NeWS on non-Sun hardware?" > >Basically, there seem to be 3 possibilities: > > (1) Sun ports and sells NeWS for other machines. This doesn't > seem very likely, for lots of reasons. Sun Consulting seems willing to do almost anything for enough money. > (2) Independent companies port NeWS to other hardware... it's not > clear that such companies will ever be able to supplant > vendor-supplied window systems on other machines. Not in the huge market of people who buy a machine as an appliance. But in the niche market of places where workstations are already in use, and someone wants to buy personal computers or other sorts of workstations and integrate them with the rest of the environment, "real" window systems like X and NeWS and... are a fundamental component of the effort. There's enough of a market there to support a few bright folks willing to hustle, and that's who's doing it right now. >...make NeWS window system technology as widespread as NFS is now. >So the general answer to "How can we get NeWS on hardware X?" is >DEMAND IT! I don't know whether the rest of the industry is going to (from their point of view) roll over and let Sun dictate yet another standard way of doing business and create a new way to compete, like they did with commodity UNIX workstations and NFS. That's why everyone jumped on the X bandwagon in response to Sun's NeWS announcement: to try and keep Sun from defining their market for them again. The big boys know that NeWS is technically superior in a lot of ways, and that the only way to battle it is with "market popularity". Momentum is mass times velocity. What they lack in velocity, they're trying to make up in mass. Don't look for DEC to support NeWS any time soon.
mlandau@bbn.com (Matt Landau) (12/20/88)
In comp.windows.news, Bob Sutterfield writes: >I don't know whether the rest of the industry is going to (from their >point of view) roll over and let Sun dictate yet another standard ... > >The big boys know that NeWS is technically superior in a lot of ways, >and that the only way to battle it is with "market popularity". > .... Don't look for DEC to support NeWS any >time soon. This is exactly my point -- don't look for DEC to support NeWS any time soon *voluntarily*. But if enough of the potential customer base were to demand it, and to back up that demand by not buying any more DEC workstations until DEC supplied a NeWS server, that customer base might be able to make things happen. Of course, I have no idea whether there are enough DEC customers willing and able to make such a demand, and to back it up with action, but every little bit helps, and if people want to see NeWS propogated to other machines, they're going to have to start using their economic influence to make it happen, as they did with NFS. -- Matt Landau "Don't make me angry. mlandau@bbn.com You wouldn't like me when I'm angry."
messino@SUN.COM (Steven Messino) (02/17/89)
Please contact Chris Maio 212 584 2736 for HP port. Steven Messino Window Technology Marketing Sun Micro Systems 415 336 2017