gs732%uxe.cso.uiuc.edu@uxc.cso.uiuc.edu (Ghie-Hugh Song ) (03/29/88)
From: gs732%uxe.cso.uiuc.edu@uxc.cso.uiuc.edu (Ghie-Hugh Song )
Hello, everyone,
Have you ever dreamed that TeX were more WYSWYG or that you could type
Greek characters in the text mode directly? If we had an extended
256 8-bit ASCII character set such as IBM PC's. (See Appendix of
PC DOS Manual), things would be much easier.
Then why not use WordPerfect or MS Word? First, all the Greek
characters and the math symbols are not supported by them, unless we
buy extra software and hardware. In IBM's extended ASCII, there is
no 'Greek tau', 'Greek nu', or inverted Greek capital delta symbol
for partial differential equations. Even the registered trade mark
sign 'R in a circle' does not exist. Then you might ask why not ChiWriter
or T-cube? Simply they are not portable! They are graphics programs.
They are not public-domain. One of them is really expensive.
So TeX has been thought to be a better choice for technical writers. But
it's not because it is easy to use but because the text is portable
and sometimes it is more versatile than other PC word processors. In fact,
without a laser printer or VorTeX and a graphics workstation, TeX is
not so useful as PC word processors. So something should be 1) ASCII
text files for portability and 2) easy to use. Then how about having
Greek characters and math symbols in the ASCII character set itself?
I've got an idea for all of us. And I wish to write a letter to
the ANSI people about a new 256 8-bit extended ASCII character standard.
But I don't know the ANSI's address. So if you agree with my idea,
please forward this message to ANSI with your opinion.
Let's have the Ext-key in our keyboard at the same location as the
'Alt' key in IBM's Enhanced keyboard. (I am using the term 'Ext' to
distinguish it from GNU-Emacs' meta-editing keys. However, the real name
of the latter half of this extended ASCII set should be
'meta', since they call it in that way in the termcap files.)
Ext-p (F0-hexdec) will give us a printable character Greek-pi,
and Ext-shift-p (D0-hexdec) will give us a printable character
Greek-Pi (captial-pi) directly. IBM's Greek-pi is in E3 in
hexadecimal which matches 'c' (63-Hexdec) among
128 7-bit ASCII codes. So every word processor is different in its way of
producing pi. It lowers the portability of word-processed texts.
At the end of this posting, I propose my draft. Please see and
examine it.
One may oppose this draft because the existing printers might not be used.
We can use those with a mere printer driver software with a translater
software as long as we do not type in the original text any one of the fonts
not supported by the printer.
I understand that the standardization of 8-bit extended ASCII
is too late. However I know that once this is implemented on
the new version of UNIX or POSIX, everyone will follow
this slowly. Now people are gathering to standardize UNIX, POSIX, SVID,
or whatever. Now is the time to express our opinion to ANSI people.
If we lose this chance we will never have a standard 8-bit ASCII.
If you agree with my idea, write a letter to ANSI, POSIX committee
(IEEE CS/P1003), and the acting System V.4 committee members of
AT&T-Sun-Unisys(?) immediately for their
prompt action. Unfortunately, I do not know any of those addresses.
I really do not know whether this effort is made first by me.
Nor do I know whether there exists such extended ASCII made by ANSI.
Since no text-mode terminal has inherent math fonts, I think there is no
such standard so far.
More than one half of college graduates in the world are either
engineers, scientist, or medical doctors. They need English with Greek
characters and math fonts to write reports, homeworks, papers. The need
sometimes exceeds that of their own language support. They need
a knowledge bank that can save some great idea like
E = h-bar.omega : Einstein's photoelectric effect,
E = mc^2 : Einstein's relativistic energy
without backslashes or $'s, and yet portable.
Thank you for your attention.
G. Hugh Song
Coordinated Science Lab.
Univ. of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
1101 W. Springfield Av.
Urbana, IL 61801
song@uispg.csl.uiuc.edu
============================================================
Here is my draft of 256 new 8-bit ASCII character set. I place the
second half of 8-bit characters (128-255) next to the first half of them.
I am not decisive on what to assign to the following Ext-control keys (80-
hexdec to 9f-hexdec). There are two options:
1) We can assign new control keys which have become neccessary
as the computer science evolves. Some examples are shown below.
I wish that someone in the field rearrage the assignment and
complete this, since I do not have enough knowledge and current
implementation status of i/o utilization.
2) Or we may give some freedom to the manufacturers of keyboard
and terminals.
Even though these (00-hexdec to 1f-hexdec and 80-hexdec to 9f-hexdec)
are not legitimately printable while editing a text file, I wish there are
corresponding printable characters such as graphical framing characters
as in IBM PC or a triangle directing left for ^H, not just as the current
'^' which does not distinguish itself from 5e-hexdec. It will ease
debugging communication problems.
| 00 ^@ nul 80 sml decreases character size and increases back
01 ^a soh 81
02 ^b stx 82 bld boldifies and unboldifies (toggle)
03 ^c etx 83
04 ^d eot 84 dwn steps down one half line spacing
05 ^e enq 85
06 ^f ack 86
07 ^g bel 87 grp enters and exits graphics mode
| 08 ^h bs 88 hlp invokes help universally.
09 ^i ht 89 itl italicize and deitalicize from now
0a ^j nl 8a
0b ^k vt 8b mlm mouse left movement \
0c ^l np 8c mlb mouse left button |
0d ^m cr 8d mmb mouse middle button |
0e ^n so 8e mdm mouse downward movement | Important!
0f ^o si 8f | no matter what these are
| 10 ^p dle 90 mum mouse upward movement | meta-control keys or
11 ^q dc1 91 mrm mouse right movement | escape sequences.
12 ^r dc2 92 mrb mouse right button /
13 ^s dc3 93 scr sripticizes or unscripticizes (toggle)
14 ^t dc4 94
15 ^u nak 95 up steps up one half line spacing
16 ^v syn 96 rev reverses or reverses back characters's black and white
17 ^w etb 97
| 18 ^x can 98
19 ^y em 99
1a ^z sub 9a
1b ^[ esc 9b atn escapes during communication calling attention of
the local control
1c ^\ fs 9c
1d ^] gs 9d
1e ^^ rs 9e
1f ^_ us 9f
Now in the following we have printable characters except the 'DEL'
key at the end of the lower 7-bit codes. The alt key may be used to send
the 8-bit code to the host computer
by simulating this key with kermit's 'set key' program such as in
MSFERMIT version 2.30.
For the 7-bit terminal environment, in which 8-bit signals are not
generated or received by the terminal,
such as VT100, it is desirable for the C-shell or the editor to have a key
which tells the host computer that the next key is one of the upper
8-bit codes (128-255). This key should not contradict with a control key
of the existing editor programs. The 'esc' key might be thought the best
choice. However, most editor programs use this key heavily for some other
purposes. To avoid conflict, the 'cr (Cntrl-m)' key, which is redundant
both in vi and in gnuemacs (You might have noticed notice that 'C-m' is
changed to 'nl (C-j)' automatically by both editors), may be used.
This will limit the use of the Meta key in our (or Stallman's) GNU-Emacs.
This actually means no revision in GNU-Emacs. We just use the ESC key
to invoke the Meta editing keys, although the keyboard has the Meta key.
This is the price we pay
for those Greek characters and the math symbols. If we use the 'Cntrl-h' for
the real backspace, we have to choose another key for
invoking 'help' in GNU-Emacs. How about the 'Ext-Cntrl-h' ('88-hexdec')
(or 'C-m C-h' on the 7-bit terminal) as a key for invoking help
in the future version (Ver. 19) of GNU-Emacs. This is the only change
which is not compatible to the present version (Ver.18).
I'd like to suggest that the 'Ext-Cntrl-h (88-hexdec)' or 'Cntrl-m Cntrl-
h' on the 7-bit terminal be a new standard key invoking help in e
very software package in the future. Isn't it a good idea?
| 20 sp a0 a horizontal bar longer than just '-'.
21 ! a1 a black square
22 " a2 the starting double quotation mark
23 # a3 \neq : not-equal sign '/=' in one character site
24 $ a4 the Pound symbol (U.K. money unit)
25 % a5 \div : the division symbol, ':-' in one character site
26 & a6 \cap : the common set in set theory, The inverted 'U'.
27 ' a7 the starting single quatation mark
| 28 ( a8 the top portion of the left parenthesis
29 ) a9 the top portion of the left parenthesis
2a * aa a small circle at the ' level that usually represents degree
2b + ab \pm : '+-' in one character site with + up and - down.
2c , ac the cedilla symbol without c, s, or C.
2d - ad \mp : '-+' in one character site with - up and + down.
2e . ae \cdot : a dot at the center
2f / af $\dot $ : a dot at the top
| 30 0 b0 the bottom portion of the right parenthesis
31 1 b1 \propto : the proportionality symbol, 'oc' in one character site
32 2 b2 \bigcirc : a big circle.
33 3 b3 \prime \prime \prime : tripple-prime
34 4 b4 a vertical line with a wart in the middle as in '{'
35 5 b5 a vertical line with a wart in the middle as in '}'
36 6 b6 \partial : the mirror image of '6'
37 7 b7 \cup : the symbol in the set theory, that looks like 'U'
| 38 8 b8 \infty : the infinity symbol, 'oo' in one character site
39 9 b9 the bottom portion of the left parenthesis
3a : ba $\ddot $ : the umlaut, two dots overhead.
3b ; bb \prime \prime : the double-prime
3c < bc \le : '_<' in one character site
3d = bd \equiv : '=_' in one character site for the defining equality
3e > be \ge : '_>' in one character site
3f ? bf \supset : superset symbol
| 40 @ c0 the registered trademark sign, a small capital R in a circle
41 A c1 angstrom, a small circle on top of 'A'
42 B c2 \rightarrow : an arrow heading east
43 C c3 \copyright : a small capital 'C' in a circle
44 D c4 \Delta
45 E c5 \in : 'an element of' symbol in set theory
46 F c6 \Phi
47 G c7 \Gamma
| 48 H c8 \hbar : accented italic h for the Planck constant
49 I c9 the top portion of the integral symbol
4a J ca the bottom portion of the integral symbol
4b K cb \simeq :a set symbol (obtained from U by rotating it 90 deg CW)
4c L cc \Lambda
4d M cd \subset: symbol in the set theory
4e N ce \nabla : inverted Greek-capital-Delta
4f O cf \Omega
| 50 P d0 \Pi
51 Q d1 \Theta
52 R d2 \surd : also makes a \sqrt if combined with underlines (__)
53 S d3 \Sigma
54 T d4 the trade mark sign, the superscripted 'TM'
55 U d5 \Upsilon
56 V d6 \leftarrow : an arrow heading west
57 W d7 \ddag : the double dagger symbol used for a footnote.
| 58 X d8 \Xi
59 Y d9 \Psi
5a Z da \downarrow : an arrow heading south.
5b [ db \lceil : a vertical line whose top is clamped to the right
5c \ dc \times : 'x' without serif, math symbol for a multiplication
5d ] dd \rceil : a vertical line whose top is clamped to the left
5e ^ de $\check $ : an accent symbol inverted from '^'
5f _ df $\overline $ : a long bar on top.
| 60 ` e0 \prime (60-hexdec is a back-prime)
61 a e1 \alpha
62 b e2 \beta
63 c e3 \chi
64 d e4 \delta
65 e e5 \epsilon
66 f e6 \phi
67 g e7 \gamma
| 68 h e8 \eta
69 i e9 \iota
6a j ea \smallint : the integral symbol, enlongated s
6b k eb \kappa
6c l ec \lambda
6d m ed \mu
6e n ee \nu
6f o ef \omega
| 70 p f0 \pi
71 q f1 \theta
72 r f2 \rho
73 s f3 \sigma
74 t f4 \tau
75 u f5 a wiggle positioned at the underline(_) level.
76 v f6 \vec the short arrow symbol that represents a vector
77 w f7 $\dagger $ : the dagger symbol used for a Hermitian conjugate
| 78 x f8 \xi
79 y f9 \psi
7a z fa \zeta
7b { fb \lfloor : a vertical line whose bottom is clamped to the right
7c | fc \| : two vertical lines in one character site
7d } fd \rfloor : a vertical line whose bottom is clamped to the left
7e ~ fe \sim : a wiggle positioned at the center level
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
7f del ff erh erase the character at the current cursor position
-------------------------------------------------------------
These all can be reside in the text mode in 8-bit mode so that any text
mode terminal can display them directly on the text mode screen.
The possible benefit of this extension is:
1. If every typesetting program is revised according to the new standard,
they will become more WYSWYG. It means we do not need to type the '\alpha'
while typing a TeX file.
2. The wordprocessor and the typesetting programs will be cheaper since they
do not need to include soft-font files or the hard font ROM.
3. The word processor files can easily be exported and imported from one
word processor file to another without losing special characters as
long as they reside in 256 character set.
In addition to this new extended ASCII, I think that some of the
present ASCII characters should be redesigned from the present
ones as follows:
" 22 should be designed to look more like the closing double
quotation mark as in typeset books.
' 27 the closing single quotation mark or apostrophe
same comment as above (" 22-hexdec)
* 2a position this a little higher than the present height
so that it looks like a footnoting symbol, not like a multiplication
symbol.
/ 2f stretch this so that two of these can be connected without breaking
to make a long slanted line.
\ 5c the same comment as above
_ 5f the same comment as above so that it should be \underbar{ }
| 7c make this a single long vertical line rather than the present
one broken at the middle.
The current ANSI standard for erasing the previous character is DEL,
not backspace! Let us encourage everyone to observe this standard.
I know that the troublemaker IBM does not follow this standard.
Let them go their way. We do not care for IBM. We are talking about UNIX
and GNU-Emacs and TeX. Then backspace will do the following job in
GNU-Emacs and vi.
^h 08 bs a backspace key without erasing the previously typed
character, making an overprinted image when printed. I think this
special function of this key is actually in the present
ANSI standard. You might have noticed that the UNIX 'man'ual
pages contain '^H' in their text files for underlining.
It seems now fully supported by most ANSI terminals. (But not on
IBM's) Nevertheless, it is not supported by vi or GNU-Emacs.
Let's encourage Mr.Stallman to support this in his new
version of GNU-Emacs. It will display every accented
vowel for foreign alphabets, the
cent (money unit), some foreign money units, the C-cedilla
('Ext-,-backspace-c'), and the null set symbol ('0/' in one
character site.
To edit this backspace we need a special character for
this. A hollow triangle dirrected to the left is good
enough. Also (Emacs maybe not on vi) will have mode to view
this while editing.
^m 0d met In due consideration, the mnemonic should be changed from
'cr' to 'met'a.
==========================================
KEYBORAD
-----------------
This part is not part of my proposal. I just wish that the new ANSI
ASCII keyboard has the following keys. One may assign some
function keys for the following purposes. But it goes
without saying that separate keys at the space bar level are more desirable.
For text/graphics terminals
Italic key : italicizes the normal character. this key should be active
only on the alpabetic characters, Greek capital characters,
but not on numeric characters, symbols like '%', '+', '"',etc.
On a black-and-white text-mode-only terminal which does not have
ROM to support various fonts (such as VT100),
it would be desirable if this key reverses white and black
of those characters between the two italic keys.
Black becomes white, white becomes black. (Toggle)
Bold key : boldens or highlights a character. (Toggle)
For graphics terminals
Step-up key : moves the position 1/2-line higher. and then step down key
to go back to the original line height.
Step-down key : moves the position 1/2-line lower. and then step-up key
to go back.
Script key : displays the scripted characters. (Toggle)
Small character key : displays small characters from now and restores the
size back. (Toggle)
As to the Keyboard Layout,
We do not need to have the editing keypad on the right.
Why don't we move it to the left leaving more space for the mouse?
=====================================End of draft=======
P.S. At first, I did not intend to do this as a project. However
it turned out to be a big project. Now I want to drop
this project and let this free to the public by posting at
the news system here. I hope everybody to express their
opinion and fruitful discussion here. And fianlly I hope to see ANSI
or POSIX committee act.
Please start this project and act, ANSI.
Volume-Number: Volume 13, Number 39guy@Sun.COM (Guy Harris) (04/05/88)
From: guy@Sun.COM (Guy Harris) > I understand that the standardization of 8-bit extended ASCII > is too late. You're probably right. There is already a family of ISO extended character sets, the ISO 8859 family, that are extensions of ASCII and are being adopted by many UNIX systems. The ISO 8859/1 character set, also known as "ISO Latin Alphabet #1", has been adopted or will be adopted by a number of vendors for Western European use; AT&T has adopted t, Sun plans to do so, I believe Apollo has done so, DEC's international character set is similar to it and they may have adopted it, and I think X/Open has already specified it. Volume-Number: Volume 13, Number 42
std-unix@longway.TIC.COM (Moderator, John S. Quarterman) (04/05/88)
From: uunet!harvard.harvard.edu!haddock!karl (Karl Heuer) In article <10317@uunet.UU.NET> gs732%uxe.cso.uiuc.edu@uxc.cso.uiuc.edu (Ghie-Hugh Song ) writes: >Have you ever dreamed that TeX were more WYSWYG or that you could type >Greek characters in the text mode directly? If we had an extended >256 8-bit ASCII character set such as IBM PC's. (See Appendix of >PC DOS Manual), things would be much easier. Well, actually I've wished for a *lot* of non-ASCII characters at various times. More than you can fit in the 128 available slots. But most of them are so seldom used that I don't mind that they don't have reserved 8-bit values. >For the 7-bit terminal environment, in which 8-bit signals are not generated >or received by the terminal, such as VT100, it is desirable for the C-shell >or the editor to have a key which tells the host computer that the next key >is one of the upper 8-bit codes (128-255). This key should not contradict >with a control key of the existing editor programs. There is no such key. (Yes, Emacs *does* distinguish between C-m and C-j. Besides, on most keyboards the big key labeled RETURN or ENTER generates C-m, so if you preempt that for a pseudo-meta, you'd have to use an explicit C-j (awkward to type) to get a newline.) Not that it matters -- such editors normally run in raw mode anyway, so they'd be bypassing the new feature. >In addition to this new extended ASCII, I think that some of the present >ASCII characters should be redesigned from the present ones as follows: >[suggests, among other changes, that /\_| should be stretched to fit the >character cell] If you want line-drawing characters, add a line-drawing font. Don't try to make the ASCII set do double duty. >... You might have noticed that the UNIX 'man'ual pages contain '^H' in their >text files for underlining. It seems now fully supported by most ANSI >terminals. Oh? Underlining with backspace is not unheard of, but I think the escape sequence \e[4m is more common, especially among "ANSI terminals". Perhaps you're confused by software that does this conversion for you (e.g. "more")? And certainly very few terminals (hardcopy excepted) will display general overstrikes like a cent sign. Volume-Number: Volume 13, Number 41
linhart@topaz.rutgers.edu (Mike Threepoint) (04/07/88)
From: linhart@topaz.rutgers.edu (Mike Threepoint) Bo Thide (irf@kuling) recently described it [ISO 8859/1 -mod] as 191 characters cleverly designed with capitals coded as shifted miniscules, including eth (which I'm not sure what it is), thorn, and sharp S. To possibly add to the list, this sounds like the character set Microsoft Windows uses and terms (by no standard I know of) "ANSI". It has the vowels in acute, grave, circumflex, tilde, and umlaut. The high bit characters also include cent, pound, yen, and universal currency symbols, circle-R trademark and circle-C copyright symbols, inverted ? and !, section and paragraph symbols, << guillemets >>, several accents, 1/4, 1/2, and 3/4 characters, and superscripted 1, 2, and 3. The last sound like a bad idea to me, so I actually hope this is something they threw together themselves. Sound like ISO 8859? If not, I would be quite interested to know just what it is. How much do I send to where (if you can't just mail me a copy)? What I would also like to see is the ASCII 0..1F (31 dec.) graphic representations on new machines conform to the ANSI standard. They might look impractical, but after setting up a font using them on my micro, it's amazing how much sense they make to me. -- "Science does not remove the terror of the gods." | Mike Threepoint -- J.R. "Bob" Dobbs | linhart@topaz.rutgers.edu "One man's theology is another man's belly laugh." | FidoNet 1:107/513 -- Lazarus Long | AT&T (201)878-0937 Volume-Number: Volume 13, Number 48
rja@edison.GE.COM (rja) (04/07/88)
From: rja@edison.GE.COM (rja) I'd thought someone else would have pointed this out, but nothing has shown up at edison to correct the misconception. THERE IS AN 8-bit STANDARD, ISO 8859/1. It also has other variants (8859/2, etc.) which support other languages. The 8859/1 version supports nearly ALL languages in use in Western Europe. It is a proper superset of ASCII. [ Actually, Guy Harris already pointed this out. But your following observation is quite useful. -mod ] For more details, please tune into the ongoing discussions in comp.std.internat, where several people have voiced concerns over languages NOT supported. Nevertheless, since it is being adopted as an X/OPEN standard and big companies like AT&T are adopting it, expect it to take hold. Volume-Number: Volume 13, Number 47
guy@Sun.COM (Guy Harris) (04/08/88)
From: guy@Sun.COM (Guy Harris) > To possibly add to the list, this sounds like the character set > Microsoft Windows uses and terms (by no standard I know of) "ANSI". > It has the vowels in acute, grave, circumflex, tilde, and umlaut. > The high bit characters also include cent, pound, yen, and universal > currency symbols, circle-R trademark and circle-C copyright symbols, > inverted ? and !, section and paragraph symbols, << guillemets >>, > several accents, 1/4, 1/2, and 3/4 characters, and superscripted 1, 2, > and 3. The last sound like a bad idea to me, so I actually hope this > is something they threw together themselves. > Sound like ISO 8859? Yes. The superscripted letters *do* come from ISO 8859 (see below). > What I would also like to see is the ASCII 0..1F (31 dec.) graphic > representations on new machines conform to the ANSI standard. They > might look impractical, but after setting up a font using them on my > micro, it's amazing how much sense they make to me. What "graphic representations" are you referring to? The only ANSI standard I know of for characters in the range 0x00 to 0x1f is ASCII, which says they're *control* characters, not *printable* characters. For your collective amusement, here is a chart of ISO 8859/1 or "ISO Latin Alphabet #1". This was derived by some quick hacking on the X11 include file "keysymdef.h" - yes, X11 uses the ISO character sets as well. non-breaking space 0xa0 inverted exclamation point 0xa1 cent sign 0xa2 pounds sterling 0xa3 "currency symbol" 0xa4 yen 0xa5 broken bar 0xa6 section mark 0xa7 diaeresis 0xa8 copyright 0xa9 feminine ordinal 0xaa (this is a subscripted lower-case "a", underlined) left guillemot 0xab (French left quote, looks like small "<<") not sign 0xac hyphen 0xad registered trademark 0xae macron 0xaf (an elevated small horizontal bar) degree symbol 0xb0 plus/minus 0xb1 superscript 2 0xb2 superscript 3 0xb3 acute accent 0xb4 mu 0xb5 paragraph symbol 0xb6 small centered dot 0xb7 cedilla 0xb8 superscript 1 0xb9 masculine ordinal 0xba (this is a subscripted lower-case "o", underlined) right guillemot 0xbb (French right quote, looks like small ">>") 1/4 0xbc 1/2 0xbd 3/4 0xbe inverted question mark 0xbf A with grave accent 0xc0 A with acute accent 0xc1 A with circumflex accent 0xc2 A with tilde 0xc3 A with diaeresis 0xc4 A with ring 0xc5 (as in "Angstrom") AE dipthong 0xc6 C with cedilla 0xc7 E with grave accent 0xc8 E with acute accent 0xc9 E with circumflex accent 0xca E with diaeresis 0xcb I with grave accent 0xcc I with acute accent 0xcd I with circumflex accent 0xce I with diaeresis 0xcf upper-case eth 0xd0 (eth is an Icelandic letter) N with tilde 0xd1 O with grave accent 0xd2 O with acute accent 0xd3 O with circumflex accent 0xd4 O with tilde 0xd5 O with diaeresis 0xd6 multiply sign 0xd7 O with slash 0xd8 U with grave accent 0xd9 U with acute accent 0xda U with circumflex accent 0xdb U with diaeresis 0xdc Y with acute accent 0xdd upper-case thorn 0xde (thorn is an Icelandic letter) German double-s 0xdf a with grave accent 0xe0 a with acute accent 0xe1 a with circumflex accent 0xe2 a with tilde 0xe3 a with diaeresis 0xe4 a with ring 0xe5 (lower-case "A with ring") ae dipthong 0xe6 c with cedilla 0xe7 e with grave accent 0xe8 e with acute accent 0xe9 e with circumflex accent 0xea e with diaeresis 0xeb i with grave accent 0xec i with acute accent 0xed i with circumflex accent 0xee i with diaeresis 0xef lower-case eth 0xf0 n with tilde 0xf1 o with grave accent 0xf2 o with acute accent 0xf3 o with circumflex accent 0xf4 o with tilde 0xf5 o with diaeresis 0xf6 division sign 0xf7 o with slash 0xf8 u with grave accent 0xf9 u with acute accent 0xfa u with circumflex accent 0xfb u with diaeresis 0xfc y with acute accent 0xfd lower-case thorn 0xfe y with diaeresis 0xff Volume-Number: Volume 13, Number 49
std-unix@longway.TIC.COM (Moderator, John S. Quarterman) (04/09/88)
From: uunet!rutgers.edu!mtune!homxb!hrs (H.SILBIGER) In article <161@longway.TIC.COM>, guy@Sun.COM (Guy Harris) writes: > From: guy@Sun.COM (Guy Harris) > > > currency symbols, circle-R trademark and circle-C copyright symbols, > > inverted ? and !, section and paragraph symbols, << guillemets >>, > > and 3. The last sound like a bad idea to me, so I actually hope this > > Sound like ISO 8859? > > Yes. The superscripted letters *do* come from ISO 8859 (see below). > > There is another ISO standard that handles all latin alphabets, known as ISO6937. There is a CCITT equivalent. This character set is characteristically used in text communication applications, such as document architecture, teletex, message handling, etc. ISO 8859 is used mainly in the computer processing environment. [ Because ISO 6937 buys extreme flexibility by composing characters as two-byte combinations of basic character and accent, while ISO 8859 encodes every character as one byte. I saw this on comp.std.internat, which I recommend everybody interested in this discussion should read. -mod ] Herman Silbiger batavier!hrs@ATT.COM Volume-Number: Volume 13, Number 50
peter@sugar.UUCP (Peter da Silva) (04/14/88)
From: peter@sugar.UUCP (Peter da Silva) > From: guy@Sun.COM (Guy Harris) > The ISO 8859/1 character set, also known as "ISO Latin > Alphabet #1", has been adopted or will be adopted by a number of vendors for > Western European use; AT&T ... Sun ... Apollo ... DEC ... Add the Commodore Amiga and (I think) the Atari ST to the list... -- -- Peter da Silva `-_-' ...!hoptoad!academ!uhnix1!sugar!peter -- "Have you hugged your U wolf today?" ...!bellcore!tness1!sugar!peter -- Disclaimer: These aren't mere opinions, these are *values*. Volume-Number: Volume 13, Number 51
std-unix@longway.TIC.COM (Moderator, John S. Quarterman) (04/15/88)
From: uunet!topaz.rutgers.edu!linhart (Mike Threepoint) u <- guy@Sun.COM (Guy Harris) When we last left our conversation: [description of MS Windows "ANSI" character set] me> Sound like ISO 8859? u> Yes. The superscripted letters *do* come from ISO 8859 (see below). Thanks to your table, I can confirm that they match. Multiply and divide symbols are missing, replaced by the ubiquitous empty box, but now my EGA font is complete (for my IBM compatible, made with CHET, I could post it to binaries if anyone really wanted it). me> What I would also like to see is the ASCII 0..1F (31 dec.) graphic me> representations on new machines conform to the ANSI standard. They me> might look impractical, but after setting up a font using them on my me> micro, it's amazing how much sense they make to me. u> What "graphic representations" are you referring to? The only ANSI standard u> I know of for characters in the range 0x00 to 0x1f is ASCII, which says u> they're *control* characters, not *printable* characters. The rather obscure ANSI X3.32-1973 "Graphic Representation of the Control Characters of ASCII" defines them for use when the name-in-tiny-letters isn't used. I found it in Joe Cambell's "C Programmers Guide to Serial Communications" (Howard W. Sams & Co.) [wish I had a copy of my own, had to reborrow it to get the ID] which contains an ASCII chart poster with those symbols on it. It goes something like this: (they're in that aforementioned font, too) ^@ NUL a hollow square, like the one used in Mac character sets for undefined characters ^A SOH the left column and top row of the cell set, like an inverted L ^B STX the bottom row and center column set, like a perpendicular symbol ^C ETX the right column and bottom row set, like a reversed L ^D EOT a single zig-zag, like a lightning bolt ^E ENQ a square with an X in it ^F ACK a check mark (tick mark to you Europeans) ^G BEL a hemisphere with two L shaped feet, I want to say "doodlebug", but it's probably more like an electronic component ^H BS an up arrow bent over leftwards into a U-shaped hook at the top ^I HT a right arrow with the barbs extended to the length of the shaft, more like a dart ^J LF three parallel horizontal lines ^K VT a downward pointing dart [Campbell says that instead of overloading LF with NewLine worsening the present incompatibilites, ANSI should have redefined this almost totally unused character] ^L FF a down dart with a second arrowhead midway down its shaft ^M CR a left dart ^N SO a circle with an X in it ^O SI a circle with a dot in the center ^P DLE a square with a horizontal line through the middle ^Q DC1 a circle with the top right quarter sectioned off, that is, lines from the center to the top and right ^R DC2 same, but lower right quarter ^S DC3 same, but lower left quarter ^T DC4 same, but top left quarter ^U NAK a check (tick) mark with a horizontal line thru the center ^V SYN a rectangle with the bottom cut in half and turned outward, like a bottomless rectangle with feet ^W ETB the right column and center row set, a T on its side ^X CAN a down pointing hollow triangle on an up pointing one, like an hourglass ^Y EM a vertical line with a fat dot in the middle ^Z SUB a backwards ? ^[ ESC a circle with a line through the center ^\ FS a square box with the top left quarter sectioned off ^] GS same, but bottom left ^^ RS same, but bottom right ^_ US same, but top right u> For your collective amusement, here is a chart of ISO 8859/1 or "ISO Latin u> Alphabet #1". This was derived by some quick hacking on the X11 include u> file "keysymdef.h" - yes, X11 uses the ISO character sets as well. [table deleted] Thanx, I appreciate it. I'm still interested in 8859-3 (which I read supports Esperanto), if it's not too much trouble could you tell me a) what _its_ layout is, or b) how much to send to where? -- "...billions and billions..." | Mike Threepoint (D-ro 3) -- not Carl Sagan | linhart@topaz.rutgers.edu "...hundreds if not thousands..." | FidoNet 1:107/513 -- Pnews | AT&T +1 (201)878-0937 Volume-Number: Volume 13, Number 52