phil@waikato.ac.nz (03/13/91)
The Department of Maths & Stats here wants to get a simple Pascal compiler for use in a lab of 24 Mac Pluses/SEs with an AppleShare file server. Mac Pascal from Symantec seems to be the most likely contender. I am interested to hear from any users about its suitability for our intended use, or of anything else that might be out there that is cheaper and/or better for similar cost. It will be used mainly be students doing introductory numerical analysis, so double precision arithmetic isn't essential. No programming with the Mac interface is expected, so students will need to be able to get hard copy of their source and TEXT output. Is this easy in Mac Pascal? -- Phil Etheridge (phil@waikato.ac.nz) Phax: +64 +71 381 155 Computer Services/Mathematics & Statistics Phone: +64 +71 568 299 x 8339 University of Waikato, Hamilton, NZ. I'd rather be MTBing
rxcjm@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au (John Mazzocchi) (03/14/91)
phil@waikato.ac.nz writes: >The Department of Maths & Stats here wants to get a simple Pascal compiler for >use in a lab of 24 Mac Pluses/SEs with an AppleShare file server. Mac Pascal >from Symantec seems to be the most likely contender. I am interested to hear >from any users about its suitability for our intended use, or of anything else >that might be out there that is cheaper and/or better for similar cost. >It will be used mainly be students doing introductory numerical analysis, so >double precision arithmetic isn't essential. No programming with the Mac >interface is expected, so students will need to be able to get hard copy of >their source and TEXT output. Is this easy in Mac Pascal? I know this doesn't answer your questions but I feel I should point out: Mac Pascal, i.e. Macintosh Pascal, is by Apple. If it's by Symantec, you're thinking of THINK Pascal. Macintosh Pascal is interpreted, THINK Pascal is compiled. -- + John Mazzocchi + "The mind is not a vessel to be filled, + + Melbourne, Victoria + but a fire to be lighted" - Plutarch + + Australia + + rxcjm@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au +
pfr654@csc.anu.edu.au (03/14/91)
In article <1991Mar14.014213.9313@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au>, rxcjm@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au (John Mazzocchi) writes: > phil@waikato.ac.nz writes: > >>The Department of Maths & Stats here wants to get a simple Pascal compiler for >>use in a lab of 24 Mac Pluses/SEs with an AppleShare file server. Mac Pascal >>from Symantec seems to be the most likely contender. I am interested to hear > > I know this doesn't answer your questions but I feel I should point out: > > Mac Pascal, i.e. Macintosh Pascal, is by Apple. > If it's by Symantec, you're thinking of THINK Pascal. You probably want Just Enough Pascal - if no Mac interface progrmming is required, I think that this prduct is the most like the original (Apple) Mac Pascal - i.e. to get to draw circles and lines you dont have to program in windowing stuff, the package does it for you - like QuickBasic. JEP is also from Symantec, and I beleive that they will allow you to upgrade to the complete THINK Pascal from JEP fairly cheaply. ************************************************************************* Phil Ryan * No matter where ANU Department of Physics and Theoretical Physics * you go... GPO Box 4, Canberra, Australia *... there you are. pfr654@csc.anu.edu.au * phone:06-249 4678 fax:06-249 0741 * Buckaroo Banzai *************************************************************************
jam652@csc.anu.edu.au (03/14/91)
In article <1991Mar13.143800.3108@waikato.ac.nz>, phil@waikato.ac.nz writes: > The Department of Maths & Stats here wants to get a simple Pascal compiler for > use in a lab of 24 Mac Pluses/SEs with an AppleShare file server. Mac Pascal > from Symantec seems to be the most likely contender. I am interested to hear > from any users about its suitability for our intended use, or of anything else > that might be out there that is cheaper and/or better for similar cost. > > It will be used mainly be students doing introductory numerical analysis, so > double precision arithmetic isn't essential. No programming with the Mac > interface is expected, so students will need to be able to get hard copy of > their source and TEXT output. Is this easy in Mac Pascal? > -- > Phil Etheridge (phil@waikato.ac.nz) Phax: +64 +71 381 155 > Computer Services/Mathematics & Statistics Phone: +64 +71 568 299 x 8339 > University of Waikato, Hamilton, NZ. I'd rather be MTBing Is is easy to get both printed copies of the pascal source code and the output from the program when using Macpascal, but not on the one print job though. There is an option (preference setting) in MacPascal which allows all screen output to be directed to a textfile on disk, or to the printer as well as the screen. Directing to printer is not a good choice as it ties up the printer for the duration of the execution of the program. The text file option is better as file can then be later reviewed and/or printed with any simple text editor or file printing utility. Note that Macpascal is an interpreted implementation of pascal. Contrary to some other postings , MacPascal (my version is 2.1, but there may be a later one) is no longer an Apple product, but is distributed by the Think distributors (Techflow in Australia). Think Pascal, also from Think Technologies (version 3 is current) is a full blown object oriented pascal compiler. Just Enough Pascal (also from Think technologies) is *NOT* a pascal language implementation (i.e. compiler or interpreter) but is a collection of learning aids and code to aid one in the self learning of the Pascal language and pascal programming on the macintosh. It assumes that you have the Think Pascal compiler available on your system. (JEP contains pascal code [units] that support grawing of graphics etc, so the learner can concentrate on the meat of the program and not have to worry about the tricky parts of graphics programming). Altogether there are 24 structured lessons/exercises/explanations in the Just Enough Pascal system. From my experiences with teaching undergraduate students (non computer science), Macpascal works ok and can be launched from a file server, but it is fairly slow, and has limited interactive debugging facilities compared to Think Pascal. Think Pascal supports a full debugger down to the level of components of records, tracing of program and uses Toolbox calls as documented in Inside MAc. Sure there is a bit more to learn to using it (about 20%) for ELEMENTARY pascal programming, but the benefits will pay for the effort in the longer term with increased performance & simpler debugging. Joe Miles Forestry Dept Aust National University Canberra ACT
bruce-b@cs.aukuni.ac.nz (Bruce P. Benson) (03/15/91)
In <1991Mar14.014213.9313@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au> rxcjm@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au (John Mazzocchi) writes: >phil@waikato.ac.nz writes: >>The Department of Maths & Stats here wants to get a simple Pascal compiler for [bits deleted] >I know this doesn't answer your questions but I feel I should point out: >Mac Pascal, i.e. Macintosh Pascal, is by Apple. >If it's by Symantec, you're thinking of THINK Pascal. The unopened shrink wrapped package on my desk (1 of 10) says SYMANTEC Macintosh Pascal. (We use it for one of our stage1 computing courses). It arrived a couple of days ago. Symantec took over development at about version 2 (I think). The current version is version 3. It is for academic use only. For those of you who know version 2, you also know version 3 except for a few less bugs and one or two minor features. >Macintosh Pascal is interpreted, THINK Pascal is compiled. Yup, that bit is true Bruce Benson. bruce-b@cs.aukuni.ac.nz Department of Computer Science University of Auckland.
b_robinson@tamar.compserv.utas.edu.au (03/15/91)
In article <1991Mar13.143800.3108@waikato.ac.nz>, phil@waikato.ac.nz writes: > The Department of Maths & Stats here wants to get a simple Pascal compiler for > use in a lab of 24 Mac Pluses/SEs with an AppleShare file server. Mac Pascal > from Symantec seems to be the most likely contender. I am interested to hear > from any users about its suitability for our intended use, or of anything else > that might be out there that is cheaper and/or better for similar cost. > > It will be used mainly be students doing introductory numerical analysis, so > double precision arithmetic isn't essential. No programming with the Mac > interface is expected, so students will need to be able to get hard copy of > their source and TEXT output. Is this easy in Mac Pascal? > -- > Phil Etheridge (phil@waikato.ac.nz) Phax: +64 +71 381 155 > Computer Services/Mathematics & Statistics Phone: +64 +71 568 299 x 8339 > University of Waikato, Hamilton, NZ. I'd rather be MTBing THINKS PASCAL from Symantec can have the current window printed by a simple device: select the window you want, then press <COMMAND><SHIFT>4. Source can be printed at any time through PRINT on the FILE menu. Barrie Robinson (b_robinson@tamar.compserv.utas.edu.au) School of Humanities University of Tasmania at Launceston Phone: +61 +03 260211
rxcjm@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au (John Mazzocchi) (03/15/91)
bruce-b@cs.aukuni.ac.nz (Bruce P. Benson) writes: >In <1991Mar14.014213.9313@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au> rxcjm@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au (John Mazzocchi) writes: >>phil@waikato.ac.nz writes: >>>The Department of Maths & Stats here wants to get a simple Pascal compiler for >[bits deleted] >>I know this doesn't answer your questions but I feel I should point out: >>Mac Pascal, i.e. Macintosh Pascal, is by Apple. >>If it's by Symantec, you're thinking of THINK Pascal. >The unopened shrink wrapped package on my desk (1 of 10) says SYMANTEC >Macintosh Pascal. (We use it for one of our stage1 computing courses). >It arrived a couple of days ago. Symantec took over development at >about version 2 (I think). The current version is version 3. It is for >academic use only. >For those of you who know version 2, you also know version 3 except >for a few less bugs and one or two minor features. My apologies, my knowledge was based on the version of Macintosh Pascal *I* bought (Version 1.0) some years ago. I was not aware of Symantec taking over development as I never upgraded to 2.0. (I bought Mac C instead.) -- + John Mazzocchi + "The mind is not a vessel to be filled, + + Melbourne, Victoria + but a fire to be lighted" - Plutarch + + Australia + + rxcjm@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au +
North_TJ@cc.curtin.edu.au (Tim North) (03/15/91)
> I know this doesn't answer your questions but I feel I should point out: > > Mac Pascal, i.e. Macintosh Pascal, is by Apple. > If it's by Symantec, you're thinking of THINK Pascal. > BUZZZ. Nope. Macintosh Pascal version *3* is by Symantec. Cheers, ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ --------- | Dept Computer Engineering, Curtin University of Technology / o ---- | Perth. Western Australia. / / / / / | Internet: North_TJ@cc.curtin.edu.au | Bitnet: North_TJ%cc.curtin.edu.au@cunyvm.bitnet _--_|\ | UUCP: uunet!munnari.oz!cc.curtin.edu.au!North_TJ / \ |----------------------------------------------------------- -->\_.--._/ |I don't want to achieve immortality through my work... v |I want to achieve it through not dying! -- Woody Allen. -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
rajiv@ee.rochester.edu (Rajiv Arora) (03/16/91)
I am teaching an undergraduate course on programming this semester, and we are
using Mac Pascal v3.0 for assignments.
I find it to be a wonderful package for computer novices to learn Pascal--sure
it's interpreted (hence slow), but you can always upgrade to Think Pascal once
you're ready to do real programming. Throwing Think Pascal at novices is, in my
opinion, unwise.
Mac Pascal also provides access to QuickDraw in an easy form; perfect again for
novices to learn basic graphic programming.
As for the original question about printing, I think Rich Siegel has already
answered that one.
-Rajiv Arora
--
Addresses:
UUCP: ...!rochester!ur-valhalla!rajiv
Internet: rajiv@ee.rochester.edu phil@waikato.ac.nz (03/18/91)
Thanks for the overwhelming response -- it seems Mac Pascal use is widespread, worldwide. We have settled on MacPascal. It runs OK from an AppleShare file server, which was the main requirement, for those who wanted a summary. -- Phil Etheridge (phil@waikato.ac.nz) Phax: +64 +71 381 155 Computer Services/Mathematics & Statistics Phone: +64 +71 568 299 x 8339 University of Waikato, Hamilton, NZ. I'd rather be MTBing