herzlich@EMX.UTEXAS.EDU (Larry Herzlich) (04/19/88)
As our machine room gets filled with the old 780's in the Comp. Center, we are running out of room for disk. We are considering a new product from a company in CA called "EXSYS RACE-760". EXSYS claims to have a package where 4 of their drives occupy the same space as 1 RA81. Each drive is 760MB unformatted (587MB VMS formatted) and is supposed to be plug compatible with our HSC50's. Their controller is supposed to convert from ESDI to SDI and back. The disks they use are the MAXTOR 760's (the 5 1/4" drives). Although the transfer rate is less than an RA81 (15Mb/sec vs 1.4MB/sec for an RA81) they claim the actual performance is about equal due to their 18ms average access time (versus 30ms RA81 access times). Soooo, what's the problem? 1. Am I missing something? This seems too good to be true - ~2.4GB of storage in an RA slot. Similar performance specs at a fraction of the cost (~10K per drive/controller/power/cables) 2. What about changes to firmware as DEC gets further into OLTP (online transaction processing)? Am I going to get screwed by changes in the HSC microcode, changes to MSCP, changes to the RA disk layout? HSC v3.70 is released, any problems? Aside: Has anyone written into a contract a warranty for *all* ECO's/FCO's that might be needed if DEC changes something that causes the 3rd party disk to break? We are even considering requiring them to supply us with equivalent DEC hardware should they not be able to continue working with the HSC50, for 5 years. 3. Is DEC going to sue these guys for running SDI/ESDI disks? I don't know if any of the disk architectures are proprietary. 4. Are there other disk drive/controller combinations that directly plug into the HSC50? I've seen lots of good drives, CDC, FUJITSU, NEC, but they all need a controller to plug into the system. We feel the HSC50 is one of DEC's best products and don't want to go back to UDA50's or equivalents. BTW, EXSYS is supposed to stand for EXcellent SYStems. Actually, these engineers are ex-System Industries employees. ---- Larry Herzlich herzlich@emx.utexas.edu University of Texas at Austin CCCS001@UTADNX -- BITnet Computation Center UTSPAN::UTAIVC::CCCS001 (SPAN) User Services Division ..!seismo!ut-sally!ut-emx!herzlich -------
nagy%warner.hepnet@LBL.GOV (Frank J. Nagy, VAX Wizard & Guru) (05/18/88)
> Soooo, what's the problem? > 1. Am I missing something? This seems too good to be true - > ~2.4GB of storage in an RA slot. Similar performance specs > at a fraction of the cost (~10K per drive/controller/power/cables) Nope, you are not missing anything. When Digital first came out with the RA-series of disks, they were quite state-of-the-art. That is not true any more. Current disk technology is considerably ahead of Digital who is once again playing catchup (however, there may be better news from Digital in the future - sometime this year). > 2. What about changes to firmware as DEC gets further into OLTP > (online transaction processing)? Am I going to get screwed by > changes in the HSC microcode, changes to MSCP, changes to the > RA disk layout? HSC v3.70 is released, any problems? Don't know about HSC V3.70, but I doubt that Digital will do anything to invalidate the current installed base of RA disks and HSC/UDA/KDA/KDB controllers. New disks/controllers might support new features, but there is an enormous installed base which can't just be punted or Digital will piss off A LOT OF SITES. > Aside: Has anyone written into a contract a warranty for *all* > ECO's/FCO's that might be needed if DEC changes something that > causes the 3rd party disk to break? We are even considering > requiring them to supply us with equivalent DEC hardware should > they not be able to continue working with the HSC50, for 5 years. Sounds like a good idea. > 3. Is DEC going to sue these guys for running SDI/ESDI disks? I don't > know if any of the disk architectures are proprietary. ESDI is a public standard (non-Digital). SDI is Digital's. They haven't sued anyone yet (such as Emulex or SI), but who knows what the lawyers have planned for tomorrow. > 4. Are there other disk drive/controller combinations that directly > plug into the HSC50? I've seen lots of good drives, CDC, FUJITSU, > NEC, but they all need a controller to plug into the system. We > feel the HSC50 is one of DEC's best products and don't want to go > back to UDA50's or equivalents. Both EMULEX and SI sell such systems. I believe that Emulex's use CDC Sabre disks and SI's use NEC disks. Note: if a disk will connect to a UDA50 or KDA50, it will also connect to an HSC since both use the same Standard Disk Interface (SDI). = Frank J. Nagy "VAX Guru & Wizard" = Fermilab Research Division EED/Controls = HEPNET: WARNER::NAGY (43198::NAGY) or FNAL::NAGY (43009::NAGY) = BitNet: NAGY@FNAL = USnail: Fermilab POB 500 MS/220 Batavia, IL 60510
CP.PAVER@MCC.COM (Bob Paver) (05/22/88)
You think the EXSYS sounds too good to be true.... System Technology Associates was showing a Gig-a-Rig at DEXPO. Plug compatible drives with 1.1 Gig per "spindle". You can put 4 drives in one cabinet that is about the size of a MicroVax II cabinet. The cabinet is a little longer. Claim to plug right into the UDA/KDB50. No prices. They're sending me literature. Bob -------