mikes@ncsuvx.ncsu.edu (Michael Steele) (02/22/89)
I am new to this newsgroup so pardon any ignorance regarding the topic. As a part of the South Hall Computer Theme Program at NC State University in Raleigh, NC, we aquired a Convergent Tech Mini-frame plus a few months ago. Below are several questions I have regarding the system, any help you can provide will be GREATLY appreciated (either by posting to the net or via email). We have a mini-frame plus with v3.10net of SYS V. We have 130 meg of disk storage and about 4 meg of memory. We are suppose to be configured to support 16 users, 8 over 9600 baud serial and 8 over ethernet. 1) Is there an FTP site for pc sources (ie an archive) or software that is configured for the 7300 3B1 miniframe, etc (I've heard they are all binary compatable). What has been a pain for us is converting BSD programs to Sys V, I'm sure others are doing the same. Has someone archived these conversions? 2) Has anyone found a patch for 3.10 net version of Sys V that will allow TCP IP software to work on a Type B network? To put it simply, our TCP-IP software doesn't work on the Ethernet network at NC State. It's my understanding that the software isn't masking certain packets correctly to recognize a Type B? network. 3) Has anyone seen a PD korn shell for the CTIX machines? It is my understanding that later versions of Sys V support the Korn shell. Is it true that AT&T distributes UNIX free to universities...I assume this information is VERY old, or do they still do it. If so, how would one go about upgrading their software and can we get kernal source? 4) I've seen several postings about gcc running on AT&T machines. We have the gcc source but haven't compiled it due to a 8 character variable name limit in our compiler. Has someone gone through gcc and shortened the variable names or does this limitation disappear with later versions of Sys V? We have sucessfully converted elm and emacs to the 8 char limit if anyone is interested in getting our modified source. We are very interested in removing the 8 char limit so we can easily compile other large programs. 5) Does anyone know of a PD pascal for any machine...one that has the possibility of being converted to our CTIX machine? Or any other languages for that matter. 6) Finally does anyone know of man files for the CTIX machine or for Sys V. We didn't get any online docs with our system and are presently modifying BSD docs to comply with Sys V. Thank you for bearing with me. Once again, any help will be appreciated! Michael Steele mikes@ncsuvx.ncsu.edu mikes@ncsuctix.ncsuvx.ncsu.edu netoprms@ncsuvm.bitnet
terry@eecea.eece.ksu.edu (Terry Hull) (02/22/89)
In article <2592@ncsuvx.ncsu.edu> mikes@ncsuvx.ncsu.edu.UUCP (Michael Steele) writes: > > 3) Has anyone seen a PD korn shell for the CTIX machines? There are NO public-domain versions of ksh available. It (ksh source) can be purchased from AT&T Toolchest for several thousand dollars. Aspen Technologies sells ksh binaries for $150-$350 depending on the target machine. Send e-mail if you would like a phone number. > It is my understanding that later versions of Sys V support the Korn > shell. System V Release 4 will include ksh. > Is it true > that AT&T distributes UNIX free to universities...I assume this > information is VERY old, or do they still do it. No it's not free, but it is much less than the commercial price. University price is only a few thousand dollars. > If so, how would one go > about upgrading their software and can we get kernal source? Remember, you are not running SysV, you are running CTIX. Not only will you need SysV sources, you will also need the Convergent customizations to the standard source if you want to build a new kernel for your machine. I think the problem will be getting the sources from Convergent. -- Terry Hull Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering Kansas State University INTERNET: terry@eecea.eece.ksu.edu Manhattan, KS 66502 UUCP: rutgers!ksuvax1!eecea!terry
jcm@mtunb.ATT.COM (was-John McMillan) (02/22/89)
In article <2592@ncsuvx.ncsu.edu> mikes@ncsuvx.ncsu.edu.UUCP (Michael Steele) writes: > I am new to this newsgroup so pardon any ignorance regarding the topic. > As a part of the South Hall Computer Theme Program at NC State University > in Raleigh, NC, we aquired a Convergent Tech Mini-frame plus a few months > ago. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^- o my... As a matter of fact, the Mini-frame was, at one point, not much more than an overweight UNIX(rg)-pc: sort of the price one paid for a coupla extra connectors. If you are NOT running SVR3, this is probably the most appropriate hole in which to post questions! Yes, a bit of history -- as distorted by my weak recollections -- of things: The 3B1 & Mini-frame software had the same -- or very common -- base, many years ago. As I recall, there were numerous 'ifdefs'. For various contractual reasons -- proprietary issues, mostly -- CT's product- line kernel staff were separated from the AT&T-product kernel staff and an unknown [to me] amount of divergence ensued. > Below are several questions I have regarding the system, any help > you can provide will be GREATLY appreciated (either by posting to the net > or via email). We have a mini-frame plus with v3.10net of SYS V. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Since I haven't the faintest idea of what "v3.10net" is, I can't address it directly. The UNIX-pc is derived from CTIX: the UNIX-pc was NOT BASED on SVR3 -- although much of the SVID [System V Interface Definition] is common. > 1) Is there an FTP site for pc sources (ie an archive) or software that is > configured for the 7300 3B1 miniframe, etc (I've heard they are all binary > compatable). What has been a pain for us is converting BSD programs to > Sys V, I'm sure others are doing the same. Has someone archived these > conversions? It is quite possible that CTIX remains binary-compatible with the UNIX-pc. Divergence [from Convergence ?-) ] in the Shared library is always a threat. Or, subtle variations in the system calls could have crept in: AT&T spent considerable effort maximizing SVID compliance for the UNIX-pc. CT may not have incorporated those in their product. Conversely: they may be MORE in compliance by virtue of running a full SVR3. (If you have /usr/include/sys/region.h you're SVR3.) AT&T did attempt to contract with CT to deploy the CT SVR3 "product" (I never really saw it, and don't know if was ever really released for the Mini-frame) on the 3B1, but negotiations (or work) collapsed as strains accumulated -- typical when a LARGE and small corporation work together. [No comment.] Toward the end of our period of depending on CT to do the 3B1 kernel work, we were told, a number of times, "we've already fixed that in our version" -- indicating they had isolated AT&T contract work from their own BUG FIXES! (Save electrons: you can't add anything meaningful to OUR comments.) This may indicate further divergences, even if you aren't running SVR3. While you CAN avoid shared libraries, they are generally a REAL blessing in disk/swap savings. > 3) Has anyone seen a PD korn shell for the CTIX machines? Has anyone seen a P[ublic] D[omain] korn shell for anything? > Is it true > that AT&T distributes UNIX free to universities...I assume this > information is VERY old, or do they still do it. If so, how would one go > about upgrading their software and can we get kernal source? 'Think there was always a nominal fee: in the early days it was little more than a tape-charge. Try phoning: (800) 828-UNIX -- and post your results. > 4) I've seen several postings about gcc running on AT&T machines. Try loading a STRIPped 'gcc' from someone's UNIX-pc. If it can run, can't you bootstrap to a full, long-names ["flexnames"] development environment? (The UNIX-pc moved to "flexnames" around release 3.0 [or was that 3.5?].) John McMillan -- att!mtunb!jcm -- muttering for himself, ONLY
mvadh@cbnews.ATT.COM (andrew.d.hay) (02/23/89)
this discussion has caused me to wonder: can a ctix sVr3 port run on a 3b1? enquiring minds want to know... -- Andrew Hay +------------------------------------------------------+ Apprentice Polymath | Yes, the wages of sin ARE death, but after they take | AT&T-BL Ward Hill MA | taxes out, it's kind of a tired feeling really | mvuxq.att.com!adh +------------------------------------------------------+
mikes@ncsuvx.ncsu.edu (Michael Steele) (02/24/89)
I would like to thank everyone who has responded to my questions regarding our Convergent Mini-frame Plus. Hopefully I will clarify some of the questions concerning our version of UNIX...at least what I've read in the CTIX documentation. >> Below are several questions I have regarding the system, any help >> you can provide will be GREATLY appreciated (either by posting to the net >> or via email). We have a mini-frame plus with v3.10net of SYS V. > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > Since I haven't the faintest idea of what "v3.10net" is, > I can't address it directly. The UNIX-pc is derived from > CTIX: the UNIX-pc was NOT BASED on SVR3 -- although much > of the SVID [System V Interface Definition] is common. > 3.10 net is suppose to be a special version of Sys V developed by the CT folks to add TCP/IP support. I don't know what compatabilities it has with the AT&T versions of sys V. I have heard that the Mini-frame is suppose to be binary compatable with the 3B1 and Mega-frame machines. I haven't had the opportunity to try this out though. Also the docs said that this version of Sys V has BSD inhancements including Sockets for TCP-IP support. >> Is it true >> that AT&T distributes UNIX free to universities...I assume this >> information is VERY old, or do they still do it. If so, how would one go >> about upgrading their software and can we get kernal source? > > 'Think there was always a nominal fee: in the early days > it was little more than a tape-charge. > > Try phoning: (800) 828-UNIX -- and post your results. I tried calling the 1-800 number but I can't place the call from NC. It's my understanding that AT&T's software distribution is in Greensboro, NC. It may be they don't allow 1-800 calls from NC. Does anyone know their 1-919 number or another 800 number for in NC calls? >> 4) I've seen several postings about gcc running on AT&T machines. > > Try loading a STRIPped 'gcc' from someone's UNIX-pc. If it > can run, can't you bootstrap to a full, long-names ["flexnames"] > development environment? (The UNIX-pc moved to "flexnames" > around release 3.0 [or was that 3.5?].) So can I assume that the version of gcc on cheops doesn't have shortened variable names? If I can get a decent version of a C compiler working, life will be much easier. Also what is this STORE that everyone is talking about? Are they FTPable? Thanks for all your help. Michael Steele mikes@ncsuvx.ncsu.edu netoprms@ncsuvm.bitnet
mvadh@cbnews.ATT.COM (andrew.d.hay) (02/24/89)
In article <2596@ncsuvx.ncsu.edu> mikes@ncsuvx.ncsu.edu.UUCP (Michael Steele) writes:
[]
"> Try phoning: (800) 828-UNIX -- and post your results.
"
" I tried calling the 1-800 number but I can't place the call from NC.
" It's my understanding that AT&T's software distribution is in Greensboro,
" NC. It may be they don't allow 1-800 calls from NC.
because of the demarcation between AT&T and the RBOCs (regional bell
operating cos) since the breakup, it is *NOT*POSSIBLE* to call *ANY*
AT&T 800 number from the same state it gets routed to. You can have a
local number ring the same line, or you can have an in-state 800
number, but you can't have an in-state 800 number ring the same line
as an AT&T 800 number.
" Also what is this STORE that everyone is talking about? Are they
" FTPable?
it's an AT&T machine (vax, i think) in middletown, nj which has a
large collection of installable software packages free for the call,
for the 3b1.
make a uucp entry for machine 'shop',
phone number {9+} 1,201,957-4646; then
uucp -m shop!store/STOREROOM/CATALOG+IN /usr/spool/uucppublic/{wherever}
and install it.
--
Andrew Hay +------------------------------------------------------+
Apprentice Polymath | Yes, the wages of sin ARE death, but after they take |
AT&T-BL Ward Hill MA | taxes out, it's kind of a tired feeling really |
mvuxq.att.com!adh +------------------------------------------------------+bms@mitisft.Convergent.COM (Bruce Schlobohm) (02/25/89)
In article <4271@cbnews.ATT.COM>, mvadh@cbnews.ATT.COM (andrew.d.hay) writes: > this discussion has caused me to wonder: > can a ctix sVr3 port run on a 3b1? CTIX 6.x is based on AT&T System V Release 3 (and higher). Early on in the 6.0 development cycle, 6.0 was to be supported on the 3b1 (which was to be sold by CT as the S/50 or S/51), miniframe, and the "mightyframe" (now known as S/MT Series) machines. Then somewhere along the way, the decision was made to just work on the S/MT Series. Since then, we have removed many of the #ifdefs for the unixpc, and I'm quite sure that the current release (CTIX 6.1) kernel will not run on a unixpc. -- Bruce Schlobohm bms@Convergent.COM -or- {pyramid,sri-unix,pacbell}!ctnews!bms