levy@cbnewsc.ATT.COM (Daniel R. Levy) (06/11/89)
In article <1545@sialis.mn.org>, rjg@sialis.mn.org (Robert J. Granvin) writes: [about uudemon.day] > The solution is VERY simple. Remove the `cd`, and make the find > reference an explicit path. If the directory dies or goes away, the > find will fail, and nothing more will happen than your uucp mailfile > getting a note of the failure. Could someone please tell me if my postings on this group are getting out? Twice this past week I mentioned that a failed 'cd' (due to, for example, the directory named as the argument to 'cd' not being present) would ABORT a script running under /bin/sh, uucpadm's default shell. This is UNLIKE what happens in an interactive shell session, where the shell does not abort upon a failed 'cd' but simply stays in the directory where it was before the failed 'cd'. Unless there is some reason that the uudemon.day isn't running under stock /bin/sh (e.g., you installed your own version of /bin/sh which does not abort scripts upon a failed cd, or installed /bin/ksh in place of /bin/sh, or gave uucpadm a shell of /bin/ksh in /etc/passwd [why? when it's not an account meant to be logged into directly]) there is NO DANGER of the stock uudemon.day wiping out anything other than 30-day-old contents of /usr/spool/uucppublic. Please folks, don't holler at AT&T for this.... I apologize for sounding exasperated. I assume that my posts just haven't gotten to Robert's site yet. Are they getting out at all? -- Daniel R. Levy UNIX(R) mail: att!ttbcad!levy, att!cbnewsc!levy AT&T Bell Laboratories 5555 West Touhy Avenue Any opinions expressed in the message above are Skokie, Illinois 60077 mine, and not necessarily AT&T's.
rjg@sialis.mn.org (Robert J. Granvin) (06/11/89)
>> The solution is VERY simple. Remove the `cd`, and make the find >> reference an explicit path. If the directory dies or goes away, the >> find will fail, and nothing more will happen than your uucp mailfile >> getting a note of the failure. > >Could someone please tell me if my postings on this group are getting out? > >Twice this past week I mentioned that a failed 'cd' (due to, for example, >the directory named as the argument to 'cd' not being present) would ABORT a >script running under /bin/sh, uucpadm's default shell. > >I apologize for sounding exasperated. I assume that my posts just haven't >gotten to Robert's site yet. Are they getting out at all? Yes, they're getting here. However, I should have clarified a point (just like I noted that the original posting didn't clarify the point :-). This made the exact point that I failed to... There are more than a few people who insist upon changing default shells away from /bin/sh to other shells including ksh and others. Prudent or wise? Your decision. (Although a real cron will warn you that the commands will be executed with /bin/sh. What does a stock 3b1 do if you change your default shell and run a cron job?) However, if run as ksh, the failed cd will NOT cancel the execution of the script. So, even if safe under a cron job, it may not be safe under a manually executed job. And since so many people are panicking about it and beating it into the ground (which was a point I _did_ make), then just "solve" it and quit letting it eat your cerebral cortex. Seeing everything from comments about "reprehensible" to lawsuits, it's just not worth discussing it anymore since people are just not thinking rationally about it. Just fix it, and "Don't worry, be happy." -- ________Robert J. Granvin________ INTERNET: rjg@sialis.mn.org ____National Computer Systems____ CONFUSED: rjg%sialis.mn.org@shamash.cdc.com __National Information Services__ UUCP: ...uunet!rosevax!sialis!rjg "Exxon: Our gasoline contains no sea water"
seg@PacBell.COM (S. E. Grove) (06/13/89)
>Could someone please tell me if my postings on this group are getting out? > Yes. You got to me. Stephen Grove pacbell!pbhya!seg
thad@cup.portal.com (Thad P Floryan) (07/22/89)
Both Karl Botts and Robert Granvin bring up good points. And, yes, the issue of uudemon.day deleting files IS getting tedious. HOWEVER: I've been reading this newsgroup for 2 years and have archived nearly everything, and not once before has the matter of files disappearing at 4AM daily been brought up (to my recollection.) My original posting served to alert people to that fact of Unix life, and I received over 20 emails thanking me for the posting. From my displays at the West Coast Computer Faire, discussions in the local UNIXPC SIG of the AT&T Users' Group, and from other chance meetings of fellow UNIXPC'ers, it's clear to me that MOST owners/users of UNIXPC systems are simply not aware of such things being done TO them (by the crontab scripts and whatever else.) If one had the $$$ for a formal UNIX education, I'm sure the $2,000/week classes that one attended informed YOU of these "problems." But the main reason I bought my UNIXPC (in 1987) was to teach myself UNIX for LESS than the cost of a single class, and have the hardware as an added benefit. I've used over 50 different computer systems in the 25+ years I've been involved with computing, and can pick up on a "new" system quickly; I now consider myself moderately proficient with UNIX, and learn more daily by teaching/helping others with their systems. The UNIX credo of "build upon the work of others" is something I practice and teach. A forum such as this one is one in which we all help each other. The tone of yet another posting suggested "cut out the crap" and deal with only the technical issues. I disagree. New readers are always entering this forum. My $.02 ... Thad Floryan [ thad@cup.portal.com (OR) ..!sun!portal!cup.portal.com!thad ]
bob@rush.cts.com (Bob Ames) (08/03/89)
In article <19560@cup.portal.com> thad@cup.portal.com (Thad P Floryan) writes: >Both Karl Botts and Robert Granvin bring up good points. And, yes, the issue >of uudemon.day deleting files IS getting tedious. > >HOWEVER: I've been reading this newsgroup for 2 years and have archived >nearly everything, and not once before has the matter of files disappearing >at 4AM daily been brought up (to my recollection.) David Solan (kdavid@gizzmo.UUCP) posted on this subject about 1 year ago. He also goes into this at length in "Objective Utilities", a software package for the UNIX PC which includes nice things like Unremove, Blinkoff, utilities to optimize file placement on hard drives, lots of documentation on Unix PC filesystem bugs, etc. I think Objective Utilities sells for around $125.00. If you`ve ever deleted a file and immediately wished it would return, type Unremove! "I don`t work for Objective Programming (201-866-6900), I`m just a satisfied customer." Bob Bob Ames The National Organization for the Reform of Marijuana Laws, NORML "Pot is the world's best source of complete protein, alcohol fuel, and paper, is the best fire de-erosion seed, and is america's largest cash crop." - USDA bob@rush.cts.com or ncr-sd!rush!bob@nosc.mil or rutgers!ucsd!ncr-sd!rush!bob 619-741-UN2X "We each pay a fabulous price for our visions of paradise," Rush
cks@ziebmef.uucp (Chris Siebenmann) (08/18/89)
thad@cup.portal.com (Thad P Floryan) writes (in a really ancient article I should have replied to long ago): | From my displays at the West Coast Computer Faire, discussions in the local | UNIXPC SIG of the AT&T Users' Group, and from other chance meetings of fellow | UNIXPC'ers, it's clear to me that MOST owners/users of UNIXPC systems are | simply not aware of such things being done TO them (by the crontab scripts and | whatever else.) Congratulations; you've just learned another lesson of Unix system administraion. One should *always* look at the automated scripts that ye spiffy Unix system wants to run; from crontab, on startup, in /etc/profile, in /etc/inittab. One usually finds out some quite interesting and often important information, and one avoids nasty surprises (like that fsck -y that's probably *still* in people's /etc/rc; send email for a copy of my article about why this is a Real Bad Idea and how to fix it). [For example, take a look at /etc/cleanup.wk -- it shows you how to get smgr to empty out /usr/adm/cronlog, for example (and it removes week-old core files for you, and other functions).] -- "Would that Aza Chorn had teleported Bates elsewhere and not removed so charming and preposterous a folly from our skyline ... but then he could not have known, not being raised around these parts." Chris Siebenmann uunet!{utgpu!moore,attcan!telly}!ziebmef!cks cks@ziebmef.UUCP or .....!utgpu!{,ontmoh!,ncrcan!brambo!}cks