[comp.windows.x] X "Terminal" Vendors List

pda@stiatl.UUCP (Paul Anderson) (03/03/89)

This is a collection of information that I have been pulling together
based on my own experiences and responses from the net.  I hope you
will find it useful.  I will repost monthly at this point.

I will mail this list to any requestors that miss it and will try to
keep it updated.  Anyone with additional information that would like
to share it, I would greatly appreciate you sending it along and I will
incorporate it within.

Thanks,

Paul Anderson
---------------------------------------------------------------------

X11 for 386 Unix
----------------

>From: Dimitri Rotow 
>Bell Technologies.
>Date: ~1/15/89

The Bell Tech Blit series of boards all run X.  That we ship X10 as
our present commercial implementation doesn't detract from the numerous
11 efforts on the Blit.   We'll be shipping 11 in the weeks ahead based on 
AT&T's own X11 port.   AT&T's stuff, by the way, is hands down the very 
best X11 port on Intel processors running System V.  Their XWIN product
is available off the shelf today and is absolutely rock solid.   Even
if you don't have one of our Blit boards, get the AT&T product and run it
on your EGA (ugh!).

The current line of Blits support 1662 x 1200 resolution in monochrome,
and 640 x 480, 1024 x 768, 1024 x 1024 and 1280 x 1024 in color.  The
new "Instant Workstation" unit combines 1662 x 1200 in mono, plus
640 x 480 in color, plus thick and thin Ethernet, plus a mouse port
on the same card.  As well as X it runs TCP/IP, NFS and/or RFS for netstuff.
These things plug into any '386 clone.




Packages similar to Microsoft Windows for X
===========================================

>From: Doug Toppin
>uunet!melpar!toppin
>Date: ~1/15/89

I use something at work called 'Viewnix' from the Five Paces Software
company in Atlanta, Georgia. I run IBM Xenix V on an AT.
It is configured into the kernel and provides multiple, 
simultaneously displayed windows on the console. Each window
can be the size of the screen or smaller. The windows can remain
in the background undisplayed or be floated to the foreground.
Each window is in the device directory and
is thus treated just like a terminal. Processes can be running
in each window and each process believes it controls an entire terminal. 
I am extremely impressed with its performance and
features. I believe the cost is ~$250.00 a pop but it is worth it.




IBM-PC X-Windows Implementations
================================

>From: gatech!stiatl!pda (Paul Anderson)
>Sales Technologies, Inc.
>Date: 3/2/89

Graphic Software Systems has a PC XWindows Display Server that
runs on 8088/86/286/386 class PC's running MSDOS.  It requires the 
use of Excelan's 'Intelligent ethernet board' Model 205T.
Current support is for EGA/VGA/VGIS graphics display cards. (VGIS 
is a very high res mono (I believe) display.)
 
Software package is "PC XView", part no: 1260  priced at $295.00.

Contact Russ Sprunger or Jim Thomason at 
Graphic Software Systems, Inc.  (503) 641-2200.

For the 205T ethernet board, contact David Hart at Excelan
(800) 392-3526 or (408) 434-2300. You will also need their
"Lan Workplace for PCDOS host share package", which is bundled
with the board.  The bundled price is $1150.

--

>From: William S. Cole, University of Southern California
>ARPA: cole@dworkin.USC.EDU 
>Date: ~1/15/89

For those interested in using X Windows Version 11 on an IBM-AT or
compatible, Integrated Inference Machines has developed an X11 server
which runs under MS-DOS using Microsoft Windows.  The server converts
an IBM-AT into an X Windows terminal.  It requires a system
with at least 2Meg of extended memory and currently requires an
Excelan ethernet board (others are planned).  Because the server
runs under Microsoft Windows, a large variety of monochrome and
color displays are supported.

For more information, contact:

Tricia Nuskin or Charles Ross
Integrated Inference Machines
1468 E. Katella Avenue
Anahiem, California 92805
Phone (714)978-6776
FAX (714)939-0746

--


>From: mbroadbe@gldsyd.OZ (Mark Broadbent)
>Organization: Gould Electronics, CSD, Sydney, Australia
>Date: 20 Feb 89 04:15:35 GMT

>I am looking for the x window on IBM PC/AT compatibles with EGA 
>or VGA (maybe others?) graphics display.

We have pcXsight running on a Commodore PClone and a NEC Powermate IV,
connected to a Gould PowerNode Unix Super-minicomputer.
This software runs on 8088, 8086, 80286, 80386 IBM PC compatibles, 
under DOS 3.1 or later, with an EGA, VGA, Hercules, or AT&T 6300 
graphics adaptor.

A chap called Peter Brown is distributing the software here in Australia.
You can contact him on (02) 957-2522.




XWindows Terminals Sources
==========================

>From: Paul Anderson
>Sales Technologies, Inc.
>Date: ~1/15/89

Visual Technologies
"Visual 640"	X Display Station

X11R2, TCP/IP, has support to use NFS for font downloads, TELNET terminal mode.
700 KB ROM with X Server and Ethernet Software.
Monochrome display, 14" diagonal crt, 1024x800.
Thick and thin wire Ethernet interfaces, as will as SLIP at 38.4 kbd.
Optical mouse, DEC VT220 compatible keyboard.
68000 Cpu clocked at 10 Mhz, 1MB ram standard.

Ed Heinze, Visual Technologies
1703 Middlesex St.
Lowell, MA 01851
(508) 459-4903    1 (800) VISUAL-C

--------
>From: Paul Anderson
>Sales Technologies, Inc.
>Date: ~1/15/89

Acer Counterpoint, Inc.
"Acer Xebra 100"

X11R2, TCP/IP, FTP for font downloads, TELNET & RS232 terminal mode.
512 KB ROM with X Server and Ethernet Software.
Monochrome display, 14" diagonal crt, 640x480.
Thick and thin wire Ethernet interfaces, as will as SLIP at 38.4 kbd.
8086 Cpu clocked at 10Mhz, 640KB ram standard.
3 button (or optional 2 button) optical mouse, DEC VT100 compatible keyboard.
Centronics parallel port.

Summary:
  The 640k of ram in the workstation was too little for our application 
  so we were unable to evaluate the unit.


Contact:

Anil Singh, Acer Counterpoint
2127 Ringwood Ave.
San Jose, CA  95131
(408) 434-0190  Fax: (408) 434-0273  Telex: 856884

-------
>From: Ken Lee klee@daisy.uucp
>Daisy Systems Corp., Interactive Graphics Tools Dept.

Tektronix (Beaverton, OR), model 4211 Graphics Netstation, 386SX cpu,
TI 34010 graphics processor, 1024x768 color, 15" screen, $6495


-------
>From: Richard A. Johnson		raj@ics.uci.edu   (Internet)
>UCI ICS Assistant Support Manager	ucbvax!ucivax!raj   (UUCP)
>Date ~2/10/89

NCD-16 X Window Terminal

We recently picked up one of the NCD-16 X Windowing terminals (the one which
was at the Usenix in San Diego in case you know the one to which I'm
referring) for a 1 week evaluation.  (We would have liked to keep it longer
but these things are really in demand and NCD doesn't have too many of them
as yet.  (We got serial number 50 or so!  Something like that.)  I thought
I'd give everyone our impressions of it.

General description:
--------------------
16 inch black and white square non-interlaced monitor.
Resolution of 1024 x 1024.
IBM-PC style keyboard layout.
.5 - 4.5 Mb of memory (using SIMs)
	There are 4 SIM slots in the base.  The unit has .5 Mb with nothing
	installed in these slots.  You can put in 256K SIMs or 1Mb SIMs.
	(Are other size SIMs available?  I don't use Macs so I don't know too
	much about SIMs really.)
	(Our unit had 1.5 Mb using 256K SIMs.  We wish we had some 1Mb SIMs
	to try it with, but I couldn't find any at the time.)
Software is at rev. 3 of X11.  (Visual is currently in Beta testing of Rev. 3.)
Supports thick and thin ethernet plus SLIP.

Good points:
------------
The 16 inch screen is a LOT better than the small 14 inch Visual one.  Also
the non-interlaced monitor doesn't flicker like the Visual screen does.
(This "flicker" is really evident if you use "twm".  The header bars when 
you're focused on a window are really bothersome on the Visual, but are nice
and clean on the NCD-16.)

The pixels are closer together on the NCD and thus pictures appear sharper.

The keyboard feels rather nice.  I liked it a lot better than the Visual
keyboard.  (And MOST keyboards are better than a Sun, so that was no
competition! :-) )

Setup and use was very straight forward.  If you know enough about networking
to set something like this up, then you can figure out how to do it easily.
(By the way, we didn't have a manual, but we set it up with no problems.)

The NCD system has a special graphic processor.  This was really evident to
me when I ran "texx" and panned around the zoomed image.  On a Sun this
flickers so badly that it's a really pain in the !@#$%, but on the NCD it was
really smooth and fast.  A few orders of magnitude improvement!  Honest!

The hardware has a little network activity light.  It was nice when wondering
why something (like getting a font) was taking so long.

Bad points:
-----------
It doesn't have NFS access for font files.  It uses TFTP.  This seems slower
than the Visual using NFS.  They said they will shortly have NFS (another month
or so).

Apparently you can't have more than around 20 or so TCP connections at once.
This was a problem for us (the support staff), but probably wouldn't be one
for general users.  They said they could increase the limit and asked what was a
good number.  I told them 50 or so at least, but closer to 100 would be even
better.

It doesn't support compressed fonts.  I haven't told them about this yet.  I'll
report back on their response when I do.

We found 1 minor bug and 1 major one:
1) Minor: "xset fp" seems to do one of two things; both wrong.  Sometimes it
	will set the font path to "(none)".  This results in all font
	manipulations failing making the terminal unusable.  Sometimes it
	simply "bombs" the system in such a way that it tells you push a letter
	to affect a system reboot.  Both of these are bad, but you can avoid
	them by simply explicitly resetting the same font path.
	I haven't told them about this one either.  I'll let you know.
2) Major: Sometimes the whole system just "locks up".  When this happens the
	little network monitoring light stays on constantly and no mouse
	buttons or keyboard input works.  The system still tracks the mouse but
	that's all.  Killing X programs doing output on the system doesn't
	have any effect.
	They said they haven't seen this but they'll take note of it and see
	what can be done.

Summary:
--------
If I could get one in my office right now, I'd gladly give up my Sun 3/50!
The increase in speed of the unit more than makes up for the lack of real
estate in my opinion.  Others in our support group feel the same way.
We'll probably order a few of them, however we'll have an agreement with them
first that we continue getting free software updates until they support NFS,
have fixed all of the bugs we found, and maybe until they support compressed
fonts.

They're worth checking into.  Definitely.  By the way, I was told they plan
a larger (19 inch) unit later this year (but who doesn't?  8^) ).

Phone contacts:
	Main number for NCD:		(415) 694-0650
	I talked to Judy Estrin, who refered me to Janak Pathak, the
	sales manager.


--

>From: SMITHKLINE.COM!WOOD ("Bill Wood, Upper Merion IS X5163 L331")
>Organization: The Internet
>Date: 22 Feb 89 04:56:00 GMT

I use X at 9600 baud all the time, and the response is fabulous!  My secret
is the new Graphon X terminal.  This terminal uses a Graphon protocol to
communicate with the host computer, so it avoids the 3 layers of protocol
inherent in X over SLIP (you have the X protocol, the SLIP protocol, and the
TCPIP protocol).  The Graphon communicates directly with an X server running
on a Unix machine.  Right now I am connected to a 9600 baud Microcom modem,
which is dialed in to work;  there it connects to another modem, thence
to a Dec terminal server running LAT protocol.  From there, I am connected
to another terminal server which is offering the serial port on a Sun 3 as
a service.  The Sun, in turn, is running Graphon's X server.  I have an
xterm session, and from it I did an rlogin to our Vax system, and sent this
message.

You have to try this terminal to believe it.  ICO runs like a bat out of hell!
And there are virtually no memory restrictions, since the server is on the Sun.

GraphOn is:

GraphOn Corporation
67 S. Bedford St.
Suite 400 W.
Burlington, MA 01803
(617) 229-5829

Tony Parisi
BBN Software Products

--

>From: klee@daisy.UUCP (Ken Lee)
>Organization: Daisy Systems Corp., Mountain View, Ca.
>Date: 27 Feb 89 17:58:54 GMT

There's an article discussing the GraphOn and several other X terminals
in the Feb., 1989 issue of *Mini-Micro Systems*.  GraphOn Corp. is
located in San Jose, California.  The GraphOn OptimaX 200 terminal will
reportedly be formally introduced at Uniforum this week.


X FOR IBM RT's
==============

>From: Scott Schwartz		<schwartz@shire.cs.psu.edu>
>Date:  ~2/20/89

In article <1709@ssc.UUCP>, fyl@ssc (Phil Hughes) writes:
>Mike Kupfer writes:
>> Is anyone running X on VGA displays?  Is anyone working on it?
>I haven't seen it run but Everex claims their X (X11 R3 which comes with
>ENIX, their 5.3.2 port for the 386) works with both EGA and VGA.

IBM ships X11 and drivers for the VGA with AOS (a.k.a. 4.3BSD) for their
6152 workstations (little RT's).   Works fine.




X Servers For the MAC II
========================

>From: alan@metasoft.UUCP (Alan Epstein)
>Organization: Meta Software Corporation, Cambridge MA
>Date: 2 Mar 89 15:54:27 GMT

> we'd like to run the new eXodus X server on the mac II. as i
> understand it, we can use TCP/IP with ethernet cards running
> in the Mac II, or we can use the Appletalk Data Stream Protocol
> with our Kinetics box. The second option requires ADSP to be
> running on the host (a Sun 3 in this case).
> [where may the necessary items be obtained?] 

Contact Jon Simmonds at IPT (Information Presentation Technologies).
Their number is (818)347-7791.

I'm not sure if they have ADSP running on the Sun 3 yet, but they
were getting close back in November.  They definitely do have
some software for the Sun 3.  I saw it running when I worked with
them, and I saw an announcement for product shipment back in
early January.

I used the software on a MIPS M/120 last year, and it was great.
I ran a MacII diskless (well, I had to boot from floppy, but after
that it asked me for a Unix login, kicked out the disk, and
warm-booted from the network).  Also, it gives Unix/Mac access
to printers on both networks, so you can access a LaserWriter
from Unix and a Unix printer from the Mac.  There's also a Unix
mail interface and a few other neat items.  My point is that
it can be useful for many needs, not just ADSP.

-- 
Paul Anderson		gatech!stiatl!pda		(404) 841-4000
	    X isn't just an adventure, X is a way of life...

klee@daisy.UUCP (Ken Lee) (03/04/89)

The Feb. 27 issue of InfoWorld mentions the MIPS RS1210 X terminal.
70Hz, non-interlaced, 16" monochrome, 1024x1024 pixels, up to 4.5MB RAM,
Ethernet, TCP/IP.  Basic model with 1MB is $3200, available in late
March.  I saw one of these at UniForum.  The MIPS salesman admitted that
it was really a NCD X terminal.

Some other news from UniForum:

IBM was displaying X servers for OS/2 and PC-DOS.  Sorry, I didn't get
any details.  Apple has X running on the Macintosh under A/UX.  Apollo
has ported Open Dialog to X, but it doesn't use the X Toolkit (yet).
Open Dialog support for the X Toolkit is planned to support Motif.


NCR, NCD, Visual, Acer, and GraphOn X terminals were all on display.
The first 3 look and perform suprisingly similarly.  Salesmen from
Tektronix and Wyse admitted that their rumored X terminals were vaporware
at best.

Toshiba and NEC were displaying "portable" 80386-based UNIX computers that
run the X Window System.  By portable, they mean they fold into 15 pound
breifcases and can be carried to somewhere else with AC power.  They're
kind of cute, though.

Ken Lee
-- 
klee@daisy.uucp
Daisy Systems Corp., Interactive Graphics Tools Dept.