pererik@KHEOPS.CMI.NO (Per-Erik Nordbo) (08/16/89)
Gadgets versus Widgets in Motif ------------------------------- Motif has introduced the user interface object "Gadget" as an alternative to "windowless" Widgets ( arrow, button, label, separator etc). Is the advantage converting a Widget into a functionally equilavalent Gadget primarily speed, memory savings or both? Is this a Motif-only toolkit extension? ============================ Per Erik Nordboe Chr. Michelsens Institute Norway email: pererik@kheops.cmi.no ============================
graham@fuel.dec.com (kris graham) (08/17/89)
>Gadgets versus Widgets in Motif >------------------------------- >Motif has introduced the user interface object "Gadget" as an alternative to >"windowless" Widgets ( arrow, button, label, separator etc). >Is the advantage converting a Widget into a functionally equilavalent Gadget >primarily speed, memory savings or both? Is this a Motif-only toolkit extension? Gadgets have been in the DECwindows toolkit long before Motif was created. I (am not sure) believe the MIT folks have it also. The implementors of gadgets say that there are tremendous performance improvements both in execution speed and data space.....for *both* application and server processes.... and reduces the incidence of lost functionality associated with widgets. Gadgets have no visuals so, they are 'barren"...ie. they can't have popup children, translations, etc. I am using a very fast workstation with a very fast server (DECstation 3100), so the differences between gadgets and widgets, may be in infinitesimal small units ;-) -- Christopher Graham Digital Equipment Corp Ultrix Resource Center New York City (usual disclaimers go in here)
anon@dip.eecs.umich.edu (Omar S. Juma) (08/17/89)
In article <322.8908161255@jupiter.cmi.no> pererik@KHEOPS.CMI.NO (Per-Erik Nordbo) writes: >Gadgets versus Widgets in Motif >------------------------------- > >Motif has introduced the user interface object "Gadget" as an alternative to >"windowless" Widgets ( arrow, button, label, separator etc). > >Is the advantage converting a Widget into a functionally equilavalent Gadget >primarily speed, memory savings or both? Is this a Motif-only toolkit extension? > >============================ >Per Erik Nordboe >Chr. Michelsens Institute >Norway >email: pererik@kheops.cmi.no >============================ I believe the trend in UIMSen [the new unofficial plural of UIMS] is towards windowless interface objects. You're not likely to save memory; the allocation burden is now moved to the client, not the server. You are, however, relieving the server from tracking hundreds of tiny little objects all over the place. Giving the client full tracking "rights" enables a variety of highlighting methods (maybe even none). It leaves the server more time to do what it does best: drawing text and graphics in windows, and handling device input. All other higher-level functionality is the domain of clients. That is the correct abstraction, until somebody decides to write an interface server. That's one small step forward. Unfortunately, we are now entering the tail-fin era in X user interfaces, and for a while, there will be too many garish, eminently forgettable UIMSen. But remember, even though some of us look back at pink Cadillacs with fondness, it's very unlikely than anyone will want to exhibit any emotion over the demise of the xedit-xmh school of user interface design. By the way, could someone from OSF provide information on the choice of "Motif" for a title? How did OSF get away with not naming it "Open Motive"? :-) Omar S. Juma Computer Aided Engineering Network (CAEN) University of Michigan, Ann Arbor MI 48109 phone: 313-936-2486 email: anon@caen.engin.umich.edu
ben@hpcvlx.HP.COM (Benjamin Ellsworth) (08/18/89)
> Is the advantage converting a Widget into a functionally equilavalent > Gadget primarily speed, memory savings or both? Primarily memory, however any time you get smaller on a virtual memory platform you also get faster -- the classical Speed vs. Size tradeoff is simply not accurate on most systems anymore. A gadget can be designed to carry only the minimum data neccessary to perform its function. All of the "shadow" window data (normally carried in and supported from core) can be eliminated. Gadgets allow both the client and the window server to be smaller and faster. > Is this a Motif-only toolkit extension? The idea is not new or unique with OSF. HP did them (the idea is at least as old as the XRay toolkit on X10), DEC did them (although to hear them talk about it you'd think theirs were the first, the best or the only), SPC did them, a couple of universities did them in the course of other work, and I don't know who else but I'm sure a lot of others did them also. Eliminating uneeded window overhead is an obvious enhancement to the original Xt Intrinsics design. Everybody, to the best of my knowledge, did them slightly differently. The OSF Motif gadgets follow a particular design policy which I'm sure OSF considers either copyrighted or a "trade secret" so I won't elaborate on it. If you want to build your own gadgets, either buy a OSF Motif source license and extend the current gadget set or create your own style of windowless objects. The latter may take some careful enhancements to the Xt Intrinsics. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Benjamin Ellsworth | ben@cv.hp.com | INTERNET Hewlett-Packard Company | {backbone}!hplabs!hp-pcd!ben | UUCP 1000 N.E. Circle | (USA) (503) 750-4980 | FAX Corvallis, OR 97330 | (USA) (503) 757-2000 | VOICE ----------------------------------------------------------------------- All relevant disclaimers apply. -----------------------------------------------------------------------
asente@decwrl.dec.com (Paul Asente) (08/18/89)
In article <100920101@hpcvlx.HP.COM> ben@hpcvlx.HP.COM (Benjamin Ellsworth) writes: >If you want to build your own gadgets, either buy a OSF Motif source >license and extend the current gadget set or create your own style of >windowless objects. The latter may take some careful enhancements to >the Xt Intrinsics. Or, you can wait for the R4 intrinsics, which will fully support gadgets, compatibly with Motif, XUI, the Athena widgets, or any other R3-based widget set. -paul asente asente@decwrl.dec.com decwrl!asente