scott@talarian.UUCP (Scott Weitzenkamp) (10/04/89)
Is there anything like AutoCode for X11? For those who don't know, AutoCode is (IMHO) a really slick program for creating user interfaces under SunView. It lets you create windows, panels, buttons, sliders, scrollbars, etc. You specify the C variables names for all the things you create, how to connect things (e.g. attaching a menu to a push button), and what callback routines to use. You can then generate C code for the user interface that you have created. AutoCode even has a preview mode to let you try out your creation. Has AutoCode been ported to X11? If so, what kind of C code does it generate (XView/SunView? Motif? Athena Widgets?). What I want (I guess) is a product that will generate C code that creates Xt Widgets. The problem is that there are lots of different widget sets (Athena, HP, Sony, Motif, DECwindows, etc). I have heard of UIMX from Visual Edge Software, and XBuild from Nixdorf in Burlington, MA. Does anybody out there have phone numbers for these two companies? -- Scott Weitzenkamp, Talarian Corporation, Mountain View, CA uunet!talarian!scott scott@talarian.uu.net (415) 941-9417 "Welcome to the late show, starring NULL and void" -- Men At Work Mail responses, and I'll summarize to the net.
Robespierre@cup.portal.com (Peter C Thompson) (10/05/89)
Xbuild from Nixdorf Computer Engineering is at
52 Third Ave.
Burlington, MA 01803
(617) 273-0480
email: uunet!decvax!linus!nixbur!{brophy,maggio}
I talked to these guys at the Motif "class" in Palo Alto, and they
seem to know what they are talking about. Their product appears to
be based on MOTIF, but I could be wrong :-)
Enjoy,
Peter Thompsonklee@gilroy.pa.dec.com (Ken Lee) (10/05/89)
In article <181@talarian.UUCP>, scott@talarian.UUCP (Scott Weitzenkamp) writes: > Is there anything like AutoCode for X11? I understand that AutoCode is being ported to X11, but that it will only support XView, not the X Toolkit. Two user interface generators/managers for the X Toolkit are XBuild from Nixdorf (617-273-0480) and TeleUSE from TeleSoft (619-457-2700). Of these, TeleUSE seems to be the most mature, with a built in dialog manager. On the other hand, XBuild claims they will support UIL (DECwindows and Motif) in the near future. Ken Lee DEC Western Software Laboratory, Palo Alto, Calif. Internet: klee@decwrl.dec.com uucp: uunet!decwrl!klee
waldorf@venice.SEDD.TRW.COM (jerry waldorf) (10/05/89)
In article <181@talarian.UUCP> scott@talarian.UUCP (Scott Weitzenkamp) writes: > I have heard of UIMX from Visual Edge Software, and XBuild from >Nixdorf in Burlington, MA. Does anybody out there have phone numbers >for these two companies? I am using UIMX on an HP 9000/330 workstation. I have a Beta version that HP gave to us. I believe that HP is doing the distributing of the UIMX software, so if you want to get a copy of it I suggest you call your local HP software representitive. I also understand that UIMX will be included with 7.0 HP-UX from HP. Although I have heard that this won't be available until 1990. There is also a NASA product that does similar things but I know little of this product, except its name which is TAE.
rlh2@ukc.ac.uk (R.L.Hesketh) (10/05/89)
In article <1889@bacchus.dec.com> klee@decwrl.dec.com writes: > >On the other hand, XBuild claims they will support UIL (DECwindows and >Motif) in the near future. > >Ken Lee As a side question, UIL doesn't appear to allow new widget classes to be added to its compiler tables. I can see one reason why ... programmers should only be using the DECWindows widget set to stick to the DECWindows look and feel. This does seem to be a limiting factor though, and may put a few people off (me for one). Of course I would like to be wrong on this one 8-). If DEC made a concious decision to be this limiting then why did they chosen a language? Surely a graphical, direct manipulation editor would be much easier for everyone (except the guy who built the UI Builder in the first place!). Okay, so UI Builders need to be quite intelligent to be able to handle creation of something more than just the static user interface which they can do very well anyway. But thats what UIL only does???? Richard Hesketh
randy@erik.UUCP (Randy Brown) (10/05/89)
The same company that does AutoCode does ExoCODE (Expert Object Corp, (312)676-5555), which is certainly for X11, but not for the widgets; it uses XView. An alternative is UIMX, which can be had in incarnations for Motif and for Open Look. For more info on the Open Look version, try Alan Hochberg (attmail!hochberg, 201-898-6356). Since it's in beta, I can't say how well it will work when released, but it is supposed to allow not only interactive screen design, but interpretative execution of the C code in the application. UIMX is from Visual Edge Software Ltd., 514-332-6430. Hope this helps. ... rb
brucec@demiurge.WV.TEK.COM (Bruce Cohen;685-2439;61-028) (10/06/89)
In article <2662@harrier.ukc.ac.uk> rlh2@ukc.ac.uk (R.L.Hesketh) writes: >As a side question, UIL doesn't appear to allow new widget classes to be >added to its compiler tables. I can see one reason why ... programmers >should only be using the DECWindows widget set to stick to the DECWindows >look and feel. This does seem to be a limiting factor though, and may >put a few people off (me for one). Of course I would like to be wrong >on this one 8-). > I took a Motif class (the track one overview course) last week, and the instructor (David Berks (sp?) of OSF) said that OSF planned to remove this restriction at a later date. > If DEC made a concious decision to be this limiting then >why did they chosen a language? Surely a graphical, direct manipulation >editor would be much easier for everyone (except the guy who built the >UI Builder in the first place!). Okay, so UI Builders need to be quite >intelligent to be able to handle creation of something more than just the >static user interface which they can do very well anyway. But thats >what UIL only does???? > As I understand it, the reason for the restriction is just to reduce the complexity of the first implementation. There was never an intention to enforce the look and feel this way. In fact, since there is no way that any toolkit designer can predict what a UI designer will need to do, there will always be people who have to go beyond the standard look and feel in areas where the standard is mute. Allowing these frontier explorers to hook their widgets up the standard ones in a UIL description will keep pressure on them to hold to the standards in areas where innovation is not necessary. "Small men in padded bras don't look the same falling from high places." - R.A. MacAvoy, "The Third Eagle" Bruce Cohen brucec@orca.wv.tek.com Interactive Technologies Division, Tektronix, Inc. M/S 61-028, P.O. Box 1000, Wilsonville, OR 97070
chan@hpfcmgw.HP.COM (Chan Benson) (10/07/89)
> I also understand that UIMX will be included with 7.0 HP-UX from HP.
Don't know where you heard this, but it is definitely *FALSE*.
-- Chan Benson
HP Fort Collinscrom@cuuxb.ATT.COM (Netnews Administrator) (10/07/89)
in article <35@venice.SEDD.TRW.COM>, waldorf@venice.SEDD.TRW.COM (jerry waldorf) says: > I am using UIMX on an HP 9000/330 workstation. I have a Beta version that Could you say a few words about UIMX and whether you find it useful? Does it generate Xlib calls or does it use a set of widgets? -- -- Jack Dixon, AT&T { ...!att!vogon!jcd, jcd@vogon.att.com }
marbru@auto-trol.UUCP (Martin Brunecky) (10/10/89)
Re: Extending the built-in UIL tables. There is a documented way for adding user-written widgets to the UIL by including widget definition file. However, any reference to such widget must use "user-defined" clause, plus the application must register all the widget creation routines (for use by DRM). The UIL build-in tables are (I'v been told) created by VAX Scan, so they are not quite easy to modify. However, considering how many more importand defficiencies the UIL has, the way to include user-written widgets is not too clumersome. I am using it for the whole widget set (buttons, organizers etc.), and it's not too bad. On the other hand, I would like to join the UIL-bashers club, if there is one ... -- ############################################################################### Martin Brunecky, Auto-trol Technology Corporation, 12500 North Washington Street, Denver, CO-80241-2404 (303) 252-2499 ncar!ico!auto-trol!marbru
waldorf@venice.SEDD.TRW.COM (jerry waldorf) (10/10/89)
In article <4196@cuuxb.ATT.COM> crom@cuuxb.ATT.COM (Netnews Administrator) writes: >in article <35@venice.SEDD.TRW.COM>, waldorf@venice.SEDD.TRW.COM (jerry waldorf) says: >> I am using UIMX on an HP 9000/330 workstation. I have a Beta version that > >Could you say a few words about UIMX and whether you find it useful? Does it >generate Xlib calls or does it use a set of widgets? I have found the Beta version of UIMX very slow. The code that is developed is fast enough but the developing of the interface is very frustrating. I hope that the performance increases otherwise I belive that this tool will not be well accepted. As for the calls it produces, the version I have makess calls to a toolkit provided by UIMX, i.e. the calls are to Ux... they appear to be very similar to the hp widget set. They tell me (my HP representative) that UIMX will eventually use the MOTIF standard.
tjd@leghorn.mpd.tandem.com (Tom Davidson) (10/10/89)
Although I wasn't directly asked, I have used UIMX in two forms for about a year and here are some comments... . I started out being a proponent of the UIL approach (OPEN/DIALOGUE) as I felt it presented a more rigorous approach and one could keep modification histories via rcs. Well, I changed my mind in a big way. . UIMX, up to recently, supported the HP widget set. Now I believe that the MOTIF version is ready to hit the streets soon and there is an OPEN LOOK version in the works. . I can't say enough good things about sitting down with your end user and building the i/f and test driving it with them. Because of the builtin C interpreter, you never leave the UIMX environment. . You can hook into existing C code, use system calls or subprocs to kick off helpers (and channel their output to widgets!). . UIMX keeps an interface file of your work which can be loaded and modified whenever needed. When ready to build the final application, you just ask UIMX to write the C code, bind it with the 10,000 X libraries and voila... you're done. . Ok, ok enough of the pep talk... is it useful? Yes, in the most recent case, I was able to build an application in about 15 hours which I think would have taken three weeks writing the code by hand. . The Ohio State "build a telephone" test using the Next IB was completed in comparable time ( < 1 hour) using UIMX. I think it's slick stuff. If you're looking for ways to speed up i/f building, and thereby concentrate on the real issues, check it out. Tom -- Tom Davidson internet: halley!foghorn!tjd@cs.utexas.edu Tandem Computers, Inc. fax: (512) 244-8247 voice: (512) 244-8375 14231 Tandem Boulevard Austin, TX 78728-6610
eli@haddock.ima.isc.com (Elias Israel) (10/11/89)
Perhaps I missed that part of the discussion, but can anyone tell me how
UIMX is obtained (i.e. from whom and at what price)?
I apologize in advance if this has already been mentioned.
Thanks,
Elias Israel | "Justice, n. A commodity which in more or
Interactive Systems Corp. | less adulterated condition the State sells
Boston, MA | to the citizen as a reward for his allegiance,
..!ima!haddock!eli | taxes, and personal service."
| -- Ambrose Bierce, _The Devil's Dictionary_ sean@cadre.dsl.pitt.edu (Sean McLinden) (10/12/89)
In article <1210015@hpfcmgw.HP.COM> chan@hpfcmgw.HP.COM (Chan Benson) writes: >> I also understand that UIMX will be included with 7.0 HP-UX from HP. > >Don't know where you heard this, but it is definitely *FALSE*. Oh well. One more reason for switching to Mach on the HPs. Sean McLinden University of Pittsburgh
tjd@leghorn.mpd.tandem.com (Tom Davidson) (10/12/89)
I'm giving this info out so much that I think its time for the net... UIMX is a product from Visual Edge Software 3870 Cote Vertu St. Laurent, Quebec Canada H4R 1V4 attn. Michael Foody phone: (514) 332-6430 or (415) 948-0753 --- Tom Davidson internet: halley!foghorn!tjd@cs.utexas.edu Tandem Computers, Inc. fax: (512) 244-8247 voice: (512) 244-8375 14231 Tandem Boulevard Austin, TX 78728-6610