sandee@loligo (Daan Sandee) (01/11/90)
In article <MISAN.90Jan10130659@ra.abo.fi> misan@ra.abo.fi (Annika Forsten DC) writes: >In article <425@fsu.scri.fsu.edu> sandee@loligo (Daan Sandee) writes: >> About Latin names : you must realize that (a) Birder's World is aimed at >> the large group of Sunday birdwatchers, rather than the hardcore birders, > >True, but Birder's World also features articles about foreign countries, >where birds often have several different names, and if you intend to travel True (also the rest of the paragraph, which I have deleted to save postage). I have an anecdote about Latin names. An article in a major Dutch newspaper about 10 years ago. A Dutch birder had occasion to visit Moscow for some scientific conference (unconnected with birds). She tried hard to arrange a birding trip through the hosting organization, but nothing happened. Remember, at that time all activities by foreigners had to have official approval. Finally some interpreter mentioned a cousin whose husband was a field ornithologist, and brought them into contact. They went on a birding trip somewhere near (it was in Spring), and had a great time. There was just one problem : the ornithologist spoke only Russian, the cousin little more and didn't know anything about birds, and the interpreter wasn't going to risk her job and come along on an unapproved expedition. But they managed, using Latin names ! She said it was great to hear Turdus iliacus sing (in Holland, they're winter visitors). Maybe sometime I'll get a chance myself. I'm sure they sing in Finland as well. > >> It is easy to treat North America as a closed region, ornithologically, >> and virtually everybody speaks English (I pity the Quebecois who are >> forced to use a foreign language to get around in birding). >Well, there are Spanish-speaking people too, they don't neccessarily learn >the English names first. After birding all over this country for four years, I have yet to meet one true Hispanic (meaning Spanish-speaking) birder. If you read AB, you will see many contributors with Spanish names : I'm sure all those have English as their mother tongue. The millions of Spanish-speaking Americans don't bird, apparently. Although the areas they live in are among the most inter- esting in this country, birdwise. Quebec is another matter. Although they no doubt lack the birdwatching tradition of the English-speaking peoples, they do watch birds, and publish about it (in French), and contribute to AB (in English). They have a rare- bird-alert hotline in French, so they must have standardized French names for most North American birds (after all, the hotline mostly is for reporting non-local birds). > >> I know that in Britain, the BOU does more or less >> the same job of taxonomy and nomenclature that the AOU does for North >> America. But does anybody know if there is a European body or organiz- >> ation trying to establish a standard West Palaearctic taxonomy ? >I don't know if such a body exists. Maybe the International Rarities Committee, >or whatever the name is, could handle it. The Latin names should be standard >worldwide of course, so that's quite a project. I meant taxonomy, not records keeping. Although the latter subject also would profit by European-wide co-ordination. > .... stuff deleted ... subject changes to Finnish birding .... >> As to getting a broader public interested in birdwatching : one place to >> start would be in the conservationist movement. Surely in Finland there >There are conservation bodies, of course, but none for birds exclusively. Sure, that was your original complaint ! But they reach the biggest group of people interested in preservation and presumably in nature in general. > >There is the Association of Birding Societys which assists the ministry, >but they have very little money and only 3 employees. You are a member >of this society if you are a member of any birding society in Finland ... so you don't have to get them interested ; they already are. Although you could start a discussion in those journals and try and find somebody to publish in the preservation society's journal. > >There are two birders in Holland who have been trying to establish (since >autumn -88) a Euro Bird Net where we exchange information Why aren't these people on this newsgroup ? Surely if they know about computer networking ... Can you tell me how to contact them ? I have an Email birding contact in Holland and she never mentioned Euro BirdNet. > >I have a sister who is studying at the university in Tallahassee, she's >not into birds however. I visited Tallahassee, and the university, on >a birding trip in March -89. Pity I did not know about you then. It's mutual - the regret, I mean. I hope you did some birding while you were here. March is a great time (although April is better). I saw a Fulvous Whistling Duck (or Whistling-Duck, as the AOU would have me spell it) in March 89. > >Annika Forsten, Abo Akademi, Finland misan@ra.abo.fi We can continue by Email to save net bandwidth, if nobody else wants to take part (in the original discussion about Latin names, for instance). Daan Sandee sandee@sun6.scri.fsu.edu Supercomputer Computations Research Institute (IP: 128.186.2.102) Florida State University sandee@fsu.bitnet Tallahassee, FL 32306-4052 (904) 644-7045 sandee@fsu.mfenet
john@nmtsun.nmt.edu (John Shipman) (01/11/90)
I, for one, have greatly enjoyed the exchange between Daan Sandee (sandee@sun6.scri.fsu.edu) and Annika Forsten (misan@ra.abo.fi). Please don't move to e-mail; this exchange has been a glimpse into another world that we don't see much here. This group has pretty low volume, and for me, this discussion is highly preferable to topics like ``Biting Conures.'' Annika had a good point about how Latin names can help you learn the relationships of birds. However, be advised that the DNA-DNA hybridization work of Sibley and Alquist is currently turning this world upside down. A fascinating article in _Birding_, Volume XX, #6 (Dec. 1988) by Paul de Benedictis shows their current thinking on the beta taxonomy (arrangement of higher categories) of the checklist. Ducks and chickens have been placed together at the beginning of the list. Goatsuckers and owls are together in Order Strigiformes. Order Ciconiiformes now includes not only the herons, but also shorebirds, hawks, grebes, boobies, cormorants, pelicans, vultures, frigatebirds, loons, and tubenoses. Olive Warbler (_Peucedramus taeniatus_) is in a monotypic subfamily of Fringillidae. This is only a small fraction of the major changes Sibley and Alquist have proposed. De Benedictis finishes his article with this statement: ``As long as ornithologists want classifications to reflect phylogeny, then it will be very difficult to reject this arrangement of the birds of the world. You need not rush to change the sequence of checklists today, but don't be surprised if something very much like it is used in the Seventh Edition of the AOU Check-list.'' Daan writes: +--- | After birding all over this country for four years, I have | yet to meet one true Hispanic (meaning Spanish-speaking) | birder. If you read AB, you will see many contributors with | Spanish names: I'm sure all those have English as their | mother tongue. The millions of Spanish-speaking Americans don't | bird, apparently. Although the areas they live in are among | the most interesting in this country, birdwise. +--- I certainly agree with you about the Southwest! The birding is terrific down here. The town I live in has a population of about 8,000, of whom somewhat over half are Hispanic. I hear a lot of Spanish spoken here and quite a bit of Spanglish, too. I agree that Hispanic birders are rare, although I have met a few. I don't know why there aren't more. -- John Shipman/Zoological Data Processing/Socorro, New Mexico USENET: ucbvax!unmvax!nmtsun!john CSNET: john@nmtsun.nmt.edu ``Let's go outside and commiserate with nature.'' --Dave Farber
sandee@loligo (Daan Sandee) (01/11/90)
In article <3736@nmtsun.nmt.edu> john@nmtsun.nmt.edu (John Shipman) writes: >I, for one, have greatly enjoyed the exchange between Daan >Sandee (sandee@sun6.scri.fsu.edu) and Annika Forsten >(misan@ra.abo.fi). Please don't move to e-mail; this >exchange has been a glimpse into another world that we don't >see much here. .... Thanks ... > This group has pretty low volume, and for >me, this discussion is highly preferable to topics like >``Biting Conures.'' Hear, hear ! >Annika had a good point about how Latin names can help you >learn the relationships of birds. However, be advised that >the DNA-DNA hybridization work of Sibley and Alquist is >currently turning this world upside down. ..... >.......... Olive Warbler (_Peucedramus taeniatus_) is in a >monotypic subfamily of Fringillidae. ... remarkable ... > >De Benedictis finishes his article with this statement: >{..} don't be surprised if something very much like it is used in the >Seventh Edition of the AOU Check-list.'' If they keep to normal intervals, that takes us into the 21st century. Which should be long enough for the AOU to switch to DNA-bases taxonomy. >I certainly agree with you about the Southwest! The birding >is terrific down here. Sure, I've been there. Which reminds me. On Sept 6, I saw a Greater Pewee at El Morro National Monument. I found the bird was not on their checklist. I made a lot of noise about it, but the ranger at the visitor center didn't know anything about birds ; he had, however, a Wildlife Sighting Report form, which I filled out ; I have no idea what happened to it. I didn't bother to report the bird to the AB Regional Editor because I thought it was the just the Nat.Mon.'s checklist that was in error or out of date. But now I have the right man to ask : Is a Greater Pewee at El Morrow in the beginning of September in range, somewhat out of range, wildly out of range ? There is no question in my mind that it was a Greater Pewee. I have seen the bird in Mexico both before and since, although El Morro is my only U.S. sighting. [ Cross talk between me and a fellow birder, El Naranjo (SLP) CBC, 88/12/30: HE : Is that a Hooded, there above the cows ? Me : Where ? Don't see any cows. HE : (pointing). There, in the top of that tree. Me : Ah, got it. Looks like a Hooded [oriole]. But what you mean, cows ? HE : Don't you see ? Just a coupla branches down from the top. Finally I saw the animal he was referring to : a Greater Pewee. Which by old Mexico-hands like him is pronounced "cows" (and spelled "Coue's"). ] >-- >John Shipman/Zoological Data Processing/Socorro, New Mexico >USENET: ucbvax!unmvax!nmtsun!john CSNET: john@nmtsun.nmt.edu >``Let's go outside and commiserate with nature.'' --Dave Farber Anytime you want a computer professional to help you count birds (in the field or in the computer) just holler. I've nothing to do right now - spending my days reading rn. Daan Sandee sandee@sun6.fsu.edu Supercomputer Computations Research Institute Florida State University, Tallahassee, FL 32306-4052 (904) 644-7045
misan@ra.abo.fi (Annika Forsten DC) (01/11/90)
In article <428@fsu.scri.fsu.edu> sandee@loligo (Daan Sandee) writes: In article <MISAN.90Jan10130659@ra.abo.fi> misan@ra.abo.fi (Annika Forsten DC) writes: > After birding all over this country for four years, I have yet to meet one > true Hispanic (meaning Spanish-speaking) birder. If you read AB, you will > see many contributors with Spanish names : I'm sure all those have English > as their mother tongue. The millions of Spanish-speaking Americans don't > bird, apparently. Although the areas they live in are among the most inter- > esting in this country, birdwise. > Quebec is another matter. Although they no doubt lack the birdwatching > tradition of the English-speaking peoples, they do watch birds, and publish > about it (in French), and contribute to AB (in English). They have a rare- > bird-alert hotline in French, so they must have standardized French names > for most North American birds (after all, the hotline mostly is for reporting > non-local birds). I suppose, because birding isn't a common hobby among Hispanics, they don't get the bug from their friends, so it doesn't spread, etc. After all, most birders start birding because their friends do, and in the way their friends do it. That's probably the reason why there are so few female birders here in Finland, and fewer young boys in the US (if I've understood the matter correctly). > I meant taxonomy, not records keeping. Although the latter subject also would > profit by European-wide co-ordination. Yes, so did I. I know the chief responsibility of the IRC should be record- keeping, but they could deal with both I think, as noone else does the job otherwise. Of course it would be good the have a committee dealing with only taxonomy (more biologists?). I don't know if the IRC has done anything so far, though. > .... stuff deleted ... subject changes to Finnish birding .... > >There is the Association of Birding Societys which assists the ministry, > >but they have very little money and only 3 employees. You are a member > >of this society if you are a member of any birding society in Finland > ... so you don't have to get them interested ; they already are. Although > you could start a discussion in those journals and try and find somebody > to publish in the preservation society's journal. Sorry, I'm not sure of I or you misunderstood. The members of the Associaton of the Birding Societys already are birdwatchers (8000) and that's not nearly enough. There are a birding articles in the preservation societies' journals, but these hardly ever deal with birding or identification, just conservation issues. I have a feeling they don't promote birding very much. Also these journals are not very high quality, with few photographs. True, I could try to do something about it myself, as I am complaining, but I'm a rotten writer, especieally in Finnish (my mother tongue is Swedish). I could hold courses on birding (which I've done once) but I'm not very good at that either, besides I really don't have time to do it. Unfortunately most birders just think of themselves, they are not intresting in doing anything for their own birding society, much less for the general public. I've planned to show slides and such at 'the pensioneers club', but as I have no dead-line I never have the spare time to plan it. I've promised to teach the juniors about shorebirds, though. >> >There are two birders in Holland who have been trying to establish (since >> >autumn -88) a Euro Bird Net where we exchange information >> Why aren't these people on this newsgroup ? Surely if they know about computer > networking ... Can you tell me how to contact them ? I have an > Email birding contact in Holland and she never mentioned Euro BirdNet. Try the following: Pieter Bison bison@hnykun53 or bison@kunpv1.psych.kun.nl Rolf Deby deby@henut5 or deby@henut5.bitnet If your email contact doesn't know about Euro Bird Net, tell her to mail Pieter and join. I've no idea if Pieter of Rolf reads news, we've never discussed it. > It's mutual - the regret, I mean. I hope you did some birding while you > were here. March is a great time (although April is better). I saw a > Fulvous Whistling Duck (or Whistling-Duck, as the AOU would have me spell > it) in March 89. So did I, at Myakka River State Park. We also had a Cinnamon Teal there. If you like and can send you (or any one else who's intrested) my species-records list by mail. It's written in Tex, but even if you don't have Tex, it should be readable. My boyfriend and I spent two weeks touring the country, we visited the Keys, Everglades, Tamiami Trail, Sanibel Island, Myakka, Fort de Soto, Pine Island, St. Marks, St. Merritt Island, Kissimmee State Park, 'the prairie', Loxahatchee. Total 176 true species and 6 escapees. I got about 135 lifers. The trip was solely for birding, i.e. we spent all daylight hours in the field (or driving to the next site). Do you guys travel a lot? To Central or South America? To Europe or Africa? Elsewhere? I've done birding trips to Israel, Morocco, the Gambia, Sri Lanka, Pakistan, Siberia, Mallorca. If anyone needs any information about any of those destinations, don't hesitate to ask. Also if anyone needs information on any destinations in the world there is a birder in England, Steve Whitehouse who collects tripreports. He has lots of them, so if you are planning a trip anywhere and need information about birding the area, do contact him. He'll sell you copies of the reports for not much more than the copying price. His service is well known in Europe, have you heard of him before? The adress is: Steve Whitehouse 5 Stanway Close Blackpole Worcester WR4 9XL He issues a catalogue of the reports every year. It includes many hundred reports and costs 70p. > We can continue by Email to save net bandwidth, if nobody else wants to > take part (in the original discussion about Latin names, for instance). As noboby has disliked the conversation so far, and one vote has been given for it, let's continue until somebody protests. In December I visited Morocco, where we had 195 species, among those 1 Slender-billed Curlew (The European counterpart of Little/Eskimo Curlew?) Sorry I can't remember which American species I mean. The one that's almost extinct, like the Slender-billed. 1-4 Slender-billeds usually overwinter at Merja Zerga in Morocco. This is the only know certain winter site for the species. The area is a reserve, but hunting is allowed with a special licence (only certain species though, not Slender-billed). In front of our eyes, the one bird we saw, was shot in flight. It did not die, but broke its right leg. Incredibly bad luck, when you consider that there are tens of thousands of birds at Merja Zerga. We saw the bird shot on the 6:th, Pieter Bison saw the bird still alive, but less active than 2 other Slender-billed present on the 24:th. Hopefully it will survive, but what are the chances of its being able to fly north to breed? If I'd come to the US to watch shorebirds, which site and which time of the year would you recommend? If you are intrested I could post some of the information that comes through Euro Bird Net. Please post your views. Annika Forsten , Abo Akademi, Finland misan@ra.abo.fi
annmh@blake.acs.washington.edu (Ann Harrington) (01/13/90)
Speaking of Latin names of birds, does anyone know of a good small handbook of same? Something that would give me a common name if I knew the latin name would be very useful for certain translation assignments that I have to do. I don't need descriptions or any of the stuff that can be found in field guides, just a little handbook of latin names/english (?) names. Thanks. -Ann annmh@blake.acs.washington.edu
sandee@loligo (Daan Sandee) (01/13/90)
In article <5311@blake.acs.washington.edu> annmh@blake.acs.washington.edu (Ann Harrington) writes: >Speaking of Latin names of birds, does anyone know of a good small >handbook of same? Something that would give me a common name if I >knew the latin name would be very useful for certain translation >assignments that I have to do. I don't need descriptions or any >of the stuff that can be found in field guides, just a little >handbook of latin names/english (?) names. >-Ann >annmh@blake.acs.washington.edu a LITTLE handbook ? There are around 8,600 species of birds in the world. If you mean just the US, the Tucson Audubon Society has a handy checklist that would suit your needs. It is sorted taxonomically, not alphabetically, but with 950 species listed that shouldn't be too much of a problem. It sells for around $1.50. Call the ABA at (800) 634-7736 - they sell books over the phone. I assume you are translating serious scientific stuff. So you have to get it right. Unfortunately, for most parts of the world there isn't an authoritative English nomenclature. There are various Birds-of-the-World checklists - again, call the ABA, they'll know. Again, they're sorted taxonomically, and I wouldn't know what cross-index they have. Also, as you are at a university, the university library should have some good stuff, though probably wildly out of date. At least, that's the case with FSU. Daan Sandee sandee@sun6.scri.fsu.edu Supercomputer Computations Research Institute Florida State University, Tallahassee, FL 32306-4052 (904) 644-7045
john@nmtsun.nmt.edu (John Shipman) (01/13/90)
Ann Harrington (annmh@blake.acs.washington.edu) writes: +--- | Speaking of Latin names of birds, does anyone know of a good small | handbook of same? Something that would give me a common name if I | knew the latin name would be very useful for certain translation | assignments that I have to do. I don't need descriptions or any | of the stuff that can be found in field guides, just a little | handbook of latin names/english (?) names. +--- I couldn't tell whether you were more interested in a specific checklist of birds with both English and Latin names, or a more general work discussing etymologies, Latin roots, and so on. ``Check-list of North American Birds,'' from the Tucson Audubon Society, is small (4.25" x 7.5", 24 pages) and cheap, and seems free of typographical errors. To order, send $1.50 for one copy and $1.25 for each additional copy to: The Audubon Nature Shop Tucson Audubon Society 300 East University Boulevard, #120 Tucson, AZ 85705 A fascinating general reference is ``Composition of Scientific Words'' by Roland Wilbur Brown. My copy is (c) 1956, published by the author, and I picked it up at a used bookstore. I don't know if it's still in print, but decent libraries should have it (perhaps even on the reference shelf). Brown's book lists English, Greek, and Latin words all together. For Greek and Latin words, definitions are given. The entry for an English word gives all the Greek and Latin roots with similar meanings, and often gives examples of organisms with names derived from these roots. This is a working manual for anyone interested in decoding the names of organisms. Some examples: _Mimus_polyglottos_: mimic many-tongues (N. Mockingbird) _Eurynorhynchus_pygmeus_: broadened-snout pygmy (Spoonbill Sandpiper) _Stelgidopteryx_serripennis_: scraper-wing saw-feather (N. Rough-winged Swallow) For the few people who describe and name new organisms, this book is a necessity. A friend of mine is an ichthyologist and has described and named several sharks. For example, one form he named is a little black shark that lives in a dark environment and is very rarely seen. Using Brown's book, he came up with``melanophasma,'' the little black ghost of the deep. -- John Shipman/Zoological Data Processing/Socorro, New Mexico USENET: ucbvax!unmvax!nmtsun!john CSNET: john@nmtsun.nmt.edu ``Let's go outside and commiserate with nature.'' --Dave Farber
sandee@loligo (Daan Sandee) (01/13/90)
In article <MISAN.90Jan11133302@ra.abo.fi> misan@ra.abo.fi (Annika Forsten DC) writes: > >I suppose, because birding isn't a common hobby among Hispanics, they don't >get the bug from their friends, so it doesn't spread, etc. After all, most >birders start birding because their friends do, and in the way their friends >do it. That's probably the reason why there are so few female birders here >in Finland, and fewer young boys in the US (if I've understood the matter >correctly). You mean Finnish women can't catch the bug from male birders ?? Come on! Myself, I got it from a girlfriend, so I know it can be transmitted heterosexually. Seriously now (and at the risk of starting a sociological discussion): It's a fact that if a particular activity is very much restricted to a certain age/sex/social group pattern, this is difficult to change. The members within the group will have some resistance against outsiders, and outsiders won't feel comfortable when they get in. I'm not accusing any particular (age, sex) group of discrimination - just stating a sociological fact. A deplorable situation, but no less true. In this country, hardcore birders ("twitchers" in Europe, I think) are predominantly (but not exclusively) male. I don't think there is any sexist attitude behind this (and I'm not presenting it as an example of the previous statement). Rather, I think it is because of the element of competitiveness and challenge. In less competitive birding, on the other hand, women participate equally, I think. It is true that there is very little interest among teenagers in the US, and that is a very great pity. In the Netherlands (and I believe also in Britain) it is common to see teenage boys with binoculars and field guides ; indeed, during the vacations birding hotspots are swarming with them. (Teenage girls are extremely rare, though). I think in this country the problem is within the teenage group. Birdwatching is not regarded as a proper activity by high-school kids, and peer pressure is enormous. >> ... so you don't have to get them interested ; they already are. Although >> you could start a discussion in those journals and try and find somebody >> to publish in the preservation society's journal. > >Sorry, I'm not sure of I or you misunderstood. The members of the Associaton >of the Birding Societys already are birdwatchers (8000) and that's not nearly >enough. There are a birding articles in the preservation societies' journals, >but these hardly ever deal with birding or identification, just conservation >issues. I have a feeling they don't promote birding very much. Also these I don't think we're talking at cross purposes. This is exactly what I meant. >Pieter Bison bison@hnykun53 or bison@kunpv1.psych.kun.nl >Rolf Deby deby@henut5 or deby@henut5.bitnet thanks. ... > >My boyfriend and I spent two weeks touring the country, we visited the >Keys, Everglades, Tamiami Trail, Sanibel Island, Myakka, Fort de Soto, >Pine Island, St. Marks, St. Merritt Island, Kissimmee State Park, >'the prairie', Loxahatchee. Total 176 true species and 6 escapees. >I got about 135 lifers. The trip was solely for birding, i.e. we spent >all daylight hours in the field (or driving to the next site). Very good ! From which I understand that this was your first trip to the US. > >Do you guys travel a lot? To Central or South America? To Europe or Africa? >Elsewhere? I've done birding trips to Israel, Morocco, the Gambia, Sri Lanka, >Pakistan, Siberia, Mallorca. There's a fair amount of world birding being done from the US. Lots of organizations offer tours (as you know, because you read the same journals), and there are some good books. Myself, I've never done it. Partly because it sounds a bit to strenuous ; partly because I don't like the idea of visiting a completely strange birding world with too little time to see enough of it. I prefer to do it slow and thorough. After 4 years of hard work in the US, I'm beginning to reach the point of exhaustion there - lifers are farther and farther between. Recently I have made some trips to Mexico, which has enough similarity to the US that I can handle the strange birds ; also, there are some good books, targeted at the US birder. But I don't think I will ever exhaust Mexico. I haven't exhausted Europe either, my birding there has been in bits and pieces. Sooner or later (and if I can't find a job, it could turn out to be sooner) I will go back, and I may then take it up more seriously. >In December I visited Morocco, where we had 195 species, among those 1 >Slender-billed Curlew (The European counterpart of Little/Eskimo Curlew?) Eskimo Curlew. One of those that is assumed extinct but every few years there is a sighting. > >If I'd come to the US to watch shorebirds, which site and which time of >the year would you recommend? Others have answered this one. I'm not am allround expert on where-to-bird, but: For ease of access, East coast between NY and DC. There's a whole row of wildlife refuges between Jamaica Bay and Cape May. Early May, late August. Texas Coast at Galveston. (You might even get that Eskimo Curlew). West Coast, both close to LA and close to San Francisco, there are some good places ; but I think there is some place in Oregon that is even better (Tillamook Bay ? Some such name. I can look it up, if you want.) > >If you are intrested I could post some of the information that comes >through Euro Bird Net. Please post your views. If it's just a regular BITNET/EARN mailing list, I could subscribe to it myself, and would prefer that ; assuming the ***** at the computer center haven't scr*wed up my BITNET feed. If somebody tells me how. > >Annika Forsten , Abo Akademi, Finland misan@ra.abo.fi Daan Sandee sandee@sun6.scri.fsu.edu Supercomputer Computations Research Institute (IP: 128.186.2.102) Florida State University sandee@fsu.bitnet Tallahassee, FL 32306-4052 (904) 644-7045 sandee@fsu.mfenet
rcb33483@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (R C. Buchmann) (01/14/90)
In article <448@fsu.scri.fsu.edu> sandee@loligo.UUCP (Daan Sandee) writes: (??: References unclear) >It is true that there is very little interest among teenagers in the US, >and that is a very great pity. In the Netherlands (and I believe also in >Britain) it is common to see teenage boys with binoculars and field guides ; >indeed, during the vacations birding hotspots are swarming with them. >(Teenage girls are extremely rare, though). I think in this country the >problem is within the teenage group. Birdwatching is not regarded as a >proper activity by high-school kids, and peer pressure is enormous. I agree. I was a teenage birder, so I had already committed one mortal sin. But I also showed a career interest in birds, so I was the target of a tremendous amount of abuse. However it didn't bother me. Why? I was intelligent and eccentric to begin with (e.g. I used "big words", didn't go to parties, etc.) and so I was cast out of teenage society from the beginning. However, I never gave in to peer pressure (another mortal sin) and so the abuse I received from my peers didn't increase, but merely changed subject. However, after six years of it, I was really glad to get away to college. Perhaps the secret of getting more teenaged birders here is to look for outcasts... I would also like to point out that it is a great irony that, although birding is such a popular sport in Europe, there really isn't much of an environmental movement there (yet!). Hunting runs rampant in many parts of Europe, and birds usually suffer the worst. Yet here, although most teenagers don't bird, once thwey hit college, many begin to see the light, and so there is a growing environmental movement here, and hunting, since the Migratory Bird Treaty, has *never* been as bad as it is in Europe. -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- R. Cody Buchmann ^.^ "Kehaar" email: rcb33483@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu "Now I fly for you..." - Watership Down ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
pratt@paul.rutgers.edu (Lorien Y. Pratt) (01/14/90)
The recent discussion on different styles of birding and on nomenclature
reminded me of the following article, which I've dug from my files and typed
in because I thought you might be interested...
``A lark of a way to see the world''
by John Leo
It is time for a personal confession. I am a birder. With three accomplices,
I have spent the last 10 days chasing birds in the deserts and mountains of
southeast Arizona. Along the way, I drove 2,140 miles, blew two tires (which
the Hertz people were very nice about), got myself punctured by cactuses six
or seven times and logged 1557 species of birds, including 17 ``lifers,'' ones
that I had never seen before.
My 600th North American life bird, the buff-breasted flycatcher, came in the
Huachucas atop my favorite kind of mountain -- the kind you drive right to
the peak of to see the bird, then jump back swiftly into air-conditioned
comfort. There were, alas, one or two ``death marches,'' the semiofficial
birding term for treks so long and arduous that the birder begins to imagine
his own tombstone, reading ``He passed to a better world while looking for a
five-striped sparrow,'' with the final life list of the recently departed
respectfully engraved below. Every so often a birder is hauled out of some
remote gulch on a stretcher, and the descent into Sycamore Canyon for the
rare rufous-capped warebler a couple of years ago was such a horror that
``survivor'' T-shirts were printed for those who had lived to tell the tale.
Birding at this level is, of course, an obsession. Imagine the plight of a
nonbirder married to someone whose idea of fun is a half hour debate on the
wing vermioulations of the Western Wood-pewee. Or perhaps a leisurely
2-hour family drive with bird calls playing on the tape deck. Vacations can
be a problem, too, since the nonbirding spouse may not be automatically
drawn to swamps, sewage ponds and garbage dumps at 5 o'clock in the morning.
Like many birders, I have a detailed knowledge of American sewage-treatment
facilities and landfills -- the splendid Toytown dump in St. Petersburg, for
instance -- but only a hazy awareness of the cities and towns where they are
located.
``Down to earth.'' Most driven birders are able to cloak their quirks
and simulate normal life, which includes, among other things, not
showing up for indoor dinner parties wearing binoculars, and looking
people in the eye instead of scanning the sky behind them for hawks or
eagles. Still, the addictive quality of birding, which may yet produce
Birders Anonymous, keeps poking through. Some men, including
professionals, have chucked careers to follow the birds, sometimes as
tour guides, sometimes as just the birding equivalent of ski bums. At
a breakfast in Texas a few years ago after a birding event, a brilliant
young birder was talking about giving up his career as an English
professor, and Roger Tory Peterson was trying to talk him out of it.
Peterson said, you can't just give your whole life to birds. The
birder said, ``Why not? You did,'' and Peterson replied, ``yes, but
you have to be first''.
This tendency seems to be primarily a male affliction. In general, the sexes
take to birding in different ways. Women tend to focus on the beauty and
grace of birds. Men feel that sense of awe, too, but they are much more
likely to be driven by the need to hunt and collect (keep a list), making
birding a close relative of bubble-gum-card collecting, chase games and the
more financial kind of avarice that fills our newspapers these days. Though
some of the best and most aggressive birders are female, about 90 percent of
those who report life lists to the American Birding Association are male.
This helps give modern birding a macho quality that is not to everyone's
taste, and there are sometimes tensions between casual, or normal, birders and
their aggressive brethren.
In 1980, before the current boom in birding, the Fish and Wildlife Service
reported that the United STates had a hard core of 2 million commmitted
birders, able to identify a hundred or more birds on sight, an additional 5
million fairly committed people who recognize 40 or more species, plus 53
million casual birders, presumably including just about everyone who has ever
glanced out th window oat a chickadee. Surprising as those numbers may seem,
they are probably much higher today.
With the spread of birding has come the spread of sophisticated identification
and tracking skills. Many birders know the range, calls and behavior of most
of the 850 or so species recorded on the continent. This is one reason why
birders and hunters tend to get along well. When Tommy Glenn, owner of the
Freeway Exxon station in Willcox, fixed our flat, we noticed that on one of his
shelves, he had a stuffed pair of Montezuma quail (Mern's quail to hunters).
Like Tom, I knew about the swerving flight of the quali and its curious
tendency to pair off in May but not mate until July. But for me, this was
book learning -- I had never seen the bird. Two days later, coming down out
of the mountains on Memorial Day with every bird I wanted except the elusive
quail, I stopped in at Freeway Exxon. AFter 10 minutes of chatting and
joking, I told Tom I really wanted the bird. ``Have lunch; I'll go get my
dogs,'', he said. We drove a long way, past Chochise's stronghold in the
Dragoons, past Helen's Dome, a loaf-shaped rock that Helen Riggs jumped from
rather than take her chances with the Apache. Two of Tom's friends joined us,
and with six men and three dogs, the quail never had a chance. Life bird No.
605, filed under serendipity and the extraordinary kindness of strangers. We
birders are very fussy about nomenclature, but in my notes, that quail will
always be known as Mern's, not Montezuma, in honor of Tom the hunter.
From the ON BEHAVIOR column, U.S. News and World Report, June 12, 1989
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L. Y. Pratt Computer Science Department
pratt@paul.rutgers.edu Rutgers University
Hill Center
(201) 932-4634 New Brunswick, NJ 08901misan@ra.abo.fi (Annika Forsten DC) (01/15/90)
In article <448@fsu.scri.fsu.edu> sandee@loligo (Daan Sandee) writes: > You mean Finnish women can't catch the bug from male birders ?? Come on! > Myself, I got it from a girlfriend, so I know it can be transmitted > heterosexually. It is possible of course, it just seems to happen very seldom. Some birders have their girlfriends and wives along with them, but the female is usually not very knowledgable nor intrested. She just likes to be out-of-doors. Of the few couples I know where both are good birders, the woman was birding before she met her man. One reason for the few women is probably that while the man easily gets time of, the woman tends to feel more responsible for the home and the kids, consequently she doesn't have time to get intrested in birding. Which is why I wont get myself any kids. I know of one Finnish male birder who took the parent leave for a year instead of his wife to look after their newborn. But did he stay at home because of this? NO, he took the baby with him birding, almost every day. > In this country, hardcore birders ("twitchers" in Europe, I think) are I'm not sure what you mean by hardcore birder. I assume you mean someone who takes birding very seriously, i.e. spends a lot of time in the field and learning about birds. Twitcher, on the other hand, is someone who chases rare birds that someone else has found. It is quite possible to be both, but a twitcher does not neccessarily know very much about birds, he just has to tick them. > predominantly (but not exclusively) male. I don't think there is any > sexist attitude behind this (and I'm not presenting it as an example > of the previous statement). Rather, I think it is because of the element > of competitiveness and challenge. > In less competitive birding, on the other hand, women participate equally, > I think. Hear, hear. > It is true that there is very little interest among teenagers in the US, > and that is a very great pity. In the Netherlands (and I believe also in > Britain) it is common to see teenage boys with binoculars and field guides ; > indeed, during the vacations birding hotspots are swarming with them. > (Teenage girls are extremely rare, though). I think in this country the > problem is within the teenage group. Birdwatching is not regarded as a > proper activity by high-school kids, and peer pressure is enormous. In Finland too, most birders start before they are 20. Many schools have nature or bird clubs in which birding is promoted at an early age. It is also quite accepted as a hobby, I can't imagine anyone being mobbed for being a birder. > Very good ! From which I understand that this was your first trip to the US. Yes, the first birding trip. > If it's just a regular BITNET/EARN mailing list, I could subscribe to it > myself, and would prefer that ; assuming the ***** at the computer center > haven't scr*wed up my BITNET feed. If somebody tells me how. Sorry, it isn't, not yet anyway. The coordinator of each country just sends e-mail to the coordinators in the other countries, in general a few times each month. So the total number of messages would certainly not exceed 10/month. Annika Forsten , Abo Akademi, Finland misan@ra.abo.fi