rob@boulder.colorado.edu (Rob Savoye) (11/29/88)
At the Sun catalyst conference a few weeks ago they anounced "Sunview
2.0". Sunview 2 is a sunview compatible toolkit that runs on X.11 (or
X.11/NeWS). One guy I talked to had ported View 2 (as they like to call
it) to a microvax and was running textedit. It is about 95% the same as
sunview 1.x and the few changes can be done using global search and
replace. It is also a full implementation of the Open Look spec. So and
re-compiles give you push pins and the other stuff. Now for the bad news.
View 2 will not be available to developers for 8-9 months. (ouch) Sun is
considering making the toolkit code available to developers so it can be
ported to other platforms running X.11.
Rob Savoye
Topologix, Inc.
4860 Ward Rd.
Denver, CO 80033
(303) 421-7700
uucp: ..!uunet!topologix!rob
..!hao!boulder!snowwhite!robchuck@wooglin.scc.com (Charles Williams) (11/29/88)
>We were informed that Sun has a product (maybe in beta test) that provided >a Sunview tookit for X.... The product you refer to is Sunview II. It is an X toolkit that will sit on top of Sun's X/NeWS product. Sun is also working on an Open Look toolkit. The only reason for Sunview II is all of the Sunview applications that are already out there. From what I hear, if you have the time and money, I would strongly consider rewriting the applications with the Open Look toolkit as Sunview II executables will be **HHUUGGEE!!** [[ They're already *HUGE*. How much "huger" can they get? --wnl ]] Anyway, word I heard is that this product line should be out in Q2 '89. If there is anyone from Sun who wants to confirm, deny, or update, feel free. Chuck Williams Contel Federal Systems <Standard Disclaimer>
chuck@trantor.harris-atd.com (Chuck Musciano) (11/29/88)
The recent issue of SunTechnology says that View 2 is an implementation of SunView on X, to be run under the combined X11/NeWS server, which I had heard would be available with 4.1. How's that for a definitive answer? Chuck Musciano Advanced Technology Department Harris Corporation (407) 727-6131 ARPA: chuck@trantor.harris-atd.com
brian@sun.com (Brian Raymor - TSE Sun Washington DC) (12/02/88)
Richard Probst, the manager for View2, posted the following message to the window news groups. brian In separate messages, Antonio Romero and Roderick Sprattling asked about porting SunView applications to X11. The easiest way to move SunView applications to X11 is to hope that someone else will port the SunView toolkit to X11, with as much source compatibility as possible. That is exactly what Sun has done. The second version of SunView, called View2, is an X11 toolkit currently in alpha test by application developers within Sun. View2 uses Xlib, but not the Xt intrinsics. That is, it is not a set of widgets. Instead, we took the existing SunView code and moved it onto Xlib. The benefit of this is that we kept a high degree of source compatibility. SunView applications can be converted to View2 applications in a small number of days. We did not strive for full recompile-&-go source compatibility, because moving to a network window system does introduce some unavoidable changes, but the conversion is simple and fairly mechanical. Many Sun applications have been converted and are being tested. View2-based tools are now up and running on Sun3, Sun4, Sun386i, and on a microVax in our engineering lab. On the Suns, View2 runs on top of X11/NeWS. On the microVax, View2 runs on top of X11R3. Sun will not ship the microVax port; it was done purely to demonstrate portability. View2 provides the OPEN LOOK user interface. To get full OPEN LOOK on the screen, you also need to use an OPEN LOOK window manager. View2-based tools can work with other window managers, such as uwm, but do not then look like the OPEN LOOK spec (and since Sun has adopted OPEN LOOK as our UI policy, we don't intend to test this configuration). View2 communicates with a window manager according to the ICCCM draft standard. To dispel possible confusion, note that there are several toolkits implementing the OPEN LOOK user interface. OPEN LOOK is a spec, not a toolkit. Other announced OPEN LOOK toolkits are Xt+ from AT&T, and NDE (which runs on top of the NeWS side of X11/NeWS). The View2 libraries will ship with the X11/NeWS server in 1989. Beta sites have already been selected and contacted. --Richard Probst (rprobst@sun.com) Manager for SunView and View2
chuck@trantor.harris-atd.com (Chuck Musciano) (12/16/88)
> SunView applications can be converted to View2 > applications in a small number of days. We did not strive for full > recompile-&-go source compatibility, because moving to a network window > system does introduce some unavoidable changes, but the conversion is > simple and fairly mechanical. > View2 provides the OPEN LOOK user interface. "Simple and mechanical" are, of course, in the eyes of the mechanic. I was told in Miami that the move to OpenLook would completely change the size and appearance of gadgets and such. For tools which are carefully laid out (as most of mine are), you will have to redesign the panels. This is less than "mechanical" as anyone who has done it knows. On a similar note, how about a round of opinions from everyone at the SUG who saw OpenLook. I know I have some specific complaints about the interface. [[ Yeah. I hate jumping cursors! If I want my cursor "over there", I'll move the mouse myself, thank you. This is, of course, a matter of personal taste. But Open Look depends on the ability to jump the cursor to such a degree that providing the ability to turn it off doesn't make much sense. --wnl ]] Chuck Musciano Advanced Technology Department Harris Corporation (407) 727-6131 ARPA: chuck@trantor.harris-atd.com
mlandau@bbn.com (Matt Landau) (12/25/88)
In comp.sys.sun (<2347@kalliope.rice.edu>), Our Faithful Moderator writes: > >[[ Yeah. I hate jumping cursors! If I want my cursor "over there", I'll >move the mouse myself, thank you. This is, of course, a matter of >personal taste. Interesting. I used to have the same opinion about warping the pointer, until I used a 386i for a while. After a couple of days getting used to it, I really came to like the way the pointer warps to the appropriate button when a confirmation box pops up then warps back when you're done with the transient dialog. I had the same experience with stay-up menus; after getting over the novelty, I decided I liked them quite a lot. (Of course, my SunView root menu is 8 items long by 5 layers deep...) I still find it evil to warp the pointer into windows when you open them, though -- for me, pointer warp only works when your attention is required somewhere else for just a minute, then you return to what you were doing.