telecom@bu-cs.bu.edu (01/29/89)
[Moderator's Note: The information which follows, up to the next
note from myself, was provided by Starlink, and Denia Bennett-Howard
(Portal handle: 'pooka'). My thanks for this detailed chart. PT]
A COMPARISON OF STARLINK AND PC PURSUIT
The following list compares STARLINK's outdial access points
with those of Telenet. These are the actual cities you can reach
by accessing your local dial-in node and issuing the outdial
command. As you can see, there are many more STARLINK outdials
than there are Telenet outdials. In addition, with STARLINK, you
are not restricted to the actual outdial city. You can precede
the number to be dialed with a "1" and call any BBS in that area
code. You will be billed for the long distance call from the
outdial port to the host computer at the local phone company's
rates.
Outdial Host Numbers Sorted by Time Zone, State,
Eastern Time Zone -----------
State/ Tymnet Outdial Telenet Node
City Host # Area Code Access Point
--------------- ------ --------- ------------
Connecticut
Bloomfield 9128 203
Hartford 9128 203 D/CTHAR/12
Stamford 9129 203
D.C
Washington 2262 703 D/DCWAS/3/12/24
Florida
Fort Lauderdale 7123 305 m
Jacksonville 5797 904 m
Longwood 7096 305 m
Miami 6582 305 D/FLMIA/3/12/24
Orlando 7096 305 m
Tampa 5518 813 m D/FLTAM/3/12/24
Georgia
Atlanta 8795 404 D/GAATL/3/12/24
Doraville 8795 404
Marietta 8795 404
Norcross 8795 404
Indiana
Indianapolis 9349 317
Maryland
Baltimore 4600 301
Massachusetts
Boston 8796 617 D/MABOS/3/12/24
Cambridge 8796 617
New Jersey
Camden 8693 609 m
Englewood Cliffs 6319 201 m
Newark 7618 201 D/NJNEW/3/12/24
Pennsauken 8693 609 m
Princeton 8920 609
South Brunswick 8920 609
New York
Albany 9192 518 m
Buffalo 9194 716 m
Melville 8811 516 m
New York 1059 212 D/NYNYO/3/12/24
(for 718, must use 1718
+ phone number)
Pittsford 6019 716
Rochester 6019 716
White Plains 8571 914
North Carolina
Charlotte 6793 704
Research Triangle Park, NC 919 D/NCRTP/3/12
Ohio
Akron 8740 216 m
Cincinnati 1785 513
Cleveland 4222 216 D/OHCLE/3/12/24
Columbus 9347 614
Dayton 9511 513 m
Pennsylvania
Philadelphia 9581 215 D/PAPHI/3/12/24
Pittsburgh 7408 412
Rhode Island
Providence 9130 401
Virginia
Alexandria 2262 703 D/DCWAS/3/12/24
Arlington 2262 703 D/DCWAS/3/12/24
Fairfax 2262 703
Midlothian 7339 804 m
Norfolk 6986 804 m
Portsmouth 6986 804 m
Central Time Zone -----------
Alabama
Birmingham 4101 205
Illinois
Chicago 8257 312 D/ILCHI/3/12/24
Glen Ellyn 8944 312 m (for 815, must use
1815 + phone number)
Kansas
Wichita 8013 316 m
Michigan
Detroit 8794 313 D/MIDET/3/12/24
Minnesota
Minneapolis 3494 612 D/MNMIN/3/12
St. Paul 3494 612
Missouri
Bridgeton 8978 314
Independence 8615 913
Kansas City 8615 913 D/MOKCI/3/12/24
St. Louis 8978 314 D/MOSLO/3
(for 618, must use
1618 + phone number)
Nebraska
Omaha 2521 402 m
Oklahoma
Oklahoma City 9165 405
Tulsa 6605 918
Tennessee
Memphis 1551 901 m
Nashville 9141 615
Texas
Arlington 9337 817
Dallas 2948 214 D/TXDAL/3/12/24
(for 817, must use 817
+ phone number)
Fort Worth 9337 817
Houston 4562 713
San Antonio 9169 512
Wisconsin
Brookfield 9167 414
Milwaukee 9167 414 D/WIMIL/3/12/24
Mountain Time Zone ----------
Arizona
Mesa 9532 602
Phoenix 9532 602 D/AZPHO/3/12
Tucson 4751 602 m & SpStnaJct calls must
use 1 + phone number
[see coverage.txt])
Colorado
Aurora 2584 303
Boulder 2584 303
Denver 2584 303 D/CODEN/3/12/24
Utah
Salt Lake City ---- 801 D/UTSLC/3/12/24
Pacific Time Zone -----------
California
Alhambra 9204 818 m
Anaheim 9184 714
Colton, CA ---- 714 D/CACOL/3/12/24
El Segundo 9203 203 m
Glendale, CA ---- 818 D/CAGLE/12
Long Beach 9205 213 m
Los Angeles, CA ---- 213 D/CALAN/3/12/24
Newport Beach 9184 714
Oakland 8963 415 D/CAOAK/3/12/24
Palo Alto, CA ---- 415 D/CAPAL/12
Pasadena 9204 818 m
Pleasanton 9202 415 m
Sacramento 9179 916 D/CASAC/3/12/24
San Diego, CA ---- 619 D/CASDI/3/12/24
San Francisco 9533 415 D/CASFA/3/12/24
San Jose 6450 408 D/CASJO/12
Santa Ana, CA ---- 714 D/CASAN/12
Sherman Oaks 9206 818 m
Vernon 3173 213
Walnut Creek 9202 415 m
Oregon
Portland, OR ---- 503 D/ORPOR/3/12
Washington
Bellevue 9170 206
Seattle 9170 206 D/WASEA/3
FOREIGN ACCESS:
The following countries have direct dial-in access to STARLINK:
CANADA
ALBERTA:Calgary
BRITISH COLUMBIA:Burnaby,Vancouver
ONTARIO:Kitchner,Ottawa,Toronto,Windsor
QUEBEC:Montreal,Quebec City, Ville St. Laurent
(Off peak rates from these cities is billed at $4.00 per hour.)
(Other Canadian cities can reach STARLINK via DataPac.)
UNITED KINGDOM: (Via Mercury) London
(Off peak access from London is billed at $10.00 per hour.)
For more information about STARLINK, call 804-495-INFO by modem or
804-495-4693 by voice.
[Moderator's Note: As you can see, there are several places reachable via
Starlink/Tymnet not reachable by PCP and vice versa. PCP seems to be
especially heavy in California, where Starlink has somewhat less coverage
in that state. However, Starlink allows calls to Canada and the UK,
something Telenet absolutely forbids.
The folks at Starlink operate their own Information Service/BBS/Chat at
the 804-495-INFO number. One nice thing about it is they give UPI at no
extra surcharge. They also offer hookups to Reuter News Service, the
Official Airline Guide and a travel/hotel/car rental reservations system.
My understanding is that the $10 per month or $25 per month fee, which
allows purchase of Starlink at $1.50 per hour or $1.00 per hour respectively,
also gives you a certain amount of free time on their own system. Of
course, you have to use Starlink to call them, and pay for the Starlink
time.
Another point which troubles me a little is their use of somewhat misleading
or out of context statements describing the cost of their service versus the
new rates at PCP. In messages which discuss 'how much you will save' by
using their service at $25 plus $1 per hour versus PCP, they are saying that
PCP will charge $4.50 per hour after 30 hours, which is only correct if you
do not purchase *multiple accounts from Telenet at 30X30*. Quite obviously,
two or three accounts from PCP at 30X30 is only $60 or $90 per month. The
same 60 hours at Starlink would be either $10+(1.50x60=90)+$100 per month
or $25+(1x60=60)=$85 per month, depending on how you pay for it. 90 hours
per month would be $10+(1.50x90=135)=$145 per month or $25+(1x90=90)=$115
per month.
For heavy users then, multiple accounts with Telenet would still be cheaper
than Starlink at $60 on PCP versus $85/$100 on Starlink. The latter is only
a bargain for the very casual user of less than around 20 hours per month
or the user who wishes to call Canada or the UK. I will get a Starlink
account as a supplement to my PCP account and use it for places not served
by PCP. And of course, Tymnet/Starlink addressing is much easier; just a
four digit number gets your connection versus the longer Telenet scheme.
Finally, Starlink allows the placement of calls via an outdial modem to
a point outside the local calling zone. Telenet does not. With some clever
planning, you can use a nearby outdial to call anywhere. Starlink told me
the surcharge for this would be 110% of telco. Starlink versus PCP? You
will have to decide, based on your own use and applications. P. Townson]David_W_Tamkin@harvard.harvard.edu (02/03/89)
Patrick Townson commented on Nia Bennett's comparison of Starlink and PCP: B> You can precede the number to be dialed with a "1" and call any BBS in that B> area code. You will be billed for the long distance call from the outdial B> port to the host computer at the local phone company's rates. Is the 1 needed for Starlink or is Ms. Bennett thinking of how things work in area code 804, where telcos require it for non-local intra-NPA calls? B> Outdial Host Numbers Sorted by Time Zone, State, They still copy Tymnet Information's error in placing Detroit in the Central Zone. I've pointed that out to Nia. B> California B> Alhambra 9204 818 m B> Anaheim 9184 714 B> Colton, CA ---- 714 D/CACOL/3/12/24 B> El Segundo 9203 203 m B> Glendale, CA ---- 818 D/CAGLE/12 B> Long Beach 9205 213 m B> Los Angeles, CA ---- 213 D/CALAN/3/12/24 B> Newport Beach 9184 714 B> Oakland 8963 415 D/CAOAK/3/12/24 B> Palo Alto, CA ---- 415 D/CAPAL/12 B> Pasadena 9204 818 m B> Pleasanton 9202 415 m B> Sacramento 9179 916 D/CASAC/3/12/24 B> San Diego, CA ---- 619 D/CASDI/3/12/24 B> San Francisco 9533 415 D/CASFA/3/12/24 B> San Jose 6450 408 D/CASJO/12 B> Santa Ana, CA ---- 714 D/CASAN/12 B> Sherman Oaks 9206 818 m B> Vernon 3173 213 B> Walnut Creek 9202 415 m The California list seems to show a lot of gaps for Starlink, but notice that the Vernon and El Segundo outdialers cover the territory of CALAN; that Alhambra/Pasadena and Sherman Oaks cover that of CAGLE; that Anaheim and Newport Beach cover that of CACOL and CASAN; that CAPAL's territory is reachable from the Walnut Creek Tymnet outdialer. There are, to my knowledge, only four PCP cities not covered by Tymnet's outdialers: NCRTP, UTSLC, ORPOR, and CASDI. T> However, Starlink allows calls to Canada and the UK, something Telenet T> absolutely forbids. Starlink allows calls *from* Canada via Tymnet Canada's indials and *from* the UK via Mercury's indials. They also take calls from ConnNet indials to Tymnet, so they are a local call everywhere in Connecticut. Nia has told me that a Starlink account can access any domestic DAF connected to Tymnet (though you may get a separate billing from the DAF provider). I don't know whether international addresses are surcharged or locked out. T> My understanding is that the $10 per month or $25 per month fee, which T> allows purchase of Starlink at $1.50 per hour or $1.00 per hour respectively T> also gives you a certain amount of free time on their own system. Of T> course, you have to use Starlink to call them, and pay for the Starlink T> time. Galaxy BBS charges $2 per hour, but the first two hours each month are free for Starlink customers. Their explanation is that two hours is an allowance for Starlink customers to check their current billing and keep up with news and announcements. PCP gives no way to check on running usage. Another point Starlink advertises is that they can get you a new password in fifteen minutes. (It would be better yet if Starlink account holders could log into Galaxy BBS and change their own passwords, but it's still an improvement over PCP, except that PCP staffers frequently bend the rules and give you a new password, for better or worse, over the phone.) T> Finally, Starlink allows the placement of calls via an outdial modem to T> a point outside the local calling zone. Telenet does not. With some clever T> planning, you can use a nearby outdial to call anywhere. Starlink told me T> the surcharge for this would be 110% of telco. 100% or 110%? There is a discrepancy here. At any rate, *Tymnet*, not Starlink, appears to restrict these to calls within the area code, since Tymnet Information's description of the outdial service states that you must use an outidaler in the same area code as the number you want to reach. David_W_Tamkin@cup.portal.com ... sun!portal!cup.portal.com!David_W_Tamkin
kings@utflis (David A. Kingsland) (02/03/89)
I would take exception to the moderators comment about "Starlink allowing calls to Canada and the United Kingdom" Tymnet (and so Starlink) allows calls *FROM* Canada and the UK *TO* anywhere in the 48 states. We have not implemented the outdial service here in Canada because there hasn't been enough demand.
tanner@bikini.cis.ufl.edu (02/03/89)
The area codes shown on the comparison appear bogus. Neither
Longwood nor Orlando are in 305 any more. The northern part of 305
got split off and is now 407.
Dr. T. Andrews, Systems
CompuData, Inc. DeLand
PS: Longwood? Come on, why not just say Sanford. No one outside
of the area is likely to know where Longwood is.
---
...!bikini.cis.ufl.edu!ki4pv!tanner ...!bpa!cdin-1!cdis-1!ki4pv!tanner
or... {allegra killer gatech!uflorida decvax!ucf-cs}!ki4pv!tannertelecom@bu-cs.BU.EDU (TELECOM Moderator) (02/04/89)
Both Mssrs. Tamkin and Kingsland pointed out something which I missed in my initial, admittedly quick evaluation of Starlink: International calls can be made *from* the UK and Canada, not *to* those countries. Tamkin asks for clarification on the surcharges for calls made from the Tymnet outdialers: Several months ago I made a call to Tymnet when I was considering signing up with them. At that time, their sales representative discussed the use of the outdialers with me, and quoted me the 110% of telco rate. He said I would pay for the phone call, and a 'surcharge' for the billing and extra record keeping which had to be done. When I was in chat last Sunday morning with the fellow at Starlink, we discussed the outdialers, and he said Starlink customers would be billed for any phone calls made from the outdialers outside the local calling area. I briefly mentioned to him my conversation of several months earlier and the 110 percent quote from Tymnet, and if I am not mistaken, he responded by saying, 'Tymnet may put some small surcharge on the phone call'. Using that as my authority, and remembering the earlier comments of the Tymnet representative, I beleive the effective charge will be 110 percent, that is, unless Starlink has some other arrangement with Tymnet on this point allowing phone calls to be handled at no extra surcharge above the cost of the call itself. A problem I see with the use of the outdialers to make extended area calls is that only on rare occassions is an intra-state call going to be less expensive than an interstate one. That is, a call from San Jose to a nearby (but considered long distance) town in California will easily cost me the same thirteen cents per minute that calling from Chicago via Reach Out would cost. And, I would be paying for the Tymnet circuit also. I think at the very least you could expect charges of 10-15 cents per minute on any intra-state call. My reaction is that this 'feature' of Tymnet's service is not particularly valuable, considering how inexpensive long haul interstate calls have become at night. The $10 minimum fee per month on Starlink is attractive for persons who use this type of thing no more than 12-13 hours per month. As I pointed out in my previous message, 60 hours on PC Pursuit is $60; the same 60 hours on Starlink is either $85 or $100, depending on the package you choose. If international calls outbound from the States were allowed -- apologies for my earlier misreading of this! -- then Starlink's 'pay per hour for what you use' plan would be valuable, since Telenet does not offer international calls to PC'ers regardless of what we are willing to pay. To access my mailbox on West Germany's [Tele-Box Mail Service], I now dial direct via AT&T. Likewise, for my occassional visits on Mercury, I dial direct to the UK. Too bad neither Telenet nor Tymnet will market this service; they certainly have the circuits available. Without the international access to UK and Canada, Starlink actually becomes less valuable to me, and as I said earlier, dialing an intra-state call from an outdialer is not where one will find any savings. I'm still waiting for my package to show up from Starlink (it has been a week), and when it arrives I will sign up, but probably confine my usage to the places not served by Telenet. Again, those phone numbers to call for more information or to signup: Voice 804-495-4693 Modem 804-495-INFO They bill to various credit cards, and they also offer a 'check-free' option. The fellow I spoke with last Sunday was most cordial, and spent about an hour in chat with me, discussing Starlink. Patrick Townson