[comp.dcom.telecom] No More Listening in on Cordless Phones in California

"John R. Covert 14-Aug-1990 2201" <covert@covert.enet.dec.com> (08/15/90)

The California Senate has passed and sent to the governor a bill
(AB3457) which gives conversations over cordless telephones the same
legal protections from eavesdroppers as wire phone conversations.

It makes it a misdemeanor, and in some cases a felony, to intercept
cordless telephone call without the consent of the parties.

The bill also bans manufacture, sale, and possession of any device
enabling the user to intercept such communications.  It provides for
penalties from one year in county jail to three years in state prison
with fines of up to $2,500.

Don't these people realize that all you need to intercept a cordless
phone call is another cordless phone?


john

kam@dlogics.COM (Kevin Mitchell) (08/16/90)

In article <10925@accuvax.nwu.edu>, covert@covert.enet.dec.com (John
R. Covert writes:

> Don't these people realize that all you need to intercept a cordless
> phone call is another cordless phone?

Or, you can use any good scanner. My Radio Shack PRO-34 sometimes
stops on cordless phone frequencies -- they're crammed in between
frequencies for other VHF services.

Also, since a radio receiver can sometimes receive images offset by
twice the Intermediate Frequency (10.7 MHz on the PRO-34, for an image
offset of 21.4 MHz), I find it hard to search the 800 MHz public
service bands for all the images of cellular calls that crop up there.
(You get the image only if there isn't a stronger signal on the
desired frequency).

The PRO-34's come with the cellular range locked out. Changing the
programming to avoid the few cordless frequencies hiding among other
stuff would be prohibitive.

My opinion on the matter are that other's phone calls are pretty
boring and mundane anyway. Most of the cellular trash images that show
up are either (1) Ringing tones, (2) somebody's answering machine
message, or (3) "Honey I'll be a few minutes late." Federal law
prohibits divulging the content in any case, or using the information
received to commit a crime (spelled out in big bold letters on the
first page of the {Police Call} frequency directory).


Kevin A. Mitchell                (312) 266-4485
Datalogics, Inc                  Internet: kam@dlogics.UUCP
441 W. Huron                     UUCP: ..!uunet!dlogics!kam
Chicago, IL  60610               FAX: (312) 266-4473


[Moderator's Note: Actually, people who have done modifications to the
PRO-34 to expand the coverage in the 800 megs range have discovered
that in the process of moving a diode on the board, they lose all of
the 30-50 meg (low VHF) range as a result. Highly illegal to make the
mods in the first place, of course.  PAT]

John Higdon <john@bovine.ati.com> (08/17/90)

John R. Covert <covert@covert.enet.dec.com> writes:

> The bill also bans manufacture, sale, and possession of any device
> enabling the user to intercept such communications.  It provides for
> penalties from one year in county jail to three years in state prison
> with fines of up to $2,500.

Wouldn't this be a little tough to enforce at a state level? You don't
suppose they never heard of "mail order"? Besides, I thought all of
this was under the auspices of the FCC, and that states and
municipalities had no jurisdiction over the airwaves. And, once again,
what about continuously tuned radios?

By the time everyone gets their "protected" status, the only kind of
receiver the public will be able to buy will be for broadcast
transmissions. Judging from the state of broadcasting these days, it
won't be long before interest wanes in these as well.

> Don't these people realize that all you need to intercept a cordless
> phone call is another cordless phone?

True, but with the newer multi-channel, auto-select models, it is
somewhat difficult. I have a Panasonic KX-T3900 and an AT&T 5500 that
are frequently used simultaneously (the bases sit next to each other)
and they never, ever experience mutual interference. It is most tricky
to get one to "eavedrop" on the other.


        John Higdon         |   P. O. Box 7648   |   +1 408 723 1395
    john@bovine.ati.com     | San Jose, CA 95150 |       M o o !

Doug Faunt N6TQS 415-688-8269 <faunt@cisco.com> (08/17/90)

>By the time everyone gets their "protected" status, the only kind of
>receiver the public will be able to buy will be for broadcast
>transmissions. Judging from the state of broadcasting these days, it
>won't be long before interest wanes in these as well.

In Germany, the ICOM R1, which is a receiver with a range of 100kHz to
1300MHZ (in most places), is sold with a VERY restricted range, 13.95
to 14.5MHz, 28-29MHz, 144-146MHz, 430-440MHz, and 1240-1300MHz.  These
are basically some ham bands.  It's pretty clear that the Germans
don't want their citizens listening to anything but hams and
broadcasts.

"Lou Judice, 908-562-4103 17-Aug-1990 1103" <judice@sulaco.enet.dec.com> (08/17/90)

John Higdon asked if this sort of regulation isn't the province of the
FCC and not the states...

Well, in the wonderful Garden State (New Jersey), scanners, SW
receivers and many kinds of ham radio gear are illegal when used in or
near autos.  I know of several hams who have been arrested or
harrassed under this law (Public Law 1977). Currently a measure has
been passed in the State Senate to repeal the law, but it still needs
to pass the Assembly and be signed by the Governor. Some police groups
oppose it, though some police I know really don't care - since as you
say these laws (like ECPA) are impossible to enforce.

I suggest that before you folks in CA. end up like New Jerseyans with
a silly law on the books that you write, write, write. Trust me,
writing to legislators works!


ljj

lemke@apple.com> (08/18/90)

john@bovine.ati.com (John Higdon) writes:

>John R. Covert <covert@covert.enet.dec.com> writes:

>> The bill also bans manufacture, sale, and possession of any device
>> enabling the user to intercept such communications.  It provides for
>> penalties from one year in county jail to three years in state prison
>> with fines of up to $2,500.

>...what about continuously tuned radios?

>> Don't these people realize that all you need to intercept a cordless
>> phone call is another cordless phone?

Don't these people realize that there are many, many people who
already own scanners which can pick up most cordless phone frequencies
(usually around 49 MHz)?  Will that make the sale and possession of
scanners illegal as well?


Steve Lemke, Engineering Quality Assurance, Radius Inc., San Jose
Reply to: lemke@radius.com     (Note: NEW domain-style address!!)

wagner@utoday.com (Mitch Wagner) (08/20/90)

In article <11016@accuvax.nwu.edu> judice@sulaco.enet.dec.com (Lou
Judice, 908-562-4103 17-Aug-1990 1103) writes:

# Well, in the wonderful Garden State (New Jersey), scanners, SW
# receivers and many kinds of ham radio gear are illegal when used in or
# near autos.  I know of several hams who have been arrested or
# harrassed under this law (Public Law 1977). Currently a measure has
# been passed in the State Senate to repeal the law, but it still needs
# to pass the Assembly and be signed by the Governor. Some police groups
# oppose it, though some police I know really don't care - since as you
# say these laws (like ECPA) are impossible to enforce.

In New Jersey, effective early-1989 at least, you could use a scanner
in your car if you got the municipal police chief's permission. The
rationale was that crooks would use the scanner to find out where the
police were, and know to commit their crimes elsewhere.


Mitch Wagner

VOICE: 516/562-5758             GEnie: UNIX-TODAY
UUCP: wagner@utoday.com         ...uunet!utoday!wagner

jeff@uunet.uu.net> (09/01/90)

In article <11017@accuvax.nwu.edu> radius!lemke@apple.com (Steve
Lemke) writes:
X-Telecom-Digest: Volume 10, Issue 579, Message 4 of 9

>john@bovine.ati.com (John Higdon) writes:

>>John R. Covert <covert@covert.enet.dec.com> writes:

>>> The bill also bans manufacture, sale, and possession of any device
>>> enabling the user to intercept such communications.  It provides for
>>> penalties from one year in county jail to three years in state prison
>>> with fines of up to $2,500.

>>...what about continuously tuned radios?

>>> Don't these people realize that all you need to intercept a cordless
>>> phone call is another cordless phone?

>Don't these people realize that there are many, many people who
>already own scanners which can pick up most cordless phone frequencies
>(usually around 49 MHz)?  Will that make the sale and possession of
>scanners illegal as well?

I couldn't resist putting my $2 E-10 in.  This story is second hand.
Apparantly someone "overheard" drug deals on their cordless baby
monitor.  So they called the police.  The police showed up and checked
the neighbors, and sure enough, they found the dealer.  They arrested
him.  This happened a few years ago in Spokane, Washington.  I wonder
if the dealer went to jail.

If this incident happened in California today, and the person with the
baby monitor called the police, the baby monitor would be confiscated
and they would be arrested ;^).

I can't beleive California is gonna try to implement such a law.  What
a waste of taxpayer dollars.  Don't they realize that everyone
(including drug dealers) already know that you can monitor cordless
phone calls from another handset?  Does this mean that when my handset
rings and I pick it up only to find out that my neighbor got a call
and I now hear the conversation, that I must turn myself in with the
hope that I can get a light prison sentence because it wasn't
intentional?

Jeff Crilly (N6ZFX)   AMIX Corporation
2345 Yale Street      Palo Alto, CA  94306
jeff@amix.com, {uunet,sun}!markets!jeff

jeff@uunet.uu.net> (09/01/90)

In article <11018@accuvax.nwu.edu> faunt@cisco.com (Doug Faunt N6TQS
415-688-8269) writes:
X-Telecom-Digest: Volume 10, Issue 579, Message 5 of 9

>>By the time everyone gets their "protected" status, the only kind of
>>receiver the public will be able to buy will be for broadcast
>>transmissions. Judging from the state of broadcasting these days, it
>>won't be long before interest wanes in these as well.

>In Germany, the ICOM R1, which is a receiver with a range of 100kHz to
>1300MHZ (in most places), is sold with a VERY restricted range, 13.95
>to 14.5MHz, 28-29MHz, 144-146MHz, 430-440MHz, and 1240-1300MHz.  These
>are basically some ham bands.  It's pretty clear that the Germans
>don't want their citizens listening to anything but hams and
>broadcasts.

Because of "production and distribution problems" (ICOM's reason) you
can't even buy an R1 in the U.S. Some people argue that it ICOM is
holding back because of the 800 mhz coverage and legal hassles of
selling such a device that covers cellular frequencies.


Jeff Crilly (N6ZFX)   AMIX Corporation
2345 Yale Street      Palo Alto, CA  94306
jeff@amix.com, {uunet,sun}!markets!jeff